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Davesax1965 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 06 2014 at 03:13
PS Space rock sax track - me playing all instruments apart from slide guitar.


This one, to be precise. 1956 Conn 16M "Director" tenor. ;-)



Edited by Davesax1965 - December 06 2014 at 03:16

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 06 2014 at 03:04
I've met Nik and most of the members of Hawkwind (prior to about 1982) before. 

Nik runs a financial advice company in Cardiff. Whilst surfing through outer space on a surfboard, of course. 

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Tom Ozric View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 12:26
Nik is like a God to me .........
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 10:25
Now here's the funny thing. I jump on the Hawkwind Forum, where I've been a member for years (some nice people there) and put an advert up for an album - with all profits going to charity. As Hawkwind used to do. Before they sold out. Oh yes, sorry, all my profits go to charity. 

Where I put adverts up for FREE downloads, the Hawkwind fans downloaded it in droves. Several hundred ones.  I can do analytics via the website. When you asked them to donate a few quid, which would go to charity, the downloads generated by the Hawkwind site tailed off spectacularly. So all these right on dudes were actually just freeloading. Eventually, I put a post up and get attacked by the "this is not Hawkwind, therefore we do not like it" crowd on the site. 

I sit back and think, well, the proper revolutionary not-in-it-for-the-money times have gone down the plughole, haven't they ? So I just walked away from the lot of them. Thing is, if N** T***** had done the sax on the album, it would have been snaffled up by the diehard Hawkwind fans and collect-the-setters. But no. So it gets ignored. And this is the trouble with all mega-fans (or fanatics) - they lose any critical ability. "Hawkwind good, Hawkwind good, Hawkwind / Floyd / Gary Numan / Cliff Richard forever".

I think not. They WERE good, they are no longer good, things change. 



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 10:17
Bit of editing to protect the innocent Smile

N** T******

28 Feb
to me
Hey Dave, nice to hear from you, I would be most honoured to play on your album, send me wavs, I can put sax and flute wherever you want for how long you want, or whatever instructions you might have, tell me the key, best wishes
N** T*****


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Tom Ozric View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 05:36
Couldn't be Nik T ?? No way......
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 04:23
Just a PS.
I asked a certain ex Hawkwind sax player if he'd like to play on my last album. Got the e-mail here, yes, he'd love to, he said. I'd offered him six months free royalties.

Then I thought, Dave, what the hell are you doing ? This is not about money. I'd actually wanted to reach out to a larger audience by using his name, but then I thought, nope, this is totally wrong. 

So I did the sax bits myself. ;-)

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Davesax1965 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 04:08
Hi Tom - I think the sad thing about Hawkwind is that it's a prime example of what happens when bands chase money and forget their roots. I suppose it becomes a sad inevitability that when band members leave their normal jobs to become full time musicians, they have to think of the mundane things like paying the rent, etc. So, rather than play music for the love of it, and create something different and of artistic worth.... they churn out that which they think will sell. 

Good thing about modern music, you can release what you like, if you're of that bent. If it doesn't sell, you've not had huge overheads, plus it can all be done from a home studio. No tours, venue and lighting hire, etc. Plus, there is so much music now that the jam of fans is spread thinner on the toast of the music scene. There aren't enough fans to go around. ;-) Plus, they all think music is free, so that completely stops artist development, live music et al. The "fans" are actually killing the bands, and live music. 

There is no underground scene. It's unlikely that there ever was. It was just a vehicle to make money out of, to be honest. The UFO club folded because of money... by the early 1970's, even paper shopping bags had psychedelic patterns on them. There now exists a chance for a few artists to actually do what Hawkwind claimed to do and produce innovative non commercial music - done for art, experiment, and it's own sake.

Except you are unlikely to find it, as every man and his dog can now release music. "Ambient" is a case in point. Good ambient music, difficult to find, is like good abstract art. Anyone can now get a Doepfer modular synth system or use VST synths and produce a babble of noise and stick an "experimental" label on it. 

You are very unlikely to find non commercial "underground" music anywhere nowadays. But, at least there's a lot of venues to search for it on. But as for Hawkwind...... Hawkwind is dead. Move on. 

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Tom Ozric View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 03:50
There always an element of risk when dabbling with non-commercial avenues. Even something like 'The Residents' are almost commercial in their approach to being 'anti-commercial'.....
Perhaps any album that flops is really a successful non-commercial offering....


Edited by Tom Ozric - December 04 2014 at 03:51
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 03:43
If only, Tom.

Didn't they make £1.5 million in about three years - by, er, playing music that would sell ? 
Rather than playing music ? ;-)

Non commercial music is much harder to find than everyone thinks. Outside of Germany in about 1968, I should think. 

This is why I tend to like the modern music scene. You will occasionally come across a few people who genuinely want to do something different and aren't bothered about money. Me, for example. ;-)


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 03:34
Oh, we still have the Ozrics, when all is said and done, Ozrics come to the rescue.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 03:33
My answer to all that - Pink Fairies - Never Never Land......
Approaching it from my 'brain-fried' perception, I appreciate their output, even if its worlds away from their roots. Please, allow me that much.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 03:19
Oh dear, Electric Teepee. ;-)

Hi Tom, just think, at the time, the "underground scene" in the UK involves kids with dreadlocks, baggy jumpers and dogs on bits of string all pretending to anarchically wreck the system.

So Hawkwind brought an album out which would pander to their fantasies.

When you look at it like that, it all gets a bit "commercial" rather than "music / art", doesn't it ? Now, I'd have no problems with a band being commercial, but Hawkwind always sold themselves as some kind of Peoples Band, playing free gigs, supporting good causes, didn't they ? So it all becomes very hypocritical. 

Hawkwind will probably keep on going after Dave Brock kicks the bucket, because... it's a brand name. They just don't know when to stop, which really should have been around PXR5. The fans / fanatics hang on because nothing sounds exactly the same, and a proportion think they're "underground" in some kind of proto-terroristic (I refer you to Urban Guerilla Bob Calvert) anti- establishment, edge of music manner. The band are about as underground, musically innovative and anti-establishment as an old people's home. They are now propped up by those who are too stoned/lazy/hidebound to care. 

What a sad, but inevitable, end. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:57
Oh dear - those comments render something as magical as Electric Tepee as next to useless....??
I love what they stood for, all those years ago, and being 42, I hardly know exactly what it is/was they stood for, but I perceive the spirit of it all as I do.....
Anyway, Brockvaleays led his fellow space-cadets down many unknown and adventurous alleyways, so I can only accept their amazing space-rock as its presented.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:54
As a PS. My last album was massively influenced by Hawkwind / Tangerine Dream. 
https://brotherhoodofthemachine.bandcamp.com/album/trip-hazard
Hawkwind are often cited as being a highly influential band by UK musicians - especially John Lydon. They were also labelled as the "godfathers of punk", basically because of the energy they played with.
However. When you look at the discography, Hawkwind were *not* innovative. They merely reflected the tastes of the day - they actually were a commercial venture right from the start and a lot of the "anti-music" stuff is just propaganda. 

For example, the first album is a reflection of the psychedelic era. It then becomes more krautrock in nature... proper krautrock albums were difficult to find in the UK in the early 1970's (and most were better than Hawkwind's imitations.) By 1979 and the rise of Bloody Heavy Metal, the band were releasing shockingly bad albums such as "Live 79". They just followed trends. 

Part of the Hawkwind mythology is that they did a lot of drugs. I've been to Hawkwind conventions and yep, I can tell you now that they certainly did. However. The sad old stories about them being utterly out of their minds have been somewhat beefed up..... you can't play at all when you're that wasted. 

Mind you, listen to "Bring me the head of Yuri Gagarin" at some point. It's a bootleg which shows what Hawkwind were really like for a lot of early 70's gigs. Terrible. ;-)


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:30
Hi Tom, put on Space Ritual. Earth calling, born to go etc.
Then put on Choose your Masques. 
You wouldn't think it was the same band.... you'd be right. Someone once said that Space Ritual was all you needed in a Hawkwind collection. I rate everything up to and including Quark, Strangeness and Charm. The rest is not a "people's band" doing "weird space rock", it's a collection of aging sell outs releasing the same old tired, formulaic rubbish again and again to people who are too stoned to notice. 

Harsh.... but true. Alas.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:25
I actually thought `Blood of the Earth' and `Onward' were very impressive and consistently strong modern albums from the group.

Sure, the band has had many inconsistent and frustrating releases, but there's almost a couple of killer tracks on all their albums.
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Tom Ozric View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:20
^ That's harsh, but I can see where you're coming from - heard many folk state this very ideal.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:17
I have been a massive Hawkwind fan since the mid 1970's.
However.
Hawkwind started out as a fantastic, novel and utterly different band. Then - after 1976 or so, they sold out and produced lazy, predictable, boring music. Now they're just Dave Brock's retirement fund. 

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Tom Ozric View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 04 2014 at 02:00
Oh, that's so amusing what you said of that record fair vendor and Daevid's son.......
....was is Tally or Orlando..........?? I'm sure they met the cockpit pixie ......... More than thrice ...
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