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Slartibartfast View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 08:19
What I'm curious about is prog in China...
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 12:12
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

What I'm curious about is prog in China...
 
Not exactly prog, but an interesting article nonetheless:
"An article describes Beijing’s small but growing experimental music scene"
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 19:13
Well, that brief sample in the article sounded ambient and good.  Good article, too by the way.
It's a prog world after all, it's a prog world after all...
Everybody sing. dammit!
Oh, and yeah, put your hands together! LOL
Every time I hear that I just want to put my hands together and leave them that way. Clap


Edited by Slartibartfast - October 30 2007 at 19:17
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 19:52
I spent a couple of very happy years in Japan (Nagoya, to be precise) and I can confirm that, while prog is very much a niche market over there it's a very healthy niche indeed! Most of the big shops - HMV, Tower, Takayama - carried a much better selection of prog old and new than their equivalents in the UK, and a few hours browsing in some of the second hand CD shops could turn up all kinds of interesting oddities. The big stores tend to carry current releases from the likes of Ruins, Acid Mothers Temple, Bondage Fruit etc but you need to go to specialist shops to find their older releases. ReR has a Japanese outpost and RIO/Avant is probably more widely available than it is in the UK. While I was over there I saw King Crimson in Nagoya (TPTB tour) and they played in a medium sized venue which was close to sold out - several other prog and metal acts also toured while I was over there.
 
Having said all that, mainstream Japanese music is dominated by short lived boy or girl groups (SMAP were big while I was there) and bands that reinterpret western rock - Mr Children have been releasing albums which are virtual retreads of Bon Jovi (still MASSIVE in Japan) and their ilk for more than 20 years, and doing it rather well.
 
So all in all, Japan is a country where prog never died, isn't a dirty word and where there is a huge underground network of frequently excellent bizarre experimental bands, and where big name prog acts still tour regularly. The popularity of Bon jovi is a little baffling, but we all have our weaknesses Wink.
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to the already rich among us...'

Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 20:19
Originally posted by Syzygy Syzygy wrote:

The popularity of Bon jovi is a little baffling, but we all have our weaknesses Wink.

Put your hands together.Angry 
Seriously curious about prog in China, though...
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2007 at 21:19
 1980s are frequently regarded as lost decade for progressive rock. Japan was also suffered by such tendency. However the damage was apparently weaker than other principal countries; USA, UK, France, Italy, Germany, etc. Some of Japanese labels were very eager to reissue past gems and introduce new albums from all over the world at that time. Unfortunately they could not find any African albums.... King Records, Phonogram, Polydor and Edison were such labels. Also Marquee started own label Belle Antique. They assisted to keep prog fans. Prog fans waited next albums never released in Japan. These labels released many albums. This is the reason why many Japanese proggers know old gems prior to real prog revival. These were released as Japanese issues between late 1970s and late 1980s.
*New Trolls/Concerto Grosso 1
*New Trolls/Concerto Grosso 2
*New Trolls/UT
*New Trolls/Atomic System
*New Trolls/Tempi Dispari
*Osanna/L'uomo
*Osanna/Palepoli
*Osanna/Milano Calibro 9
*Osanna/Landscape Of Life
*Heldon/Agneta Nilsson
*Pulsar/Pollen
*I Pooh/Parsifal
*Ange/Guet-Apens
*Ange/Emile Jacoty
*Le Orme/Contrappunti
*Memoriance/L'Ecume Des Jours
*National Health/S.T.
*Mario Lavezzi/Iaia
*Alberto Radius/Che Cosa Sei
*Julian Jay Savarin/Waiters On The Dance
*Mauro Pelosi/Al Mercato Degli Uomini Piccoli
*Mauro Pelosi/La Stagione Per Morire
*Island/Pictures
*Pablo El Enterrador/S.T.
*Satin Whale/Lost Mankind
*Gong/Camembert Electrique
*East/Huseg
*East/Jatekok
*Airlord/Clockwork Revenge
*Eela Craig/Missa Universalis
*Eela Craig/One Niter
*Eela Craig/Hats Of Glass
*Pepe Maina/Il Canto Dell'Arpa E Del Flauto
*Atoll/Tertio
*Atoll/Mugiciens Magiciens
*Atoll/L'Araignee-Mal
*Gilgamesh/Another Fine Tune You've Got Me Into
*Windchase/Symphinity
*The Trip/Caronte
*The Trip/Atlantide
*Rustichelli Bordini/Opera Prima
*Maxophone/S.T.
*Il Balletto Di Bronzo/Ys
*Ibis/Sun Supreme
*Ibis/S.T.
*Latte E Miele/Passio Secundum Mattheum
*Latte E Miele/Papillon
*Quella Vecchia Locanda/Il Tempo Della Gioia
*Pierrot Lunaire/Gudrun
*Pierrot Lunaire/S.T.
*Banco Del Mutuo Soccorso/S.T.
*Banco Del Mutuo Soccorso/Darwin!
*Banco Del Mutuo Soccorso/Io Sono Nato Libero
*Banco Del Mutuo Soccorso/Canto Di Primavera
*Picchio Dal Pozzo/S.T.
*Picchio Dal Pozzo/Abbiamo Tutti I Suoi Problemi
*Richard Pinhas/East West
*Area/1978
*Mauro Pagani/S.T.
*Celeste/S.T.
*FM/Black Noise
*Heads In The Sky/S.T.
*Triade/1998: La Storia DiSabazio
.....etc, etc
Also Edison, King Records, Belle Antique tried to grow up Japanese bands at that time. So many bands could release their albums. Dada, Kennedy, Mugen, Bi Kyo Ran, Ain Soph, Novela, Outer Limits, Vienna, Starless, Black Page, Vermilion Sands, Ataraxia, Deja-Vu, Fromage, Social Tension, Kenso, Mr.Sirius, Gerard etc were such cases. Unfortunately Maguai, Galapagos, Green, etc could not make any own albums. Grand Guignol also could not record their best period.
 Besides, other major labels released some interesting albums in this period. Wha-ha-ha, Inoue Keizo, Senba Kiyohiko & Haniwa All Stars, Velvet Paw, Keep, Mariah, Crosswind, Namba Hiroyuki, Lalena, etc made progressive rock albums. This is very important fact. Recent new prog bands/artists cannot make debut from major labels! Flat 122, Ashada, KBB, Naikaku no Wa, Mizukagami, etc were all released by minor labels.
 
[They were active more than 10 years but now disbanded or inactive ....]
*After Dinner (Utsunomiya was a great sound creator. When he left this group, After Dinner may be over... It was stopped in 1997.)
*La'cryma Christi (I hear only Sculpture Of Time is progressive rock album. La'cryma Christi disbanded in 2007)
*Lucifer (They release 6 ablums. But most of them are very rare because of original circulation. Only Marginia was easily to get. Lucifer disbanded in 1994.)
*Sirius ~ Mr.Sirius (Sirius is a band led by Miyatake and Mr.Sirius is his solo. He is now busy to make umbrellas ....)
*Picaresque Of Bremen (Pop, pop, pop. Maybe they are more pop than your image of progressive rock. Anyway the lead vocalist Tochizawa Yukari was really cute excellent singer!)
*Providence (Because of the leader's transfer from Sapporo, Providence could not continue...)
*Teru's Symphonia (I'm sad I can't see Hirayama's name recently.)
*Velvet Paw (They were no doubtly one of the most hopeful new bands before debut. Unfortunately they became pop when they released 1st album fom CBS Sony. But I don't think 1st and 2nd are boring.Formed by only 5 girls! Velvet Paw disbanded in 1995.)


Edited by honganji - October 31 2007 at 05:45
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erik neuteboom View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2007 at 05:15
Good story to read Honganji Thumbs%20Up I remember that I read the French progrock magazine Harmonie in which you could find a special Japanese progrock section in every issue so I discovered many Japanese progrock bands. The Japanese progrock bands have always had a special connection with the French: Musea re-released the Japanese prog and organized the Ars Nova and Gerard tour in the late Nineties, one op my personal progrock highlights, especially when I met my Japanese hero Toshio Egawa, the ultimate Japanese keyboard-wizard who played in Novela, Gerard, Sheherazade and some other bands (I am sure Honganji knows those other bands Wink ).
About the European progrock bands re-issues by Japanese labels: one of my treasures is the digipack version of  E Tutto Comincio Cosi by Italian band Sensitiva Immagine on the Melos Project label (1991, Edison & Marquee). I read about it in Harmonie, it was described as very early Genesis inspired, I ordered it immediately and a few years later I added it to Prog Archives, it is a very acclaimed Genesis inspired band Thumbs%20Up (Musea has rereleased it with two bonus tracks).
I also remember that for a long time Japan was the only country were you could get CD's from fellow Dutchmen Earth & Fire, quite expensive but many were pleased with the opportunity. How ironical: at this moment you can buy a 3-CD set with the early Earth & Fire albums for 10 euro's Shocked


Edited by erik neuteboom - October 31 2007 at 05:16
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2007 at 08:37
I don't really understand the appeal of GERARD. To my feeling (as with many Japanese bands) everything about them shouts out KITSCH.

On the other hand, what I've heard of Yonin Bayashi certainly sounded fun, and (as some of you may know by now) KENSO are simply my favourite prog band (from ANY country) from the past twenty years.

On the prog fusion side, I'm surprised no-one has mentioned the guitarist Kazumi WATANABE. Some of his albums are bit too close to elevator music, but his collaborations with Bill Bruford, Jeff Berlin, Patrick Moraz and Chad Wackerman are well worth hearing. In the past decade or so, Watanabe's been playing a lot of "unplugged" stuff. I don't know what he's done in the past few years. The problem with Japan-only releases is that they rarely cost less than $30 (or £15), which makes me reluctant to just go out and buy...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2007 at 15:36

--->fuxi

Yes, Japanese CDs are usually very expensive. Maybe worst in the world. New CD albums are frequently priced more than 3000 yen (1 USD = 115 yen). What an annoying problem ....

Watanabe Kazumi? Aaaaa, he is usually put into jazz. So I forgot to mention. Embarrassed Yes, he has sometimes  released interesting progressive albums. Not only solo albums but also he played in many other musicians' albums. In case of prog albums, he played in Inoue Keizo's works. Also he played in Senba Kiyohiko & Haniwa All Stars. Of course, he is very busy to make new albums and to play the creative collaboration works in recent 2 - 3 years. He is still the No.1 Japanese jazz guitarist! Big%20smile Oops, he is also an important prog guitarist. Clap  I hear Kylyn is interesting though I don't own it. Embarrassed

Reissued CDs are cheaper. You may be able to get them around 1500 ~ 2100 in Japan. (However shipping cost is apparently more expensive than other countries .... ) Wacko 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2007 at 19:00
Originally posted by honganji honganji wrote:

--->fuxi

Yes, Japanese CDs are usually very expensive. Maybe worst in the world. New CD albums are frequently priced more than 3000 yen (1 USD = 115 yen). What an annoying problem ....

Watanabe Kazumi? Aaaaa, he is usually put into jazz. So I forgot to mention. Embarrassed Yes, he has sometimes  released interesting progressive albums. Not only solo albums but also he played in many other musicians' albums. In case of prog albums, he played in Inoue Keizo's works. Also he played in Senba Kiyohiko & Haniwa All Stars. Of course, he is very busy to make new albums and to play the creative collaboration works in recent 2 - 3 years. He is still the No.1 Japanese jazz guitarist! Big%20smile Oops, he is also an important prog guitarist. Clap  I hear Kylyn is interesting though I don't own it. Embarrassed

Reissued CDs are cheaper. You may be able to get them around 1500 ~ 2100 in Japan. (However shipping cost is apparently more expensive than other countries .... ) Wacko 
 
When I was over there I found CDs to be reasonably priced, not exactly cheap but generally a bit less expensive than in the UK. Of course, exchange rates may have had something to with that, and I was mostly buying reissues rather than new CDs.
'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'

Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2007 at 23:22
when in Japan, i noticed that imports are actually cheaper than Japanese-pressed cds.  but in any case when u buy these Jap editions in Japan the prices are still decent.
 
its only when they're exported then the price gets marked up a lot more...........
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2007 at 18:35
I have been there two times, and it was like I died and came to heaven as far as used record shops go !! I got a lot of rare LPs quite cheaply, and you can always be sure that the previous owner has treated it well.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2007 at 21:29
well i just want to thank Japan for all the Mini LP releases, lots of re-releases  of RPI, and Canterbury.. the packing is great, an exact replica of the original LP, and all remastered. Clap
Most listened albums last week

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2007 at 05:25
--->erik
Thanks erik. In comparison with your great efforts, this is very small contribution...Embarrassed
 
 1990s. Internet system made us change drastically. Once proggers were dotted. Frequeltly isolated. But now internet helps us to talk about this kind of music. It assists to keep the movement very well.
 Talking about 1990s scene, this decade is divided into first half 5 years and latter half 5 years. Windows 95 apparently changed internet as convenient tool. Prog scene was slowly ,gradually and steadily revived in the early 1990s. Dream Theater / Images And Words. Anglagard / Hybris. Maybe they were one of the key albums. But I felt true revival started around 1994. It is 1 year prior to Windows 95. Progresive rock was still maniac kind of music even in the first half of 1990s. But many hopeful bands / artists appeared in this period. Also internet made them easily to know. If there were not this system, prog scene must be very smaller than today. Latter half 5 years were close to recent scene. Many interesting albums appeared here and there.
 By the way, Japanese late 80s and early 90s scene was very hard period. Many charismatic bands disbanded / became inactive. Later some of them were reunited. Also there are some releases. But all of them stopped releasing albums or disbanded in this period; Pageant, Outer Limits, Vienna, Sense Of Wonder, Killing Time, Rosalia, Velvet Paw, Mugen, Mr.Sirius, Asturias, Kennedy, Novela, Senba Kiyohiko & Haniwa All Stars, Picaresque Of Bremen, etc. On the other hand, new remarkable prog bands began to release interesting CD albums. Ars Nova, Koenji Hyakkei, Optical*8, Tipographica, Bondage Fruit, Ground-Zero, Marge Litch, etc are such groups. ''Step Across The Border'' This phrase helped Japanese prog musicians and fans to enjoy new kind of progressive rock. There appeared many interesting groups / artists / albums .... Japanese scene seemed to go its peak of progressive rock movement. Clap But unfortunately the movement was enexpectedly baffled by the leading book of progressive rock. Because prog magazine Marquee gradually turned to mainly write another kind of music rather than most of readers wished for prog. Old proggers left from this magazine. So Marquee rapidly became not for prog expert book. Editor must keep the essential policy. Editor must try to find new dimension. But editor must not run for only his hobby. This editor must publish another magazine as another name in the middle of 1990s. Because of this strayed position, Marquee lost confidence as a leading prog magazine. There might be 3 or 4 years blank for Japanese to appreciate true prog magazine. Finally Euro Rock Press was published by the request of frustrated proggers in the late 1990s. It is ironically published by Marquee Inc.! Big%20smile Here is the original policy of Marquee Moon.
 But this 3 - 4 years blank was really regrettable. Local proggers could not know what happened in Japanese scene. Can you believe it? Marquee's shop World Disque introduced us many Japanese albums in its monthly sale list. But this was the only source. I felt this period was harder than the middle of 1980s.
 When I noticed Japanese scene, major labels were no longer to grow up new prog bands and artists. So there have been few cases of debut album by new bands from major labels since the middle of 1990s. But independent labels became more active to release hopeful albums. This tendency continues to current scene. Major labels release only experienced bands and artists. Indeed, they keep at least required level. I wish majors try to grow up new comers as well as 80s King Records were so. But current scence is assisted by independent labels: Poseidon is the most well-known label.  
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2007 at 09:10

Thanks for the compliments Honganji Thumbs%20Up About the magazine Marquee, a few years ago I got one that contained articles about techno-house and slap bassing, at least half ot that Marquee magazine featured non-progrock while in the Nineties it was mainly a progrock magazine.

About Poseidon, it has a ditribution deal with the French progrock label Musea (like Interpose+) and I just noticed that promising new band Ashada is on Inter Music and Musea Parallele, again that linke between Japan and France!

I wonder or progrock bands still play in venues like Silver Elephant and Eggman where bands like Outer Limits, Pageant, Mugen< Gerard and Vienna performed?

             Here's a picture a friend made after I had interviewed Gerard, they
             gave me a limited edition of the CD Meridian, with their autographs Approve
 
 
 
 


Edited by erik neuteboom - November 02 2007 at 09:15
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2007 at 09:50
Originally posted by erik neuteboom erik neuteboom wrote:

Thanks for the compliments Honganji Thumbs%20Up About the magazine Marquee, a few years ago I got one that contained articles about techno-house and slap bassing, at least half ot that Marquee magazine featured non-progrock while in the Nineties it was mainly a progrock magazine.

About Poseidon, it has a ditribution deal with the French progrock label Musea (like Interpose+) and I just noticed that promising new band Ashada is on Inter Music and Musea Parallele, again that linke between Japan and France!

I wonder or progrock bands still play in venues like Silver Elephant and Eggman where bands like Outer Limits, Pageant, Mugen< Gerard and Vienna performed?

             Here's a picture a friend made after I had interviewed Gerard, they
             gave me a limited edition of the CD Meridian, with their autographs Approve
 
 
 
 
 
Silver Elphant give many chances for prog bands to make live concerts.
Here, I could find 3 progressive rock concerts in November.
November 4; Progressive Live 2007 - Analog Kidz, The Great Rollingflower, Hamosvorten (I don't own any albums by them!!)
November 24; Progressive Live 2007 - Hanjushin no Gogo, Kinzokuebisu (Ooops, They are very differnt types each other!)
November 28; Progressive Live 2007 - Enigmatic Drive, Takeon (I don't know them at all.)
 
I  remember Gerard have performed at Silver Elephant. But I can't remember Vienna did.
Gerard will give four concerts between December 12 and 16 in Nagoya, Osaka and Tokyo. Tokyo, Nagoya, Osaka are different island cities from mine!! Cry Also there's live in Otaru on February 17, 2008. Otaru is next to Sapporo. However it is far from my city (130 km or so....)
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2007 at 09:57

Honganji, I just checked a fax I once got from Numero Ueno, Vienna played at Power Station, do you know that venue?

Wow, Gerard live in December, if I had the money I had bought a ticket to Tokyo Wink

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2007 at 19:25
Power Station?
It was already closed in the end of June, 1998.
Mmmm, Tokyo is very far. I didn't know that was already closed. LOL
 
By the way, surely Vienna gave a live at Power Station on January 15, 1989. It was the last concert for them. Because Vienna said their disbandment


Edited by honganji - November 02 2007 at 19:33
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2007 at 11:58
Dream Theater sells out every time they go to Japan. And they know all the lyrics. It's the same with other progmetal bands.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2007 at 17:07

 

             Indeed Honganji, it was Vienna live at the Power Station in 1989.

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