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Majikthise 
Forum Groupie
Joined: August 29 2010
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Points: 85
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 Posted: January 15 2011 at 06:14 |
 genesis_pig wrote:
I just heard few of their tracks (Air Born, Never let go, Breathless).. would like to get into the band a bit more..
What is the best album to start with?
Thanks.
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The debut. Excllent from start to finish. The other essential Camel albums are Moonmadness and Mirage (which contains Lady Fantasy, their best song). The Snow Goose is pretty good too.
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Mikeyg
Forum Newbie
Joined: May 05 2010
Location: Somerset, UK
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Points: 15
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 08:05 |
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I agree completely with Majikthise with his recomendations, the first album is brilliant the rest just got better, if you want to fish around a little try and get hold of a double album called 'Greasy Truckers Live at Dingwells' it has a camel track (one whole side) called 'Homage to the God of Light Revisited'. It was the track we always cried out for at every Camel club gig I attended.
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TODDLER
Forum Senior Member
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Joined: August 28 2009
Location: Vineland, N.J.
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 09:08 |
Mikeyg wrote:
I agree completely with Majikthise with his recomendations, the first album is brilliant the rest just got better, if you want to fish around a little try and get hold of a double album called 'Greasy Truckers Live at Dingwells' it has a camel track (one whole side) called 'Homage to the God of Light Revisited'. It was the track we always cried out for at every Camel club gig I attended. |
Only the first Greasy Truckers was officially released on disc. I transfered the "Dingwells" to disc. Hopefully someone will release it in the near future. I have a bunch of photographs autographed by Andy Latimer and post cards from the band which I believe Colin sent. A few letters from Latimer. This was right around the time he moved to Mount View and opened Camel Productions. I have it packed away in boxes.
Long ago I was getting drunk at a Folk festival with this English lady who was about the size of the late John Candy. She was telling me that during her college days Camel would set up on the campus and play a concert for the students. She then asked me if the band went over in America and we both laughed about the annoying Max Hole lawsuit with the band. We thought about it and later decided that it was unjust for the band not to receive the proper backing. They did tour the U.S. with Wishbone Ash but needed more promotion. "Moonmadness" is the perfect Camel effort for me because the music had developed a bit...... yet made a transition somehow. It contained the style on Mirage and Snowgoose but with fresh ideas.
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Theriver
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 13 2010
Location: Lisbon Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 181
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 09:12 |
I don't think Camel is under rated. I think if they never made it to the top of the prog 1st division is because they never had good vocals. Latimer is at best average and lyrics teenage pot smoker level.
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Prog Geo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 09 2010
Location: Athens (Greece)
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 09:27 |
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Theriver,don't forget Richard Sinclair.
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Sonorous Meal show every Sunday at 20:00 (greek time) on http://www.justincaseradio.com
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Mikeyg
Forum Newbie
Joined: May 05 2010
Location: Somerset, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 15
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 10:01 |
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Hi TODDLER...do you know if Homage is available other than Greasy Truckers on LP I have been meaning to burn it to CD, if a live version is available then tell me about it. I was a student at UCL when i first came across Camel and they remain in my heart to this day and to Theriver....you dont know what you are talking about....Latimers vocals were spot on and besides his prowess was in his work on his Gibson....did you ever see Camel Theriver? And to respond to CAPRICORNS...no one could forget Richard Sinclair,,,I was lucky to be born in the right place at the right time, I grew up with the Canterbury scene and remember Caravan and Hatfield. It seems like yesterday!
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TODDLER
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Joined: August 28 2009
Location: Vineland, N.J.
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Posted: January 15 2011 at 22:57 |
Mikeyg wrote:
Hi TODDLER...do you know if Homage is available other than Greasy Truckers on LP I have been meaning to burn it to CD, if a live version is available then tell me about it. I was a student at UCL when i first came across Camel and they remain in my heart to this day and to Theriver....you dont know what you are talking about....Latimers vocals were spot on and besides his prowess was in his work on his Gibson....did you ever see Camel Theriver? And to respond to CAPRICORNS...no one could forget Richard Sinclair,,,I was lucky to be born in the right place at the right time, I grew up with the Canterbury scene and remember Caravan and Hatfield. It seems like yesterday! |
The only way I know of obtaining a another version of "Homage" would be to purchase Camel-On the Road 72'. Which you can purchase from Greg Walker on Synphonic Music or surf Amazon for a used copy. It's taken from the tour they did with Wishbone Ash. The bonus tracks from Wishbone Ash "Argus" , originally derived from a 70's EP. are from the same tour and I burned these tracks in sequence with the Camel 72' to get the gist of the tour. Together they arrive with an impact of high energy performances.
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akajazzman
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 13 2009
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 124
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Posted: January 16 2011 at 02:26 |
Simple question, and a correct question. I think Camel is in fact the most underrated of the 70s Prog bands. All of the Big Six got a ton or at least a fair amount of attention, and Camel got lost in the dust. They're just as great. Thankfully, amongst us Progsters they get a fair amount of retro respect. And the fantastic new book on Prog, "Mountains Come Out of the Sky" does a whole chapter on Camel. Much deserved.
2nd and 3rd most underrated would be Caravan and Gong.
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Mikeyg
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Joined: May 05 2010
Location: Somerset, UK
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Points: 15
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Posted: January 16 2011 at 10:54 |
Thank you TODDLER I will follow your advice and see if I can get a copy...you spoke or Wishbone Ash...Saw them just before Christmas at a place called The Honiton Motel, its in Devon...South West England, they played a great set and in an instant I was 20 years old again, lstening to Lady Fantasy as I write, the memories of seeing them play at the Marquee Club just come flooding back. Why does everything have to change?
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resurrection
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 08 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 254
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Posted: January 23 2011 at 01:10 |
sohraab wrote:
from the beautifully floating flute tones in `Spirit Of The Water` to harsh symphonic moments of `Pressure`,
from the simple structured but catchy `Sanctuary` to massive epic `A Nod And A Wink`, Camel, in my opinion, has been a significant point in prog-rock history. Andrew Latimer has always carried the weight of his own created unique sound on his shoulders alone, trying to provide a stable condition for the band, unfortunately unsuccessful most of the times.
Amazingly he composes such a brilliant work `A Nod and a Wink` when everyone think that Camel sound is ended after Rajaz. a beautifully composed and well structured album which contains almost all of the possible moods and elements of Progressive music in a quite experienced way, of course expected by Latimer.
of course most of us know camel today and appreciate it, but how come Camel was so obscured and underrated compared at 70`s compared to other UK prog rockers, this is the question that i always have in mind. whether my statement is right or wrong, Hope to be a good discussion about the band.  |
Personally, it gives me the hump to see Camel rated at all. Very second division I'd say.
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AllP0werToSlaves
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 29 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 249
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Posted: January 23 2011 at 17:37 |
I can understand where people are coming from with the "second division" terminology, but why should the band be stigmatized and labeled based upon their popularity, when (IMHO) their music was even better than some of the top tier acts? Skill has nothing to do with how well a record sells, neither does song writing. Promotion and important people (and I am aware that these are not the only factors) got bands like Pink Floyd and Yes to the top, and without those elements they'd be in the same boat as Camel, and we'd all be discussing "underrated" gems like "Close To The Edge" and "Animals".
It seems a lot of people just assume that the music sold itself, and bands like Camel just weren't "good enough" to hang with the "big boys" of prog when this couldn't be further to the truth. Art, in any form, is completely subjective. Despite the album sales and popularity, I wouldn't objectively consider Pink Floyd a better band, no matter how much everyone would argue that they are the best band in the universe. This of course means Camel would be second tier relative to the popularity of other bands in the genre, not because of the quality of the music.
Keep in mind this is of course entirely personal opinion, as it should be with everything artistic. There is no right or wrong, only personal preference!
This was not aimed in defense at anyone, just an honest observation from a Camel fan!
Edited by AllP0werToSlaves - January 23 2011 at 21:01
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VelBG
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Joined: August 13 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 26
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Posted: January 24 2011 at 18:10 |
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If a band's popularity is to reflect the quality of their sound, then yes, they are vastly underrated. However, it is quite obvious that there is no relation between the two, and the popularity of one band is a mixture of factors, including luck. Hence, I'd rather appreciate what Camel have done over the years than whine how unpopular they were. Hell, I'd even go as far as saying they made their best albums only in the past decade. Rajaz and A Nod and a Wink are as good as they get. =)
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JeanFrame
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 01 2010
Location: London, England
Status: Offline
Points: 195
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Posted: January 26 2011 at 06:42 |
AllP0werToSlaves wrote:
I can understand where people are coming from with the "second division" terminology, but why should the band be stigmatized and labeled based upon their popularity, when (IMHO) their music was even better than some of the top tier acts? Skill has nothing to do with how well a record sells, neither does song writing. Promotion and important people (and I am aware that these are not the only factors) got bands like Pink Floyd and Yes to the top, and without those elements they'd be in the same boat as Camel, and we'd all be discussing "underrated" gems like "Close To The Edge" and "Animals".
It seems a lot of people just assume that the music sold itself, and bands like Camel just weren't "good enough" to hang with the "big boys" of prog when this couldn't be further to the truth. Art, in any form, is completely subjective. Despite the album sales and popularity, I wouldn't objectively consider Pink Floyd a better band, no matter how much everyone would argue that they are the best band in the universe. This of course means Camel would be second tier relative to the popularity of other bands in the genre, not because of the quality of the music.
Keep in mind this is of course entirely personal opinion, as it should be with everything artistic. There is no right or wrong, only personal preference!
This was not aimed in defense at anyone, just an honest observation from a Camel fan!
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I also think they are second division, but in terms of the artistic quality. I agree totally with these comments about the difference in artistic and commercial judgements. But Camel, though definitely a fine band, are in my opinion, not as artistically successful as many other bands, hence second division - But surely that is no disgrace?
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iluvmarillion
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 09 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 3242
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Posted: January 26 2011 at 22:52 |
VelBG wrote:
If a band's popularity is to reflect the quality of their sound, then yes, they are vastly underrated. However, it is quite obvious that there is no relation between the two, and the popularity of one band is a mixture of factors, including luck. Hence, I'd rather appreciate what Camel have done over the years than whine how unpopular they were. Hell, I'd even go as far as saying they made their best albums only in the past decade. Rajaz and A Nod and a Wink are as good as they get. =)
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I'd go further and say that a couple of albums Camel made in the 80's (Nude and Stationary Traveler) are better than what the majors were doing in the 80's (Genesis, Yes and Floyd). However the best of Camel albums from the 70's (Mirage, Snow goose and Moon Madness) don't quite match it with the classic albums (SEBTP, DSOTM, WYWH, CTTE, Fragile).
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AllP0werToSlaves
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 29 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 249
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Posted: January 26 2011 at 22:56 |
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I think it's a slightly different direction though; Camel has such a mellow vibe much like Pink Floyd, but then it also has the majestic feeling of Yes on stuff like "The Snow Goose", so I always viewed it as a best-of-both-worlds type deal. Yes, the vocals on "Mirage" are a little iffy, but I honestly feel like they do add to the albums overall sound. I'm a huge Yes fan and I like my prog epic, and Camel gave that to me with a little more of a rock background (early stuff).
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Junges
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Joined: February 19 2006
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 645
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Posted: January 27 2011 at 07:48 |
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Although I love Camel and it's probably my favorite Symphonic band, I can't say they are underrated.
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iluvmarillion
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 09 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 3242
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Posted: January 27 2011 at 23:42 |
AllP0werToSlaves wrote:
I think it's a slightly different direction though; Camel has such a mellow vibe much like Pink Floyd, but then it also has the majestic feeling of Yes on stuff like "The Snow Goose", so I always viewed it as a best-of-both-worlds type deal. Yes, the vocals on "Mirage" are a little iffy, but I honestly feel like they do add to the albums overall sound. I'm a huge Yes fan and I like my prog epic, and Camel gave that to me with a little more of a rock background (early stuff). |
They picked up better vocals with the addition of Richard Sinclair for the Breathless album, yet few people here at PA regard the Breathless album very highly. Both Breathless and ICSYHFH get complaints about the vocals, so people seem to prefer the more laid back vocals from the Mirage and Moon Madness albums.
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topographicbroadways
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 20 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 5575
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Posted: February 14 2011 at 08:13 |
I've just been getting back into this amazing band, underrated or not Camel were one of the greats and definitely on the same level with Yes and Genesis. Andy Latimer is a guitar legend and Peter Bardens one of the finest keyboardists there ever was. i've listened to A Live Record and The Snow Goose about 5 times this week!
And wow i never knew Richard Sinclair was briefly a member, one of my favourite bassists of all time
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TODDLER
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: August 28 2009
Location: Vineland, N.J.
Status: Offline
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Posted: February 14 2011 at 08:39 |
Mikeyg wrote:
Thank you TODDLER I will follow your advice and see if I can get a copy...you spoke or Wishbone Ash...Saw them just before Christmas at a place called The Honiton Motel, its in Devon...South West England, they played a great set and in an instant I was 20 years old again, lstening to Lady Fantasy as I write, the memories of seeing them play at the Marquee Club just come flooding back. Why does everything have to change? |
Tell me about it! I was amazed at the way Andy Powell, Ted Turner, and Andy Latimer played guitar. I was completely blown away by the harmony leads in Wishbone Ash and so was Ritchie Blackmore! He loved the band and put a word in for them. Andy Latimer is another fine guitarist. The way he plays guitar on the "Pressure Points" live DVD wow! These guys had something special going for them other than just guitar playing though. They are legends to me.
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Camel: the most underrated prog band at 70`s?
