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Joined: April 24 2015
Location: Moscow
Status: Offline
Points: 94
Posted: April 28 2015 at 02:40
dr wu23 wrote:
windycrawford wrote:
I don't think, any of these two bands are prog-related. Queen is almost the definition of art-rock and 10cc is definitely in pop-rock department.
And I have to agree with you.....never thought either band was 'proggy' .
But then I don't think Zep or the Who are especially prog related either yet they are listed that way here.
Both bands had some nice tracks but if you made me sit down and listen to one of these bands for any length of time I would go with Queen.
While you can hardly find any pure prog albums/songs in LedZep catalogue, the band is certainly prog-related with its tricky arrangements, complex riffs and mystical lyricism. The Who, on the other hand, issued "Tommy" and "Quadrophenia" which are not less proggy than "The Wall" for instance.
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 20631
Posted: April 28 2015 at 09:07
windycrawford wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
windycrawford wrote:
I don't think, any of these two bands are prog-related. Queen is almost the definition of art-rock and 10cc is definitely in pop-rock department.
And I have to agree with you.....never thought either band was 'proggy' .
But then I don't think Zep or the Who are especially prog related either yet they are listed that way here.
Both bands had some nice tracks but if you made me sit down and listen to one of these bands for any length of time I would go with Queen.
While you can hardly find any pure prog albums/songs in LedZep catalogue, the band is certainly prog-related with its tricky arrangements, complex riffs and mystical lyricism. The Who, on the other hand, issued "Tommy" and "Quadrophenia" which are not less proggy than "The Wall" for instance.
And we are back to the old...what is prog discussion.
Regarding arrangements, riffs, and lyrics there are probably plenty of bands who aren't here as 'prog related' but should be based on that criteria. Zep is huge , famous, and well liked ,,,,prolly why they are here.
On the Who...Tommy does have some interesting bits here and there that cross over into prog at times but I don't hear this on Quad which has some orchestration (is that prog.?) But even so does that make what The Who did on those 2 albums prog..?
Floyd had many prog and of course space rock elements on many of their earlier albums and always had a history of expanding their musical ideas so I can see why The Wall is included in your comment but as you alluded there is plenty of regular rock on that one.
In the end it's matter of opinion....isn't it?
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: April 28 2015 at 10:01
dr wu23 wrote:
windycrawford wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
windycrawford wrote:
I don't think, any of these two bands are prog-related. Queen is almost the definition of art-rock and 10cc is definitely in pop-rock department.
And I have to agree with you.....never thought either band was 'proggy' .
But then I don't think Zep or the Who are especially prog related either yet they are listed that way here.
Both bands had some nice tracks but if you made me sit down and listen to one of these bands for any length of time I would go with Queen.
While you can hardly find any pure prog albums/songs in LedZep catalogue, the band is certainly prog-related with its tricky arrangements, complex riffs and mystical lyricism. The Who, on the other hand, issued "Tommy" and "Quadrophenia" which are not less proggy than "The Wall" for instance.
And we are back to the old...what is prog discussion.
Regarding arrangements, riffs, and lyrics there are probably plenty of bands who aren't here as 'prog related' but should be based on that criteria. Zep is huge , famous, and well liked ,,,,prolly why they are here.
On the Who...Tommy does have some interesting bits here and there that cross over into prog at times but I don't hear this on Quad which has some orchestration (is that prog.?) But even so does that make what The Who did on those 2 albums prog..?
Floyd had many prog and of course space rock elements on many of their earlier albums and always had a history of expanding their musical ideas so I can see why The Wall is included in your comment but as you alluded there is plenty of regular rock on that one.
In the end it's matter of opinion....isn't it?
Cupla things...
Proto Prog and Prog Related are not Prog.
The Who are in Proto-Prog and not Prog Related. The distinction is key otherwise we'd not have two distinctly separate categories. I've no real intention of launching into a defence of a band I don't like very much, or of their inclusion here or of PA's decision to have PR & PP categories at all. However. The main point is they don't have to have created a whole or partial Prog album or even a Prog song to be listed there in that category.
Prog Related is a mess, it always has been and it always will be - why it is a mess is to do with PA's murky history but in recent years the various Admin teams have worked to prevent it becoming even more of a mess, and that means being selective about who else gets added to the current list. In principle they could add hundreds of artists, especially if they blindly follow an IF X THEN Y criteria based on bands who are already listed, but that would result in a bigger PR section than the rest of the PA put together ... which would make PA little better than a second-rate RYM rather than a first-rate Prog site.
Joined: June 14 2007
Location: Near York UK
Status: Offline
Points: 7024
Posted: April 28 2015 at 14:34
windycrawford wrote:
dr wu23 wrote:
windycrawford wrote:
I don't think, any of these two bands are prog-related. Queen is almost the definition of art-rock and 10cc is definitely in pop-rock department.
And I have to agree with you.....never thought either band was 'proggy' .
But then I don't think Zep or the Who are especially prog related either yet they are listed that way here.
Both bands had some nice tracks but if you made me sit down and listen to one of these bands for any length of time I would go with Queen.
While you can hardly find any pure prog albums/songs in LedZep catalogue, the band is certainly prog-related with its tricky arrangements, complex riffs and mystical lyricism. The Who, on the other hand, issued "Tommy" and "Quadrophenia" which are not less proggy than "The Wall" for instance.
Sorry, but I was around in the 70s and 10CC were THE art rock band, and art rock was considered a key part of prog.
Listen to One Night in Paris: it and the whole Original Soundtrack album are both extremely progressive.
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Crossover & JR/F/Canterbury Teams
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: The Idiocracy
Status: Offline
Points: 5482
Posted: May 01 2015 at 09:12
Both bands released 4 excellent albums before turning toward pop drivel.
Although Queen had much more popular success after abandoning their early, art rock sound, they also became far too saccharine and mostly boring. 10cc made occasional attempts to return to the quirkiness of their early years, but mostly fell flat.
As for who was better, when evaluating the first four of each? Apples and oranges. I love them both.
Joined: April 30 2015
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 90
Posted: May 04 2015 at 11:24
If it wasn't for Sheet Music I'd probably vote Queen, but that one album is pretty much the most creative and brilliantly constructed pop album of the 70s for my money. Not really that fussed about any other 10cc albums although How Dare You has its moments. In fact Godley & Creme's "L" is probably closer to Sheet Music than any other album bearing the 10CC name.
10cc - genius; how they got people to buy their veiled humor and inside jokes wrapped around Beach Boys, doo-wop and good old rock n roll....genius.
Queen - genius; how they got people to buy their veiled humor and inside jokes wrapped around Sabbath, whimsical prog and good old rock n roll....genius.
Two bands seemingly very different but really cut from a similar jib. Tongues firmly in cheek, yet selling millions.....Genius.
I dig 10cc more....just more my style, but Queen is a gas, especially those first four albums.
Edited by Intruder - July 11 2015 at 13:18
I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
Joined: January 22 2013
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 1376
Posted: July 11 2015 at 13:35
Evolver wrote:
Both bands released 4 excellent albums before turning toward pop drivel.
Although Queen had much more popular success after abandoning their early, art rock sound, they also became far too saccharine and mostly boring. 10cc made occasional attempts to return to the quirkiness of their early years, but mostly fell flat.
As for who was better, when evaluating the first four of each? Apples and oranges. I love them both.
micky wrote:
THE WHO!!!!
This two answered for me
- From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
Nor would Freddie ever have sung, "I don't like cricket, I love it." Both bands ended on low notes, though Godley and Creme released some stuff that lives up to their 10cc roots.
Would love to hear an FM station play Un nuit en Paris and Bohemian Rhapsody back-to-back....probably hasn't been done since 1978, if ever.
Are either prog? When it's that much fun, who cares what you call it. BTW, I'd call it art rock, maybe even arty rock, but nobody would ever mistake either for Yes.
I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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dr wu23 wrote:
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