Does Iron Maiden really belong in only 'related'? |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28377 |
Posted: October 29 2014 at 02:32 | ||
not very helpfully the sleevenotes say Adrian Smith - Synth Steve Harris - String Synth What is a string synth?! I would take 'Synth' as being of the keyboard variety therefore I think Wiki is right and I am wrong. Damn!
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aapatsos
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: November 11 2005 Location: Manchester, UK Status: Offline Points: 9226 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 18:02 | ||
Tells you how little difference I find between keyboards and guitar synths... same result to my ears! Wiki says otherwise but would not take it for granted: Stylistically, Seventh Son of a Seventh Son developed the sounds first heard on Somewhere in Time, although, on this occasion, the synth effects were created by keyboards rather than bass or guitar synthesisers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seventh_Son_of_a_Seventh_Son#Personnel Edited by aapatsos - October 28 2014 at 18:09 |
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Catcher10
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17869 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 17:22 | ||
I enjoy a lot bands like Haken, Echolyn and the recent Anathema efforts....but I personally struggle calling it prog and even trying to describe the music to someone else, I find myself using words like alternative, ambient rock....I will have to also use crossover going forward. Just the other day someone on another website asked me if I had bought the new prog album by Flying Colors...In the classic vein I don't think it is prog at all. Today's world I think it is more alternative rock with a dash of traditional hard rock. But that is just me......
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micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 17:02 | ||
I remember well that interesting discussion we (believe it was Brian and me) had here, it was the one time I ducked back into PA's after we retired, when Nearfest crashed and Farfest burned up on the runway...(the year, 2012, that 'Prog' officially died btw) many bands realize in order to survive and prosper you simply can't churn out the same bullsh*t 70's derivative stuff.. ie Prog Rock...it has been done.. and done FAR FAR better already. Sure we get submissions and bands play that.. good luck finding an audience for it.. the gen pop don't care, and many prog fans don't even care since you are not a NAME group.
Prog fan is a dying breed and has proved by the lack of support to other groups to not give a goddamn about music outside of their nostalgia zone, however there exists a much larger underground movement, which we have been involved with, that supports and encourages progressive music artists and that is where the direction of the music is going and yes... much of it lies in the crossover vein. Others like the brilliant guys (and lady!) from Moraine have tapped into Chinese folk and classical music as an influence and the result are mindblowing. |
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Raff
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 29 2005 Location: None Status: Offline Points: 24429 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 16:51 | ||
I will add something to what my other half has already admirably stated: the best new prog bands are very different to whatever stereotype of "classic" prog still survives, on this site or elsewhere. In fact, many of them would not even be called prog according to the "old" criteria. True, there are more than enough bands or artists that churn out well-executed, yet hopelessly derivative stuff for those fans who seem to be stuck in a time warp. However, the stuff that tends NOT to fly under my radar is very much of the "crossover" quality.
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micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 16:30 | ||
not just that Pat but also the interesting and varied fans the site draws in of those groups or musical styles the site highlites but are not considered 'prog rock' but definitely fall under the larger progressive rock umbrella, or if one was to include RIO or the electronic stuff... the even larger progressive MUSIC umbrella which the site covers well. that is why my butt still burns to see the whole 'it is not prog' thing tossed about. Outside of the sympho-maniacs one could argue that bucket just doesn't hold any water. Well then anything outiside of symph, RPI, and (perhaps haha) f**king Neo is not prog either. |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28377 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 15:29 | ||
no keyboards are present , they actually use guitar synths but otherwise I agree with your basic point
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aapatsos
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: November 11 2005 Location: Manchester, UK Status: Offline Points: 9226 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 14:53 | ||
^ who says that in order to be progressive metal you need keyboards?
It seems that you have not listened much to Iron Maiden since Somewhere in Time and Seventh Son are actually full of keyboards. Prog-related is a great fit for them. Edited by aapatsos - October 28 2014 at 14:54 |
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M27Barney
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 09 2006 Location: Swinton M27 Status: Offline Points: 3136 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 14:33 | ||
Iron Maiden - No keyboards so NOT progressive metal.
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer Joined: March 08 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2755 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 12:45 | ||
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Padraic
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 16 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 31169 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 10:22 | ||
In the end, I'm glad the site is more inclusive and not restricted to "classic", "prog rock", "70s", what have you. There's a lot of great music I've found here due to the site's inclusive nature. |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 10:01 | ||
The thing is, while Metallica had a distinct thrash metal phase with an ambitious trio of albums from RTL to AJFA, Iron Maiden always had a lot of straight up metal with the occasional proggy track thrown in the middle. In SSOASS, the ratio got 'equalised' a bit but there's still more of straight up stuff than the prog metal. So they are probably just fine in prog related rather than prog metal. They have enough epics that I wouldn't mind if they were indeed classified as prog metal. On the other hand, that would open the floodgates to plenty of power metal. Even relatively straight up power metal bands like Halloween might have a good case for inclusion.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 06:30 | ||
yes
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2005 Location: Olympus Mons Status: Offline Points: 15926 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 06:16 | ||
I think, since the return of Dickinson in the new millennium, they have a more 'Prog' approach to composition, but they always had their Proggy pieces.
.......and my UBER-FAVE album from them is The X Factor. Quite Prog for much of it. Been a fan since Somewhere In Time. And after all that, I do find it hard-pressed to call them Prog-Metal, only Related seems about right. |
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jim22
Forum Newbie Joined: October 28 2014 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 1 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 03:47 | ||
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28377 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 02:28 | ||
Sorry just my silly sense of humour. I wasn't being serious. Phil and also that great eighties prog supergroup that inspired him Earth,Wind and Fire should definitely be included asap.
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richardh
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 28377 |
Posted: October 28 2014 at 02:25 | ||
hopefully I'll be dead
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Fearabsentia
Forum Newbie Joined: October 12 2014 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 14 |
Posted: October 27 2014 at 18:51 | ||
I don't think Phil Collins destroyed prog, you could say the same thing about any other pop artist. I don't like any pop music, I think it's one of the worst genres of music; however, if we have every other member of Genesis we should have Phil Collins in prog related. |
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micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 27 2014 at 18:30 | ||
oh sure. there are a good number of artists that could, IMO SHOULD, be included here. However I've taken my cue from Raff, or her from me as she knows my feelings on this, my days of trying to help complete what the site started, but never fully realized, are over. I have the scars to show for my efforts hahaha. I'm just here for the beer and chicks and to give cyber hot-feet to old friends, and new ones. However IMO the site is not a prog rock website, it LONG since stopped being that, being thatt fully half perhaps more of the artists here have little direct connection to the prog rock scene of the 70's, they have been declared by some cat to be prog but really are more.. progressive rock artists. Prog like any musical form has its cliches and formulas and the 70's bands played that vein till it bled dry. That is why so many either moved on, or mutated with the times. Recognzing that is what the site sort of slid towards but never fully accepted it, and probably kept its head in the sand while still thinking it was a prog rock website when very little of it is prog. Leading minds, and I agree with them think that prog rock is merely a subset of a larger and much more diverse style called progressive rock. my two cents as always. More opinions than sense... but it makes the internet fun. Edited by micky - October 27 2014 at 18:31 |
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ghost_of_morphy
Prog Reviewer Joined: March 08 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2755 |
Posted: October 27 2014 at 18:00 | ||
Remember this ten years from now when you go to the prog polls section and try to decide between voting for Marky Mark or for The Backstreet Boys.
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