Live Prog-rock is Dying

Forgotten Son wrote: darqdean wrote: I disagree that only popular albums are downloaded - read Nick Barrett's thread on the damage done to Pendragon from downloads - [URL=http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39465&KW=barret]http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39465&KW=barret I've debated Nick Barrett and other members of the Pendie forums on the points Nick makes about filesharing. While I don't doubt that Pendragon are losing money, something which concerns me greatly, he oversimplifies things when he attributes such losses to filesharing alone. At one point he listed the number of downloads a Pendragon discography had and says "that's £X that we've lost", which just isn't true.

prog-chick wrote: One thought that has occured to me through the day (obviously not the only thought, but you know one thought about this subject... ) was that an awful lot of folks when defending torrenting or illegal downloading tend to say that it has a huge promotional effect, that it helps to widen the fan base of bands. Surely if this were the case (and you know that I maintain it is not) then we would see an upturn rather that a decline in audiences?   Just a thought.   PCx

I don't know that there is or has been a downturn in attendance at music shows. If you have any numbers, I'd love to see them. It's only natural that some would see the Live concert biz as doing badly because their favourite band can only draw a few hundred people to a show. I saw Erik's posts re : the different draws from Anglagard, Ange & Anekdoten compared to Pallas, Ayreon & IQ.

And although I'd die to see an Ange concert, I can see why they aren't the biggest draw outside of France, and even within their nation, their "prime" time is long past.
I'm surprised that Pallas did well, but Ayreon & IQ seem to be doing well these days. Indeed, if it wasn't for the fact that Prog Montreal rescheduled their festival to the Saturday & Sunday instead of the original Friday & Saturday nights, I had made plans for a road trip up to Montreal to see the Strawbs the 1st night & then IQ the next night. And by all accounts, the festival was a success, with plansa already in the works for next year.

One thing we should keep in mind is that niche bands will not sell out 1000 seat halls in too many places outside their home country. And most prog bands are niche with a capital N. The better ones can build up their fan base over time. But expecting those who we consider to be of a higher artistic level to automatically transfer that "talent" into attendance is not realistic. Gentle Giant never played to the same crowds that Yes & Jethro Tull did. And I would be surprised to find out that any RIO/Avant-Garde group or Krautrocker played a show on their own to major audiences (i.e. not including festivals).
So just stating that we attend any & all shows to support a burgeoning scene is not a solution. But if a band that you like come by your town, by all means buy a ticket. Especially for the smaller bands. That's how the punk & indie/alt scenes keep healthy.
Now mind you, I'm in Moncton NB, so I can easily say that knowing that hardly any prog groups come through here. Although we do have a healthy metal, punk, country & alternative scene.


Edited by debrewguy - October 17 2007 at 21:30

alluding to your original post Dean you are right - these days i see many 1st division bands in safe major venues near home but i would like to see some sunday league players too, one reason i guess people don't see struggling fledgling bands, least of all Prog, but all too often they have to play in some dodgy backwater, really in these times travelling to these places late at night is a risk for anybody with or without a car.  a friend of mine plays in an indie band but though i have often wanted to see him they are in some very dodgy areas, i even see people leaving big venues early (11pm) to start their journey home.

Edited by mystic fred - October 17 2007 at 06:19

I find it weird, I was in college in the golden years of the late 80's when you could prog-out virtually everyweekend, and indeed that is exactly where the pennies went, The Marquee, The Town & Country , The Royal Standard,  gig after gig after gig........fabulous!

You need the pop sensibilities of the Beatles and the brilliance of Pink Floyd. Then again I'm waiting for that combination to happen. Be happy some of the most influential and biggest selling albums of all time are either proto prog of progressive rock. Sgt Pepper and the Dark Side of the Moon.

I am positive about it because thanks to Prog Archives progheads from many countries encouraged each other to visit the Symforce Festival inthreads on teh Forum and in the end PA members from the UK, Portugal, France, Belgium and many from Holland teamed up, great  But to be continued?

Edited by erik neuteboom - October 11 2007 at 23:14

This is a fascinating read. Thanks darqdean and all who have contributed.

I'd love to go to more concerts, but living in New Zealand makes things very difficult. We get only the very biggest acts, and few of them are prog (though I did go to THE MARS VOLTA this year and will be at the MUSE concert in a few weeks' time). At the other end of the scale are local NZ prog bands like JAKOB (check them out if you're into post-rock) but you have to keep a very close eye on them to find out when and where they're performing, and then take a six-hour trip by car.

Europe seems to be the place to live. I'm tempted ...

Interesting blog...glad I came across it. Agree with certain points regarding supporting musicians live; if I didn't live in the middle of nowhere, I'd be accessing as much live music as possible. And in particular lesser known bands.

Anyway, tired and fading...must retire to the temporary death known as sleep.

I would love to play even the crappiest of venues and i'd feel pretty lame if no one showed up to see me. I think it's good to support the guys who are trying to keep music alive. (i'm one of them) Prog can never die as long as there are so many people in the prog archives forum. some of us are bound to play a show and get noticed by at least someone, even if they're just fans that appreciate what we do.

The recording industry is what's in trouble. I would think that live music would be growing rather than shrinking. The experience of seeing a live show in person is not something that can be uploaded to a computer. If this is not enough to make money, than yes, music will stop being an industry. But there will always be new music...people don't always play music based on the free market's demands. I would think that we'll be seeing a reversal in the way music has been going since the invention of the radio (back from the studio to an emphasis on live music). And, frankly, I'm not at all sure this is a bad thing. It will certainly be different though...music will be more social, and it won't always be very cerebral (before radio, there were essentially three genres: folk songs, bar songs, and classical, which usually lags behind the other two in popularity). The focus will be on a fun live show.