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O666 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 20 2009
Location: TEHRAN-IRAN
Status: Offline
Points: 2619
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 Posted: October 13 2010 at 07:40 |
Thanks!!! 
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 10:55 |
 Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Snow Dog wrote:
I think you ARE wrong...they are a very popular band. maybe in the seventies they weren't Premier league but they sure are popular now. |
yes, but my discussion is about the situation of the band at 70`s prog society of UK and world in general. wondering how they WERE so underrated. maybe i should change the post text a little!
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They were not underrated in the 1970s - they never had "hit" albums like Floyd, Yes or Genesis, but for an essentially instrumental band they sold very well and made the UK top 40 charts 5 times:
| Position |
Artist |
Title |
Date |
Details |
| 22 |
Camel |
The Snow Goose |
May 1975 |
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| 15 |
Camel |
Moon Madness |
Apr 1976 |
|
| 20 |
Camel |
Rain Dances |
Sep 1977 |
|
| 26 |
Camel |
Breathless |
Oct 1978 |
|
| 34 |
Camel |
Nude |
Jan 1981 |
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Genesis's Trespass and Nursery Cryme didn't chart at all when they were originally released. Van Der Graaf Generator never had an album in the top 40, nor did Gong, Gentle Giant or Caravan.
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now i really start to think that prog music of 70`s was written to be discovered 30 years later... people of that period were normally listening to Abba, Bonny M or stuff like this. although i respect such pop pioneers but it`s really sad if at that golden age people have not been used to prog music as much as they should be. after all i don know exactly cuz at that time i was not still born... 
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 11:08 |
sohraab wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Snow Dog wrote:
I think you ARE wrong...they are a very popular band. maybe in the seventies they weren't Premier league but they sure are popular now. |
yes, but my discussion is about the situation of the band at 70`s prog society of UK and world in general. wondering how they WERE so underrated. maybe i should change the post text a little!
|
They were not underrated in the 1970s - they never had "hit" albums like Floyd, Yes or Genesis, but for an essentially instrumental band they sold very well and made the UK top 40 charts 5 times:
| Position |
Artist |
Title |
Date |
Details |
| 22 |
Camel |
The Snow Goose |
May 1975 |
|
| 15 |
Camel |
Moon Madness |
Apr 1976 |
|
| 20 |
Camel |
Rain Dances |
Sep 1977 |
|
| 26 |
Camel |
Breathless |
Oct 1978 |
|
| 34 |
Camel |
Nude |
Jan 1981 |
|
Genesis's Trespass and Nursery Cryme didn't chart at all when they were originally released. Van Der Graaf Generator never had an album in the top 40, nor did Gong, Gentle Giant or Caravan.
|
now i really start to think that prog music of 70`s was written to be discovered 30 years later... people of that period were normally listening to Abba, Bonny M or stuff like this. although i respect such pop pioneers but it`s really sad if at that golden age people have not been used to prog music as much as they should be. after all i don know exactly cuz at that time i was not still born...
|
Not all teenagers today listen to Beyonce and Lady Gagagah - many listen to Florence & the Machine, Bring Me The Horizon, Stone Sour and The XX - so it was in the 70s - not all teenagers listened to Abba and Bonny M - many (most) of us listened to Prog and Rock.
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What?
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
|
Posted: October 13 2010 at 11:19 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Snow Dog wrote:
I think you ARE wrong...they are a very popular band. maybe in the seventies they weren't Premier league but they sure are popular now. |
yes, but my discussion is about the situation of the band at 70`s prog society of UK and world in general. wondering how they WERE so underrated. maybe i should change the post text a little!
|
They were not underrated in the 1970s - they never had "hit" albums like Floyd, Yes or Genesis, but for an essentially instrumental band they sold very well and made the UK top 40 charts 5 times:
| Position |
Artist |
Title |
Date |
Details |
| 22 |
Camel |
The Snow Goose |
May 1975 |
|
| 15 |
Camel |
Moon Madness |
Apr 1976 |
|
| 20 |
Camel |
Rain Dances |
Sep 1977 |
|
| 26 |
Camel |
Breathless |
Oct 1978 |
|
| 34 |
Camel |
Nude |
Jan 1981 |
|
Genesis's Trespass and Nursery Cryme didn't chart at all when they were originally released. Van Der Graaf Generator never had an album in the top 40, nor did Gong, Gentle Giant or Caravan.
|
now i really start to think that prog music of 70`s was written to be discovered 30 years later... people of that period were normally listening to Abba, Bonny M or stuff like this. although i respect such pop pioneers but it`s really sad if at that golden age people have not been used to prog music as much as they should be. after all i don know exactly cuz at that time i was not still born...
|
Not all teenagers today listen to Beyonce and Lady Gagagah - many listen to Florence & the Machine, Bring Me The Horizon, Stone Sour and The XX - so it was in the 70s - not all teenagers listened to Abba and Bonny M - many (most) of us listened to Prog and Rock. |
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!! i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 12:26 |
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
|
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great.
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What?
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
Status: Offline
Points: 32995
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 12:28 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
|
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
yep...and Boney M sucked big time!
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 12:42 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
|
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
i know that from ur point of view it was not that great since u are from 70`s! u r grown up with good rock music and so it`s pretty normal that u have not liked the pop music of that time... but what about our age? we miss many things in our life in this boring technological era... specially good music. what can we be proud of compared to PF, Eloy, JT and other giants of your age? DT, Por. Tree? opeth?! i love them all but to be honest they are nothing comparing to 70`s bands. so it`s the only feeling that all of the people of my age have (i think). missing good music... we just born 30 years late. and i don think you can feel the way that we feel. they were almost simply accessible for you but for us? everyday i`m waiting for the death report of another monster... after Rick Wright i became sick as hell... i`v nightmare: death of Dave Gilmour before i see him on stage... its only the matter of difference between ages... i can not explain it here. its to broad...
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
Status: Offline
Points: 10618
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:07 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer... |
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication.
Edited by Easy Money - October 13 2010 at 13:08
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:22 |
Easy Money wrote:
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication. |
I WASN'T there, but this is my line of argument too. There doesn't seem to be any Stevie Wonder or Michael Jackson like figure today in the pop scene, no artist who's both THAT popular and THAT sophisticated. So, some things must have changed from then to now.
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:26 |
sohraab wrote:
i know that from ur point of view it was not that great since u are from 70`s! u r grown up with good rock music and so it`s pretty normal that u have not liked the pop music of that time... but what about our age? we miss many things in our life in this boring technological era... specially good music. what can we be proud of compared to PF, Eloy, JT and other giants of your age? DT, Por. Tree? opeth?! i love them all but to be honest they are nothing comparing to 70`s bands. |
Pah! I've been listening to "new" music every week for the past 50+ years and at no point have I every thought "Oh dear, there just isn't any great music being made today" even through the 80s and 90s there was some superb music being made that was every bit as great as the stuff we heard in the 70s. Opeth are a bloody fantastic band and have been one of my favourite bands since the late 90s - they are easily "as good" as any of the 70s icons you venerate. Sure last Friday I was at an Enid gig with 100s of other grey-hairs like myself reliving 1977 like it was yesterday while trying to squeeze into 35 year-old T-Shirts like we were still 19 again, but another week and I could be at a Coheed & Cambria gig or a Porcupine Tree gig - it makes no difference to me when it was made as long as it's great music, which it is. My favourite albums at the moment are Biffy Clyro's Only Revolutions and Pendulum's Immersions - the best album I've heard this year is The Way Of The ORwarriOR by Orphaned Land. Great music is still being made. Certainly they will never topple Meddle and Dark Side Of The Moon from the top of my personal list of great albums, but that's because they were the soundtrack to my life, just as Peter Gabriel, VdGG, Ultravox, Bauhaus, Fields Of The Nephilim and Muse are.
sohraab wrote:
so it`s the only feeling that all of the people of my age have (i think). missing good music... we just born 30 years late. and i don think you can feel the way that we feel. |
Pah! (again) - You have the advantage of not having to listen to all the also-rans and nearly made-its and all the dire support bands that no one has heard of since that we listened to in the 1970s - you can cherry-pick the good stuff. The music isn't lost - you canstill hear it.
sohraab wrote:
they were almost simply accessible for you but for us? everyday i`m waiting for the death report of another monster... after Rick Wright i became sick as hell... i`v nightmare: death of Dave Gilmour before i see him on stage... its only the matter of difference between ages... i can not explain it here. its to broad...
|
Pah! Sure you can't see those gigs, but neither can I - even though I have been to hundreds of gigs, there are still loads of people from that era I've never seen play live like Yes and Jethro Tull. But time is against me too - I may not live long enough to see some of today's rising stars - at least you have that advantage over me. 
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What?
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:28 |
Easy Money wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer... |
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication. |
i tell u John. i think even the definition and classification of music genres changes by the time. Simon & Garfunkel and Paul Simon are not considered pop for our age. cuz the things that we`v grown up as the pop music are a way more simple than the pop of your age. this, changes the definition and characterization of pop music for us. so that even pop music of your age is kinda different for us... and the sad thing is that, it becomes worse day by day... we r almost losing every thing... am i too pessimist?! but i really feel like it...
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:34 |
sohraab wrote:
so that even pop music of your age is kinda different for us... and the sad thing is that, it becomes worse day by day... we r almost losing every thing...
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Not really. Tori Amos is un-simple enough to have gotten into the Prog Archives, for instance. There is good music but, to address my own question above, audiences have become too scattered and fragmented. I would hate to make a strawman assumption, but I THINK audiences these days are very close minded, obsessively in pursuit of very narrow musical horizons and not much interested in musicality. That is probably what drives so much fragmentation in the music scene. If everybody is interested mainly in great melodies and chord progressions, the musician's job becomes simpler, right? They didn't call Stevie Wonder too complex or artsy in the 70s.
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
Status: Offline
Points: 10618
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:35 |
sohraab wrote:
Easy Money wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer... |
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication. |
i tell u John. i think even the definition and classification of music genres changes by the time. Simon & Garfunkel and Paul Simon are not considered pop for our age. cuz the things that we`v grown up as the pop music are a way more simple than the pop of your age. this, changes the definition and characterization of pop music for us. so that even pop music of your age is kinda different for us... and the sad thing is that, it becomes worse day by day... we r almost losing every thing... am i too pessimist?!but i really feel like it... |
I don't think its that bad Sohrab, pop may have declined some, but I think there is all kind of interesting development in electronica, metal, nu jazz. post rock, dub. I'm an old fart, but i am always interested in new music that is coming out. I don't feel any despair over today's music, but I do miss really sophisticated pop. These days you have Alicia keys and Jill Scott, but its not quite as good.
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:49 |
Easy Money wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Easy Money wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer... |
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication. |
i tell u John. i think even the definition and classification of music genres changes by the time. Simon & Garfunkel and Paul Simon are not considered pop for our age. cuz the things that we`v grown up as the pop music are a way more simple than the pop of your age. this, changes the definition and characterization of pop music for us. so that even pop music of your age is kinda different for us... and the sad thing is that, it becomes worse day by day... we r almost losing every thing... am i too pessimist?!but i really feel like it... |
I don't think its that bad Sohrab, pop may have declined some, but I think there is all kind of interesting development in electronica, metal, nu jazz. post rock, dub. I'm an old fart, but i am always interested in new music that is coming out. I don't feel any despair over today's music, but I do miss really sophisticated pop. These days you have Alicia keys and Jill Scott, but its not quite as good. |
o nooooooooooooo!!! plz don`t tell me u go for Alicia keys! yes of course u r right. i listen to new electronics like Schiller as an example that i love, to Norah Jones as a nice pop-jazz or even some listenable Trance music... but something is missing believe me... i don know if u were listening to 40`s 50`s music when u were younger, feeling the same way...
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:51 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
i know that from ur point of view it was not that great since u are from 70`s! u r grown up with good rock music and so it`s pretty normal that u have not liked the pop music of that time... but what about our age? we miss many things in our life in this boring technological era... specially good music. what can we be proud of compared to PF, Eloy, JT and other giants of your age? DT, Por. Tree? opeth?! i love them all but to be honest they are nothing comparing to 70`s bands. |
Pah! I've been listening to "new" music every week for the past 50+ years and at no point have I every thought "Oh dear, there just isn't any great music being made today" even through the 80s and 90s there was some superb music being made that was every bit as great as the stuff we heard in the 70s. Opeth are a bloody fantastic band and have been one of my favourite bands since the late 90s - they are easily "as good" as any of the 70s icons you venerate. Sure last Friday I was at an Enid gig with 100s of other grey-hairs like myself reliving 1977 like it was yesterday while trying to squeeze into 35 year-old T-Shirts like we were still 19 again, but another week and I could be at a Coheed & Cambria gig or a Porcupine Tree gig - it makes no difference to me when it was made as long as it's great music, which it is. My favourite albums at the moment are Biffy Clyro's Only Revolutions and Pendulum's Immersions - the best album I've heard this year is The Way Of The ORwarriOR by Orphaned Land. Great music is still being made. Certainly they will never topple Meddle and Dark Side Of The Moon from the top of my personal list of great albums, but that's because they were the soundtrack to my life, just as Peter Gabriel, VdGG, Ultravox, Bauhaus, Fields Of The Nephilim and Muse are.
sohraab wrote:
so it`s the only feeling that all of the people of my age have (i think). missing good music... we just born 30 years late. and i don think you can feel the way that we feel. |
Pah! (again) - You have the advantage of not having to listen to all the also-rans and nearly made-its and all the dire support bands that no one has heard of since that we listened to in the 1970s - you can cherry-pick the good stuff. The music isn't lost - you canstill hear it.
sohraab wrote:
they were almost simply accessible for you but for us? everyday i`m waiting for the death report of another monster... after Rick Wright i became sick as hell... i`v nightmare: death of Dave Gilmour before i see him on stage... its only the matter of difference between ages... i can not explain it here. its to broad...
|
Pah! Sure you can't see those gigs, but neither can I - even though I have been to hundreds of gigs, there are still loads of people from that era I've never seen play live like Yes and Jethro Tull. But time is against me too - I may not live long enough to see some of today's rising stars - at least you have that advantage over me. |
i think i almost got u, of course with some disagreements... but i`m sure i`m enough with Pahs!!! 
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:54 |
rogerthat wrote:
sohraab wrote:
so that even pop music of your age is kinda different for us... and the sad thing is that, it becomes worse day by day... we r almost losing every thing...
|
Not really. Tori Amos is un-simple enough to have gotten into the Prog Archives, for instance. There is good music but, to address my own question above, audiences have become too scattered and fragmented. I would hate to make a strawman assumption, but I THINK audiences these days are very close minded, obsessively in pursuit of very narrow musical horizons and not much interested in musicality. That is probably what drives so much fragmentation in the music scene. If everybody is interested mainly in great melodies and chord progressions, the musician's job becomes simpler, right? They didn't call Stevie Wonder too complex or artsy in the 70s. |
most of them can not be more simple than they r now even if they try! really.
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lazland
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13627
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 13:55 |
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
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I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
So was I, and there haven't been many truer posts made on the forum.
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 14:49 |
Easy Money wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer... |
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
I was there too, I think there is some good music today, but I don't think I hear the kind of developed pop music today that you might have heard in the early to mid 70s. I'm thinking of artists like Simon & Garfunkel, Paul Simon, EW&F, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Dionne Warwick or Michael Jackson. I don't hear much pop music today that has that same kind of artistic sophistication. |
I'll see your Paul Simon & Garfunkle Art, EN&T, Wonder, Gaye, Warwick and Jackson and raise you Christie, Tony Orlando and Dawn, New Seekers, Lieutenant Pigeon, Mungo Jerry, Paper Lace, Bay City Rollers, Arrows, The Tams, Middle Of The Road, Donny Osmond, Little Jimmy Ozymand(ias king of kings look upon my works ye Mighty and Despair), David Soul, David Cassidy, Peters & Lee, Rubettes, Brotherhood of Man, John Travolta & Olivia Neutron Bomb, Mouth & MacNeal, Hot Butter, First Choice, Carl Douglas, Shirley & Company, Lynsey DePaul, Ace, Pilot, Sailor, 5000 volts, 100 tons and a Feather, (and all the Jonathan King creations bar one), Rick Dee's and his cast of Idiots, Smokie, (Lord) David Dundas, Meri Wilson, The Floaters, Tuxedo Junction, Manhatten Transfer... (anyway, your list is all 60s artists  )
Anyway, I get your point, but I think there is modern talent that is putting sophistication and cleverness into pop music but is being overshadowed by the dire regurgitated urban-pop and <<insert you country here>>'s got (no)talent outpourings (which are no different to what we had to endure in the 70s) and avoiding the dross that was around in the 70s (all the artists I listed had big hits - think of all the other's that didn't - for every one-hit-wonder there were hundreds of dire no-hit-blunders that fell by the wayside).
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What?
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40footwolf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 08 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 651
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 14:50 |
sohraab wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
|
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
i know that from ur point of view it was not that great since u are from 70`s! u r grown up with good rock music and so it`s pretty normal that u have not liked the pop music of that time... but what about our age? we miss many things in our life in this boring technological era... specially good music. what can we be proud of compared to PF, Eloy, JT and other giants of your age? DT, Por. Tree? opeth?! i love them all but to be honest they are nothing comparing to 70`s bands.
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If you're talking about prog in general, then yeah, the quality has taken a big nosedive. But if you're saying there are no current bands at ALL that compete with '70s giants, let me point you towards...
- Godspeed You! Black Emperor
- Hella
- The Flaming Lips
- Battles
- Modest Mouse
- Spoon
- Mastodon
- Boris
- Animal Collective
- Bjork
- Broken Social Scene
- The Mars Volta
- Cynic
- Tool
- The Knife
- High on Fire
- Koenjihyakkei
- LCD Sound System
- Lightning Bolt
- Los Campesions!
- M83
- Massive Attack
- The Mountain Goats
- The National
- Neutral Milk Hotel
- Queens of the Stone Age
- Radiohead
- School of Seven Bells
- Sigur Ros
- The Sword
- These New Puritans
- Venetian Snares
- White Rabbits
- Wolf Parade
- Young Knives
- Zoe Keating
There is MORE than enough phenomenal music out there, you just have to know where to look.
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Heaven's made a cesspool of us all.
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sohraab
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 09 2010
Location: Tehran, Iran
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Posted: October 13 2010 at 15:07 |
40footwolf wrote:
sohraab wrote:
Dean wrote:
sohraab wrote:
and the point is that even pop music at that period was far better than today`s. Abba and Bonny M are deserved to be listened (as i listen to them some times!) but LADY GAGA!!! NO WAY!!!
i call 70`s the golden age. not just music but as i mentioned, also theater, cinema, philosophy and even sport was at its peak at that time (Look back at football world cup 1970, its unrepeatable) it`s about 2 years that i`m preparing the material for a book titled: Golden 70`s. hopefully will be finished at next summer...
|
I think you are wrong - the pop music of then was just as bad and just as good as the pop music of today and I don't think a great deal has changed on that score. I think nostalgia, and especially 1970s nostalgia is viewed through rose-tinted glasses - we only remember the really good stuff and the really bad stuff - it's the mediocre that describes an era and much of the 1970s was awfully, forgettably average.
I was there, it wasn't that great. |
i know that from ur point of view it was not that great since u are from 70`s! u r grown up with good rock music and so it`s pretty normal that u have not liked the pop music of that time... but what about our age? we miss many things in our life in this boring technological era... specially good music. what can we be proud of compared to PF, Eloy, JT and other giants of your age? DT, Por. Tree? opeth?! i love them all but to be honest they are nothing comparing to 70`s bands.
|
If you're talking about prog in general, then yeah, the quality has taken a big nosedive. But if you're saying there are no current bands at ALL that compete with '70s giants, let me point you towards...
- Godspeed You! Black Emperor
- Hella
- The Flaming Lips
- Battles
- Modest Mouse
- Spoon
- Mastodon
- Boris
- Animal Collective
- Bjork
- Broken Social Scene
- The Mars Volta
- Cynic
- Tool
- The Knife
- High on Fire
- Koenjihyakkei
- LCD Sound System
- Lightning Bolt
- Los Campesions!
- M83
- Massive Attack
- The Mountain Goats
- The National
- Neutral Milk Hotel
- Queens of the Stone Age
- Radiohead
- School of Seven Bells
- Sigur Ros
- The Sword
- These New Puritans
- Venetian Snares
- White Rabbits
- Wolf Parade
- Young Knives
- Zoe Keating
There is MORE than enough phenomenal music out there, you just have to know where to look. |
i agree with u that there r some good stuff today. but compete with 70`s?! no way for me... and at this point, the list that u have provided here have some problems. first, it`s ur private taste but not a generally accepted good music. say, i really don`t find anything in radiohead. they r just a commercial band to me with a music below average standards... also with mastodon... second some of them are not prog at all and for me, just popy again radiohead... so i think it`s better to be careful when we use terms like PHENOMENAL. cuz such terms do not include solid concepts but relative ones. and after all, i love Bjork! but she is not progy at all!
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Camel: the most underrated prog band at 70`s?
