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Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
Posted: September 25 2015 at 18:19
Dean wrote:
Kati wrote:
I don't care if IM are prog related or even classified as prog to be honest. Alice Cooper (young peeps do your research before you comment here and atleast have a listen to 70's albums) i.e. the Killer album is substantially more prog compared to anything IM has ever produced however what bugs me is that Alice Cooper is not listed here on PA.
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: September 23 2015 at 00:30
Kati wrote:
I don't care if IM are prog related or even classified as prog to be honest. Alice Cooper (young peeps do your research before you comment here and atleast have a listen to 70's albums) i.e. the Killer album is substantially more prog compared to anything IM has ever produced however what bugs me is that Alice Cooper is not listed here on PA.
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
Posted: September 22 2015 at 23:16
Tom Ozric wrote:
I just got The Book Of Souls today, gave it an intense listen. I like it more than the last album (Final Frontier), but I still insist on The X Factor being my fave album. Even with Empire Of The Clouds, longest Maiden track, featuring some decent piano and orchestrations, I'd be hard-pressed to call it Prog-Metal. It's quality Maiden, it's awesome music, I dig it. Maybe 'Epic Symphonic Metal' but not really 'Prog'.
Tom!!!!! Yay! Hello you!!!
I don't care if IM are prog related or even classified as prog to be honest. Alice Cooper (young peeps do your research before you comment here and atleast have a listen to 70's albums) i.e. the Killer album is substantially more prog compared to anything IM has ever produced however what bugs me is that Alice Cooper is not listed here on PA.
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926
Posted: September 20 2015 at 08:02
I just got The Book Of Souls today, gave it an intense listen. I like it more than the last album (Final Frontier), but I still insist on The X Factor being my fave album. Even with Empire Of The Clouds, longest Maiden track, featuring some decent piano and orchestrations, I'd be hard-pressed to call it Prog-Metal. It's quality Maiden, it's awesome music, I dig it. Maybe 'Epic Symphonic Metal' but not really 'Prog'.
Joined: January 15 2008
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 160
Posted: September 20 2015 at 06:57
In my humble opinion, what primarily keeps people who make such decisions from including IM in the Prog Related subgenre comes down to two factors. The first is the band's relatively sparing use of keyboards. The second is the relatively low number of epic songs the band has recorded, as compared to a band like Dream Theater. However, taking a look at their last few albums suggests that these statements aren't as true as they were before. I agree with others that Iron Maiden are far more innovative than many bands who are similarly categorized. Lastly, I really think I need to work on writing more concise sentences!
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
Posted: September 19 2015 at 01:01
Cristi wrote:
TheLionOfPrague wrote:
I they they've done enough metal songs/albums to be considered prog metal. It's true also, that a huge amount of their discography is not prog. But then, that's also the case with bands like Yes, Genesis, etc. and here they are (and rightly so).
I don't know what's exactly the parameters to consider a band as prog related or prog (prog metal in this case). I don't think Queensryche or Pain of Salvation are that different to Iron Maiden (and they're under prog metal, not prog related).
how are Iron Maiden and Pain of Salvation similar?
I agree that Queensryche are prog-related but PoS are definitely progressive metal.
POSYay! Pain of Salvation are certainly prog and progmetal no doubt and no context in terms of prog compared to the two other bands mentioned here. I will post 3 POS tracks suggestions here just to clarify the issue above here.
Pain of Salvation - Undertow
Pain of Salvation - Used
Here is an odd one and hahahaha bounce, bounce, bounce happy bounce yay yay Disco Queen yay! hahaha!
Pain of Salvation - Disco Queen (Live from Amsterdam)
Bonus here for the sentimental sweet peeps here, a prog version of Hallelujah:
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
Posted: September 19 2015 at 00:46
chopper wrote:
Kati wrote:
Guldbamsen wrote:
Related? Perhaps.
I always wondered how Caravan's Nine Feet Underground would sound like in Maiden's hands.
it would sound less pom pa pa ta ta tum melodic and rhythmic tac tac ta tum with jazzy prelipupu's that's a fact, no one would recognize that track I think
prelipupus?
hahahaha!!!! Chopper
I attempted to type the tunes and the difference between both bands plus outcome hahahaha!!!
Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Online
Points: 44355
Posted: September 18 2015 at 07:43
TheLionOfPrague wrote:
I they they've done enough metal songs/albums to be considered prog metal. It's true also, that a huge amount of their discography is not prog. But then, that's also the case with bands like Yes, Genesis, etc. and here they are (and rightly so).
I don't know what's exactly the parameters to consider a band as prog related or prog (prog metal in this case). I don't think Queensryche or Pain of Salvation are that different to Iron Maiden (and they're under prog metal, not prog related).
how are Iron Maiden and Pain of Salvation similar?
I agree that Queensryche are prog-related but PoS are definitely progressive metal.
Joined: March 08 2011
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 1063
Posted: September 17 2015 at 17:00
I they they've done enough metal songs/albums to be considered prog metal. It's true also, that a huge amount of their discography is not prog. But then, that's also the case with bands like Yes, Genesis, etc. and here they are (and rightly so).
I don't know what's exactly the parameters to consider a band as prog related or prog (prog metal in this case). I don't think Queensryche or Pain of Salvation are that different to Iron Maiden (and they're under prog metal, not prog related).
I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place
Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Online
Points: 44355
Posted: September 16 2015 at 02:37
Luís de Sousa wrote:
I understand the folk that say IM is not prog. All of their LPs include simple songs and some LPs are not prog at all. However, under the same logic, I can not fathom why bands like Queensrÿche or Savatage are prog.
In any case, was this a democracy, I would vote Maiden for proto-prog.
How is Iron Maiden proto-prog?
Prog related is ok for IM. I think Queensryche & Savatage are prog-related as well. I've seen Savatage labelled as US Power Metal and Queenryche as heavy metal. I can't say it's wrong.
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 65298
Posted: September 15 2015 at 20:37
Dean wrote:
Once a band has been added to the PA archive then people can write reviews ... job done. Moving them around once they are here is an unnecessary academic exercise.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
Joined: August 31 2009
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 40
Posted: September 15 2015 at 20:03
I tend to take a more inclusive view of progressive rock/metal than this site, but even I'd be reluctant to include them. Mentally, I think of them as progressive metal, but I never tag them as such on id3s. They are too strongly perceived as being a heavy metal band by the public as a whole, and sorry guys but public/critical perception is the final authority on genre, not this fansite.
That said, if it were my asylum, I'd eliminate the prog-related ghetto category altogether and create an additional tag called "honorary" which would put you in the genre, but exempt you from the top-100 lists, etc. so Iron Maiden would be an honorary progressive metal band, but not risk one of their albums appearing in the same breath as Thick as a Brick.
Edited by Battlepriest - September 15 2015 at 20:04
Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20030
Posted: September 15 2015 at 07:20
Kati wrote:
Guldbamsen wrote:
Related? Perhaps.
I always wondered how Caravan's Nine Feet Underground would sound like in Maiden's hands.
it would sound less pom pa pa ta ta tum melodic and rhythmic tac tac ta tum with jazzy prelipupu's that's a fact, no one would recognize that track I think
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: September 15 2015 at 04:12
The purpose of the site is to provide a platform for people to write reviews, not to decide how Prog a band is, what flavour Prog they produce or which category they should be filed under. The subgenres are not the be all and end all of the site, they are perhaps better viewed as a navigation aid.
Once a band has been added to the PA archive then people can write reviews ... job done. Moving them around once they are here is an unnecessary academic exercise.
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Does Iron Maiden really belong in only 'related'?
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Tom Ozric wrote:
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