Metallica... Prog Metal or Prog related

^ I'll use this "trap" as long as Iron Maiden are the only prog-related metal band in the archives.

"Ok, so Prog Metal is mainly inspired by Iron Maiden and Metallica, a couple of other metal bands and two-three the biggest prog act of the 70's. That's excactly the reason its not considered nearly as progressive as the original prog-movement by most who knows it  well... And why each time when I've streamed a track or two by almost any of the post 70's/PM bands on your playlist, I've been dissapointed."

Maybe you simply don't like prog metal?

MikeEnRegalia wrote: Maybe you simply don't like prog metal?

So what? That certainly doesn't mean I'm wrong, and everyone who likes it are right.


Edited by Rocktopus - May 30 2007 at 05:54

micky wrote: enteredwinter wrote: I also voted for the joke option as my way of voicing "Metallica shouldn't be here", which I believe for reasons I already explained in the recent "Metallica?" thread in this part of the forum. IMO, the poll should have included an option that said: "Metallica shouldn't be added to the Archives", instead of the joke option, because not doing so seems to assume that people generally agree that they should be added, which is clearly not the case. In other words, before we decide what section to put them in, shouldn't we decide by vote if they belong here in the first place? I know that three or four people have stated their case in the other thread in favor of adding them, but a vote that measures what the overall sentiment is on this issue would have been more appropriate at this point. IMHO. Not that the archives should listen to the majority ... but still I think it would be valuable input to see where the majority lies. voted for the joke option myself...  reading the cases for them in the other thread...  not convinced of influence... and seems more of a case was made that they were in fact PM.  Not convinced by that either....  as Tony said in the other thread.  Where is the best place for them...simple... neither... they aren't  PM.... by most accounts... and they aren't  Prog related enough to merit inclusion here by several who I think undestand what it is and what the category stands for.  TOO many bands have prog elements in their music.. it is about influence and impact on PROG in many cases   and I am not convinced that their impact was on the 'prog' side of prog-metal.  I think that came from the classic groups that many PM artists  list as direct influences... they sure as hell didn't influence the metallic side of things

Edited by Certif1ed - May 30 2007 at 06:51

MikeEnRegalia wrote: I never said that liking prog metal was a requirement ... I'd simply appreciate if those who don't like the genre refrained from bashing it.

Is that what I'm doing? Am I not correct about PM's main sources for inspiration? Where am I bashing the genre? Is it when I state my honest opinion about it continously dissapointing me?

Saying that most progmetal is less progressive than the original 70's prog-movement, feels about as controversial as saying that protoprog is less complex than R.I.O.


Edited by Rocktopus - May 30 2007 at 11:44

MikeEnRegalia wrote:    And let me be equally frank: I think the admins made a horrible decision there.

Edited by Easy Livin - May 30 2007 at 12:00

Cert, I think Micky meant that it was the '70s prog bands that didn't influence the metallic side of prog metal bands.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: micky wrote: let me be frank Mike.... that is why the admins decide these matters.. the basic disconnect between the two is IM were directly influenced by the prog movement itself.. and it shows in the musc.   Metallica weren't.  I don't see why you keep on dragging IM into this.  Different cases... and face it.. IM had a far stronger case for being included here at PA's.  As Zeppelin showed as well.. it's not only influence ON prog.. but infuence BY prog. With all due respect ... this post does not sound like you listened to Master of Puppets. And let me be equally frank: I think the admins made a horrible decision there. I accept that they have the right to make the decisions - I'd even accept if they overruled the PM team on Prog Metal additions ... but a) I don't have to agree with the decisions, and b) they're not automatically right just because the admins make them.

and with all damn due respect hahahha...

I've heard it.. .years ago... but you again... miss the damn point.  If you want to argue sound and the music they made.... put this band before the PMT and it's an up or down vote.. as every band is here.

If not.. then leave the music itself out of it....it becomes a PR issue.... where... for  the seeemingly 100th time..  the music is not the defining aspect of what is and is not a PR group.  Explain Zepplin and their. what... 4 or 5 prog songs  over the course of a decade.  It's not about the music itself..  if it was...  any one with a set of ears would and could add PR groups.  It's about 'knowing' prog.. and that has been reserved to the admins.. as it should be in my opinion.


Edited by micky - May 30 2007 at 19:13

WaywardSon wrote: The only way out of this maze is to put Maiden and Metallica in Prog Metal. (Maiden´s last 2 or 3 albums could be considered Prog Metal) It looks a bit strange how Maiden is the only metal band in Prog Related. Metallica have enough songs which could be classified as Prog metal.   So all I can suggest is they both be silently moved to Prog Metal in the wee hours of the morning, to avoid ...er ...problems.

that might be the the solution...short of simply saying ..great band..  'progressive'  (think of Steely Dan.. my next visit after this post)  but simply not worthy of being included at this site, a PROG rock site.

I have to say though.. we have a system though.. it works....

either they are prog metal... to be determined.(if not already) by the PMT.  Thus either accepted or rejected.

OR  (again.. admin policy has been that  PR is NOT a consolation prize for rejected artists)

 they go before the admin council for PR.. and I think Tony hinted and what I am driving at..

 they simply don't fit or just plain don't belong there.  Iron Maiden at least had STRONG prog influences... thus like Zeppelin (disagree as I may)...  a logical fit for what PR  has been used by this site for.

micky wrote: If not.. then leave the music itself out of it....it becomes a PR issue.... where... for  the seeemingly 100th time..  the music is not the defining aspect of what is and is not a PR group.

Edited by Certif1ed - May 31 2007 at 03:41

I think Metallica would fit in a prog metal site, like some techno bands would fit in a progressive electronic site. But a general Progressive music site - NO!