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smithers 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 30 2006
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 Posted: November 16 2006 at 05:57 |
Tormato is better than Drama, because Drama is the album with the cheesy moments. I rank Tormato as the 4th best Yes album. The Yes album, Fragile and CTTE come before it.
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fuxi
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2006
Location: United Kingdom
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Points: 2476
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 06:06 |
 smithers wrote:
Tormato is better than Drama, because Drama is the album with the cheesy moments. I rank Tormato as the 4th best Yes album. The Yes album, Fragile and CTTE come before it. |
1. Just have a go and describe DRAMA's cheesy moments to us.
2. Have you ever listened to RELAYER, or even GOING FOR THE ONE?
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eugene
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Joined: May 30 2005
Location: Ukraine
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 06:29 |
I relistened to Tormato again yesterday and found it to be quite a good album. I also kinda like Talk, but can't really enjoy Big Generator, Open your Eyes and The ladder.
Well, tastes differ...but I don't give a damn whether it's underrated or otherwise.
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carefulwiththataxe
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tuxon
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 21 2004
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 07:14 |
Peter Rideout wrote:
tuxon wrote:
That's the nature of people, if some people start saying something is bad, others will follow, if enough people follow all will start believing it's true and keep feeding the illusion.feeding the illusion.
that's why having an entirely own opinion, unbiased by other information than your own views and perception is so important.
don't believe what generally is considered to be true by the masses, for they are generally wrong and misguided.
for the record i like Tormato also, one of their best albums, but don't take my word for it. |
So, are confirmed Yes fans like myself and Ivan part of the "wrong and misguided masses," or are we somehow manipulating those unthinking, sheep-like masses? Why would we do that, and how?
There must be some poorly-rated albums here that you also don't care for (but someone out there undoubtably likes them). Have you been manipulated or led by the nose to your opinion? Is your opinion not truly your own, or an illusion? Are you deluded, "wrong and misguided?"
 Sorry, my friend Tux, but I find your position on this one to be presented rather arrogantly. Basically, you are saying that the majority of Yes fans (and that's who bought/buys Tormato, and reviewed the album, after all) are less intelligent, and/or less independent-minded, that the enlighted few (like you, presumably) who like the album, aren't you? 
Since when have Yes fans been lumped in with "the masses" and mere victims of the music media or industry, anyway? 
You could just say something like "I really like this album, and I don't understand why it's not more popular." Don't presume to judge all of us who have a different opinion of it with frankly offensive, condescending words like "underrated," "wrong" and "misguided."
Please. |
Actually i wans't even speaking about Tormato, for it isn't really underrated, with an average of 3,19 and the reviews are quite balanced between 2 and 4 star ratings, it is just a general observation how things in general occur. You may think i'm wrong, but it's my opinion.If you think otherwise that's your opinion and I do not think it's arrogant, wrong or ,misguided to have an own opinion.
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I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT
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prog4evr
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 22 2005
Location: Wuhan, China
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 07:26 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Tormato has several problems IMO, Rick Wakeman's choice of keyboards was terrible, sound almost as if he was playing a cheap Casio.
Songs like Circus of Heaven, Arriving UFO and Don't Kill the Whale give a new meaning to the word Cheesy.
Release Release and the boring Onwards are out of place.
Only Madrigal is decent (Not great). |
Yes, yes, and yes on all counts above. If any of those songs are better than the five songs on Going for the One, then the heads must need some cleaning on the CD player....
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smithers
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 30 2006
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Points: 223
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 07:48 |
fuxi wrote:
smithers wrote:
Tormato is better than Drama, because Drama is the album with the cheesy moments. I rank Tormato as the 4th best Yes album. The Yes album, Fragile and CTTE come before it. |
1. Just have a go and describe DRAMA's cheesy moments to us.
2. Have you ever listened to RELAYER, or even GOING FOR THE ONE? |
Run through the light is a bad song. Into the lens is cool, but that I am a camera part is pretty cringeworthy. Does it really happen is good, but parts of it remind me of Prince(who I don't like much) for some reason and that Up for Up for Up for anything part is pretty cringeworthy. Fairly good album but Tormato is better. Future times, rejoice, madrigal, release release and Silent wings are fine songs indeed and Squires bass sound is awesome. They finally got their act together. Relayer has 3 songs which all start off great, but Gates and Chaser fall apart. Gates is awesome for the first 5 minutes then it just loses the plot and ends in the dull sounding Soon with howes eerie guitar and Andersons screechy vocals. Chaser just becomes annoying after a few minutes and i don't like Howes solo. To be over is the best song. GFTO is recorded in the same way Soon is. Very eerie and dullish recording. Some good moments but none exciting. Only Tull could play a 20 minute piece of music which is brilliant all the way through such as TAAB side 1. Can't believe people think TAAB gets boring after the first 5 minutes. It actually starts to fire up at the 5 minute mark and doesn't stop
Edited by smithers - November 16 2006 at 07:50
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fuxi
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2006
Location: United Kingdom
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Points: 2476
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 07:59 |
smithers wrote:
Future times, rejoice, madrigal, release release and Silent wings are fine songs indeed and Squires bass sound is awesome. |
I will agree with you that those songs are the least embarrassing on TORMATO, although I find it hard to enjoy an album which ends with the words:
Where we are coming from
Or where we go
We only know we come with sound
I guess I just don't like the picture of Jon Anderson coming, er, 'with sound'!
As for your comments on RELAYER and DRAMA, all I can say is that you and I live on different planets.
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akin
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 06 2004
Location: Brazil
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Points: 976
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 08:17 |
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This topic should be closed as it is more a bashing topic than anything else.
The topic changed the subject and became a comparison among Yes albuns with no right or wrong answer.
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Philéas
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Joined: June 14 2006
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Points: 6419
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 14:33 |
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In my opinion, not as bad as many other people think, but each to his own.
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Peter
Special Collaborator
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Joined: January 31 2004
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 15:37 |
tuxon wrote:
Actually i wans't even speaking about Tormato, for it isn't really underrated, with an average of 3,19 and the reviews are quite balanced between 2 and 4 star ratings, it is just a general observation how things in general occur. You may think i'm wrong, but it's my opinion.If you think otherwise that's your opinion and I do not think it's arrogant, wrong or ,misguided to have an own opinion.
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Peace, Tuxie old pal!
I like a good argument/debate, and silly me, I thought you were responding to the subject of this thread: Tormato, and how it is 'rated' here.
Thought I had you, too, you slippery beggar! 
Edited by Peter Rideout - November 16 2006 at 15:38
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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richardh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
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Points: 29474
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Posted: November 16 2006 at 16:11 |
What a useless thread!
Fact is 80% at least of the best Yes music was on three albums: The Yes Album,Close To The Edge and Fragile. CTTE laid down the blueprint for Yes music.They pretty much became a parody of themselves after that.Going for The One deserved many of the criticisms levelled at Prog ,in this case a band disappearing up its own arse..and so punk was born.Tormato does at least have some great moments amongst the parody.
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Losendos
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 03 2005
Location: Australia
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Posted: November 17 2006 at 07:26 |
richardh wrote:
What a useless thread!
Fact is 80% at least of the best Yes music was on three albums: The Yes Album,Close To The Edge and Fragile. CTTE laid down the blueprint for Yes music.They pretty much became a parody of themselves after that.Going for The One deserved many of the criticisms levelled at Prog ,in this case a band disappearing up its own arse..and so punk was born.Tormato does at least have some great moments amongst the parody. |
throw in going for the one and gates of delerium and I reckon you come to about 100 per cent
Tormato and And Then There Were Three I consider historically almost identical. Not bad albums but after the previous releases and with the line ups involved really fell a long way below expectations. There was no prog forum in 1979 and I eagerly obtained both and was hugely disappointed by both without any contact with other progheads.Now i know the 80s were much worse and ATTW3 and Tormato have many good points but at the time they were hugely disappointing .
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How wonderful to be so profound
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Cristi
Special Collaborator
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams
Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Online
Points: 45690
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Posted: November 17 2006 at 07:33 |
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Tormato underrated or underappreciated? Well, no, since it's not one of Yes's best albums and it's got some weaker moments such as Arriving UFO and Circus of Heaven. Subjectively speaking, Tormato is one of my least favourite Yes albums (along with Union and Open your Eyes - which I find worse than Tormato and any 80s Yes albums).
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salmacis
Forum Senior Member
Content Addition
Joined: April 10 2005
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Points: 3928
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Posted: November 17 2006 at 08:01 |
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Cristi, you have it spot on. This has to be one of their weaker albums, alongside the two you mention.
I honestly think even the stronger songs here would fail to make it onto their earlier albums. It's a monumental letdown- I love every moment of every album, more or less, from the debut through GFTO. This just doesn't cut it. The song everyone seems to think is a classic- 'On The Silent Wings Of Freedom', I thought was just a messy affair. I did think 'Drama' showed a newly re-energised band, though. And their 80s albums are at least better than Genesis' AOR albums.
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smithers
Forum Senior Member
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Posted: November 17 2006 at 16:09 |
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Tormato is interesting, GFTO is a bit dull. Some of GFTO is almost straight rock music. Tormato is busy and more exciting release
Edited by smithers - November 17 2006 at 16:09
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salmacis
Forum Senior Member
Content Addition
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Posted: November 17 2006 at 17:42 |
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Busy and exciting I wouldn't have called it. To me, it smacks of a band with nothing left in the tank- 'Arriving UFO', 'Circus Of Heaven' and 'Don't Kill The Whale' are just embarassingly dreadful. There's not much that's prog here either- 'Future Times/Rejoice' and 'On The Silent Wings Of Freedom' are just tired out, and 'Release Release is cod reggae! There's no dull songs on GFTO- the last album they recorded that's anywhere near a classic.
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bjl 2003
Forum Newbie
Joined: October 24 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 33
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Posted: November 26 2006 at 12:01 |
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It all depends on the yardstick by which you choose to measure Tormato's
success or failure. It's a magnificent album compared to much of the
unadulterated pop drivel that so many bands were producing at the time,
but remains disappointing by Yes standards. It defintitely has its
moments, (notably Rejoice and Future Times, On the Silent Wings ..) as well as its flops (Onward never did anything for me). What I would say though is that Tormato is
still recognisably a progressive album, albeit one produced by a great
band that were (as somebody here pointed out) going through a difficult
time collectively and who found inspiration hard to come by at the
time. Of course, it can't hold a candle to Close to the Edge, but it doesn't seem half as bad if you compare it to Open your Eyes ...
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Jared
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 06 2005
Location: Hereford, UK
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Posted: November 26 2006 at 12:08 |
you know, I just wonder exactly how many threads there have been about GFTO/ Tormato/ Drama since progarchives started...
...I bet we're now into 3 figures...
and probably almost as many as there are TTWT/ Duke/ Abacab threads... |
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Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
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Yes Tormato... underrated?