Libertarian Thread #2: We Shall Never Die!

I was thinking of something. I was reading somewhere and the typical phrase "he abused his liberty" appeared. I realized how, in my view, this is impossible. Liberty can't be abused. Abuse is the wrong or improper use of something. How can you wrongly use your liberty? That would depend on tbe judgment of a third person who decides what is wrong and what is not, but that leaves decisions in external arbitrary hands, therefore the only reasonable way to decide if something is wrong is by the individual. But if the individual thinks somethings is wrong and still does it, he implicitly is ignoring the wrong of his action, and he is then not abusing his liberty. Improper? The same, improper according to whom? Only the individual can, if we are to avoid arbitrary impositions. And if improperly using liberty is impossible, since the only proper use of liberty is actually using it, exercising it, standing up for it, doing whatever one wants.

When one's actions harm another's, are we "abusing our liberty" or are we just infriging other people's rights (among them liberty)? I think liberty can't be abused. In a different definition, abusing, causing harm, can't be done to liberty by using it. You abuse your wife, your dog, your neighbour. You abuse things and beings that are not you. Hell, in a way, you can abuse your body, since you're not in total control of it (try stopping your heart or your digestive processes just by mere will), but you can't abuse your liberty, since it's yours, it's the one thing you have control over, the one that actually allows you to make any other kind of decisions. That the outcome of your use of your liberty are bad or harmful to you or others is secondary; they are consequences which you will have to face. Even if you face a prohibition or a law that penalizes something, and you go ahead and do the unlawful action, you're not abusing your liberty, you're actually using it as it should be, to give you the power to decide the course of your actions, though in this case the chosen path is obviously the wrong one or the one that will lead you to face negative consequences or punishment.

The basic rights, life, property, liberty: can they be abused? I don't think so. But then again I talk a lot of nonsense and I want the opinions of those much more well-versed in these matters and who also can put things in a clearer way than my incongruent ramblings...

The T wrote: Interesting. Though I don't know why you assumed it was the tin foil hat the thing you were wearing that went away

I feared that was the thing that went away. I rarely can be found with pants and a shirt on.

The T wrote: Your words go beyond my recent grasp of your culture...

Signed by Sarge?  Noice

You were pretty much spot on actually. Just replace the tinfoil with this



stained black with dirt from playing horseshoes in it every other day in the summer.

The T wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Padraic wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Oh so people know tomorrow at 10:00 EST Ron Paul's first hearing as the chair of the monetary policy subcommittee will be on CSPAN. It should be interesting. His opening statement:  "As chair of the monetary policy subcommittee, I believe we need to eliminate monetary policy." To be met with uproarious applause by me. My old idea of you: semi naked on your boxers, applauding like crazy wearing a tin foil hat.

Wait, why did it change?

Equality 7-2521 wrote: Padraic wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Oh so people know tomorrow at 10:00 EST Ron Paul's first hearing as the chair of the monetary policy subcommittee will be on CSPAN. It should be interesting. His opening statement:  "As chair of the monetary policy subcommittee, I believe we need to eliminate monetary policy." To be met with uproarious applause by me.

My old idea of you: semi naked on your boxers, applauding like crazy wearing a tin foil hat.

Padraic wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Oh so people know tomorrow at 10:00 EST Ron Paul's first hearing as the chair of the monetary policy subcommittee will be on CSPAN. It should be interesting. His opening statement:  "As chair of the monetary policy subcommittee, I believe we need to eliminate monetary policy."

To be met with uproarious applause by me.

Equality 7-2521 wrote: Oh so people know tomorrow at 10:00 EST Ron Paul's first hearing as the chair of the monetary policy subcommittee will be on CSPAN. It should be interesting.

thellama73 wrote: Padraic wrote: This is great!  I'm on the road to being the only one in the country that's eligible to vote!   I think you've hit on a great idea,Pat. If we can convince everyone except us Libertarians to give up the vote, we'll be in business!

Hmmmm, I'm really liking the idea.