The Tech/Extreme Prog metal appreciation

Henry Plainview wrote: Evolutionary_Sleeper wrote: Jake Kobrin wrote: It depends what DSO album you're talking about, I guess. SMRC is definitely black metal, while anything Kenose or further are more avant-tech-blackened-death... I think they're talking about 2 different bands without realizing it. Deathspell Omega and Diablo Swing Orchestra. Oh wait, avalanche was talking about Deathspell Omega too? Hahaha! This is one of the funnier things that's happened to me lately. I thought that Diablo was implied by mentioning Sing-A-Long Songs for the Damned and Delirious!   Now I can see why you were so upset! :P Deathspell Omega are definately black metal.

That would explain everything. Because Diablo Swing Orchestra clearly isn't black metal while Deathspell Omega certainly is.


Edited by Evolutionary_Sleeper - December 20 2009 at 20:34

you were confused?  apparently, so was I.... boy do I feel like a douche! 

so back on topic, (tech metal) check out the band Beheaded Zombie "happiness for all".  they have some interesting mutating riffage, and nice bass work.  an interesting find for sure.

Also Borgia "ecclesia" is interesting thrashy, sort of Deathspell Omega clone stuff, that is original enough to warrant a listen. 

New Psychofagist is out and is a curious find:

http://www.myspace.com/psychofagist


on a slightly aberrant note, the new Thee Maldoror Kollective (need the needle) is a masterpiece of epic, schizo, avant (yep, it's a tag), wide reaching album that is very nearly the next incarnation of Ulver.  f**king astounding album.  A gem for '09...

http://www.myspace.com/jailhousedog

(I know they don't qualify as tech metal, but they sure are fine to these ears)

Henry Plainview wrote: I will readily concede that black metal is not a regular part of my listening, but I'm genuinely trying to understand why you would call them that. The classification does make a difference in your argument, because otherwise, to use an extreme example, you could say Avril Lavigne is extremely progressive black metal because she doesn't sound anything like it! I haven't been able to find anybody else who says that (they all say avant-garde metal, which makes more sense to me than black). Let's do it this way: what parts of the album are black metal? The only growl on Sing Along Songs was under female vocals, and the guitars are more hard rock than Natten's Madrigal or Emperor. What would you call a twelve tone piece then?

Well I tried to convey that they (Deathspell Omega) did evolve beyond black metal, and as Jake Kobrin stated, are more avant experimental tech black now.  They started as black metal but went beyond it's limits.  (imo)

The backbone of Deathspell with the blastbeats and tremolo riffing are black metal, the guttural vocals are death/black.  hell, they cross so many boundaries, it is not fair to call them purely black metal.  They even have post rock elements and a distinct Penderecki/Barraque vibe on a lot of the classical elements.

twelve tone can be viewed as either experimental, tone-poem music, and yes even avant garde.  I was merely saying that avant is not always 12tone (and vice versa). 

(speaking of which though, the band Ehnahre is a sort of interesting 12tone deathdoom band.  check out "the man closing up".  good stuff.  Ron Jarzombek and all of his projects are very fond of twelve tone as well.)

the roots of 12tone and tonal variation/experimentation are so tangled and long-winded, (and with my limited perspective) that many composers had their own take on it.  Many rejected it, if not from the getgo, they may have started there and ended their careers with more romantic/baroque stuff.  If I was backed into a corner and told to choose a definition or a bullet, I would, of course call 12tone avant garde (or experimental or both).  I was just trying to show how most of it has been done before.... so at this point in the game, it takes a really out there approach to sound truly avant these days (at least for me).  Those of us who have heard lots of avant stuff know the trappings and nuances of 12tone and avant stuff... and yet (I) yearn for going further and further into the realms of musical experimentation and deconstruction.  Call it a need to question (just like many composers before me) the accepted methods.  Every musician worth his salt must go through this.... even though there are established rules that must be understood first, the boundaries would be limited only by lack in technology that suits the imagination of said composer.

that's all I am saying.  I know what avant garde sounds like, and I love it to death..... but there is room for more experimentation.  Maybe that is the new avant garde?  Isn't that what avant garde means in the first place?  Or has it all been done? 

avalanchemaster wrote: mithrandir wrote: avalanchemaster wrote: Gnaw Their Tongues is the pinnacle of extremity and darkness.....and I love every minute of it.  Nothing compares to them/him... except for maybe certain 20th century classical, and even most of them don't incorporate heavy distortion into their material. GTT is pretty much the band I've been waiting for all my life, Here-here! good to see you around these parts, old friend!

 

post your thoughts after you listen to a couple of songs a few times.... give it a chance.... it may take time to sink in.  

I'm glad GTT made it on to PA, that shows how open minded you guys are around here!  
I hope the others make it on too....


In other interesting news, I spoke at length last night with Kevin Hufnagel (on facebook) about developments for Gorguts.... He said that Luc Lemay has composed the whole of six tracks, which are very dense, layered, and dynamic.  Lots of harmonies, solos and other shenanigans.  Apparently Negativa (well Luc and Steeve go in different directions musically; Luc composes, Steeve improvises) sort of dissolved (temporarily?) and Gorguts was revived due to musical differences in the Negativa camp.... although I am sure that Negativa might have a future as well.  I was sort of surprised (yet relieved) to hear that one of my musical idols (Luc Lemay) was actually really down to earth and easy to work with.  I said that I would have had an "I am not worthy!" moment if I were asked to work with him.... yet Kevin says Luc is too cool for that... Kevin told me he has a solo over a blast beat!  f**k!  This is probably my most anticipated release of the last 5-10 years (in metal).

Did we get (australian) Portal in the archives?  Their new one, "Swarth", is their best one yet.  That is another band who has taken the dark element and made it work for them.  If an (experimental) blackened death metal band filtered everything through a dark ambient textural base, and using lovecraftian lore (wearing hoods/robes/severed nooses, and a clock on the singer's head) wrote terrifying and churning opuses to wake the dead and strike fear in the hearts of anyone young or old, this would be it.  (of course not as dark as GTT, but surely on their way)

I wonder if (UK) band Esoteric would ever be added?  They are my favorite psychedelic doom-death band.  just tortured, darkness and woe....

http://www.myspace.com/esotericuk

UMUR wrote: Imagine the soundtrack to someone being tortured and you´re just about there. Gnaw Their Tongues is a downright unpleasant listen. I´m not sure why but i greatly enjoy it. I can´t remember having heard anything that dark and eerie before. I was very happy when a couple of the other members of the PMT also felt Gnaw Their Tongues had a place here on PA and I got to add them.   I´ll look into Beheaded Zombie, Borgia and Psychofagist to see if I feel they would fit PA. coincidently I added Thee Maldoror Kollective to the PMT chart on Progfreak for evaluation just a couple of days ago.   You keep those recommendations coming, I´ve been inspired several times by your interesting suggestions and many of them have subsequently been added to PA. Acts such as Gnaw Their Tongues ( http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=4884) and Kailash ( http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=4864).

I will check out Altered Aeon and Revocation. As I remember Esoteric have been rejected ( I haven´t voted though. Wasn´t part of the team then). Portal still have a chance to get added but out of five votes there are two no votes already, so it will require yes votes from the three remaining members. I´m currently listening to their three studio albums and will vote when I´m sure of my opinion.

IMO Portal DEFINITELY deserves a spot on this site. Definitely experimenal enough to be considered progressive. Great disturbing atmospheres and everything.

Revocation is a great band. Not prog metal by any means, but it's a rather enjoyable take on modern thrash metal.
I absolutely adore their debut album.
Kinda like what Metallica would sound like if they had bothered to improve as musicians over the years.
Okay, not quite exactly that, but you get my point, Revocation write some gnarly songs and have killer chops.