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StyLaZyn View Drop Down
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Points: 4079 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 08:49
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

Originally posted by billbuckner billbuckner wrote:

For god's sake, WYWH isn't in the #2 spot because it's somehow the second best album on the site, it's there because it's the second most liked album on the site.

That list is showing the most loved albums, not what albums are objectively the best. Don't blame people for liking things that you don't.
 
ClapClapClapClapClap
 
Very well said BB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
ClapClapClapClapClap I concur
 
Perhaps none of you saw the post referring to the top 100 being a popularity contest?  Confused
 
Thats all it is. To say WYWH is more Prog than Yes's Fragile is a joke, well, at least to me. People interpret the meaning all wrong, of course calling the list "the Top 100" is misleading because it is ambiguous.
 
 
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 07:35
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

Me too, mostly, but which song on CTTE isn't prog?
You're right...I don't agree with him on many points!LOL
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Points: 20030 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 07:30
Me too, mostly, but which song on CTTE isn't prog?
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Points: 32995 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 01:56
Originally posted by darqdean darqdean wrote:

Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

Wish you were here, does not deserve to be in the #2 spot!
Correct - It deserves to be #1
 
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

In fact, I seriously does not belong in the top ten!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Correct again, you seriously don't belong in the top ten!
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

 
WYWH is a great album, but not a great prog album! A five song album, with only three prog songs,
CTTE is three song album with two prog songs.
SEBTP an eight song album with two prog songs.
TAAB a one song album with two prog song...
looks like Floyd for the win then.
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

 
 in the #2 spot of the top 100 prog albums of all time is ludicrus!
small point, but the chart is the top 100 albums in the archive - not the top 100 prog-only albums and certainly not of all time. your claim is ludicrous.
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

I will not stand for this! Stop this foolishness!
Okay, I'm not joking now.
 
I rate every album in the top 10 highly - I do think that perhaps Genesis may be a little over represented, but I don't care that much because I've liked each of those since they were originally released and anyhow, I'm quite good at mentally skipping those and noticing that VdGG are in the top 20, along with PFM and Dream Theatre - hey I can look further down and see Riverside and Porcupine Tree and think - cool, that's really good going for albums that have only been released a few years - so I know that all is well with the world and the entire universe isn't going to disappear up Roger Water's backside.
 
In 1975 when Wish You Were Here was released we really didn't give a flying duck about how Prog it was, all we were interested in then was damn fine music recorded by a damn fine bands and Pink Floyd produced the goods so we were happy. We were so happy in fact that we bought it in sufficient numbers to get it to #1 in the album charts (sorry, but we didn't have the cash to do that with Close to the Edge or Selling England by the Pound, but you know, it was the seventies, in the UK we had strikes, power cuts and rising unemployment to worry about, the USA had it's own problems to deal with, students were rioting in France - well, you get the picture).
 
Pink Floyd have done it all - they have charted the course from psychedelic-pop through space-rock and mad improvisations to symphonic, ethereal, jazzy-pop, heavy-rock, latin-themed music, folk-music and pure progressive-rock covering every subject under the sun in linear concepts, abstract concepts, emotional concepts and reaccuring concepts. And everytime they did this they created their own rules (for other others to take or discard as they wished). Pink Floyd may not have written THE rules on prog, but they showed everyone how it should be done, and (horrors!) even made a bit of money doing it.
 
To me that is what progressive means - not long compositions, layering, wierd time-signatures and clever lyrics (though Floyd all did those in abundance, and in many cases they were one of the first bands to do them)
 
On this site I have read pages of arguments on how X is prog but Y is not, or how band Z made some prog albums and then made some non-prog albums, and to be honest it is all just opinion. A band is either a prog band or it isn't and if a prog band makes a non-prog album, then so what? what does that mater? what does it prove?
 
I've been listening to Wish You Were Here for 32 years and it still astounds and astonishes me. I would like to hope that we will be saying the same thing about Porcupine Tree and Pain of Salvation in 30 years time. (honestly, I do, and I think we will).
 
You say it isn't prog. I disagree: WYWH is a very cynical album about the music industry, something that Roger Waters started in 1969 with Cymbaline and again in 1972 with Free Four, (and has carried on with for the rest of his career). But cynicism, being a negative emotion, is never an easy starting point, yet Floyd managed to make the music carry this sentiment without being completely contemptuous of what they were trying to say, because I find that the music is strangely optimistic (ref: the title track) - a conterpoint to the lyrics - that's a fairly progressive concept isn't it. Tongue
 
I'm sorry if WYWH isn't prog enough for you, but let us have this discussion in 2039 and see if you think the same. (I'll be 82 by then, so I might just permit you to shout, but only so as I can hear you) Smile
 
We are just two lost souls
Swiming in a fish bowl, year after year
Running over the same old ground.
What have we found? The same old fears.
 
Wish You Were Here.
 
A long read...but I agree with just about all of it.
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Points: 15535 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 01:49
^You're right he wasn't rude at all...straight to the point.
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Points: 6890 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 00:28
your not rude at all!
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Points: 1494 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 26 2007 at 00:00
I don't think CTTE deserves to be in the top 10, and I'm certainly not going to sit here and let you say that Have A Cigar isn't prog, but I also am not going to write you an essay, so I will sum up my positions succintly:
Shut up, you. Nobody cares.
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Points: 6890 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 23:36
I stand my ground!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 22:45
Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

Originally posted by billbuckner billbuckner wrote:

For god's sake, WYWH isn't in the #2 spot because it's somehow the second best album on the site, it's there because it's the second most liked album on the site.

That list is showing the most loved albums, not what albums are objectively the best. Don't blame people for liking things that you don't.
 
ClapClapClapClapClap
 
Very well said BB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
ClapClapClapClapClap I concur
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Points: 27802 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 22:38
Originally posted by billbuckner billbuckner wrote:

For god's sake, WYWH isn't in the #2 spot because it's somehow the second best album on the site, it's there because it's the second most liked album on the site.

That list is showing the most loved albums, not what albums are objectively the best. Don't blame people for liking things that you don't.
 
ClapClapClapClapClap
 
Very well said BB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Points: 433 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 22:22
For god's sake, WYWH isn't in the #2 spot because it's somehow the second best album on the site, it's there because it's the second most liked album on the site.

That list is showing the most loved albums, not what albums are objectively the best. Don't blame people for liking things that you don't.
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Points: 4160 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 19:28
Damn, I just realised PA logo is pink and purple. That resembles Pink Floyd and Deep Purple and none of them is prog!

I demand changing of the PA logo immediately!

Actually, I'm so upset about it I'm going to start a new thread...LOL
Percussion, sir!
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 19:11
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

Wish you were here, does not deserve to be in the #2 spot!
Correct - It deserves to be #1
 
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

In fact, I seriously does not belong in the top ten!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Correct again, you seriously don't belong in the top ten!
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

 
WYWH is a great album, but not a great prog album! A five song album, with only three prog songs,
CTTE is three song album with two prog songs.
SEBTP an eight song album with two prog songs.
TAAB a one song album with two prog song...
looks like Floyd for the win then.
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

 
 in the #2 spot of the top 100 prog albums of all time is ludicrus!
small point, but the chart is the top 100 albums in the archive - not the top 100 prog-only albums and certainly not of all time. your claim is ludicrous.
Originally posted by schizoid_man77 schizoid_man77 wrote:

I will not stand for this! Stop this foolishness!
Okay, I'm not joking now.
 
I rate every album in the top 10 highly - I do think that perhaps Genesis may be a little over represented, but I don't care that much because I've liked each of those since they were originally released and anyhow, I'm quite good at mentally skipping those and noticing that VdGG are in the top 20, along with PFM and Dream Theatre - hey I can look further down and see Riverside and Porcupine Tree and think - cool, that's really good going for albums that have only been released a few years - so I know that all is well with the world and the entire universe isn't going to disappear up Roger Water's backside.
 
In 1975 when Wish You Were Here was released we really didn't give a flying duck about how Prog it was, all we were interested in then was damn fine music recorded by a damn fine bands and Pink Floyd produced the goods so we were happy. We were so happy in fact that we bought it in sufficient numbers to get it to #1 in the album charts (sorry, but we didn't have the cash to do that with Close to the Edge or Selling England by the Pound, but you know, it was the seventies, in the UK we had strikes, power cuts and rising unemployment to worry about, the USA had it's own problems to deal with, students were rioting in France - well, you get the picture).
 
Pink Floyd have done it all - they have charted the course from psychedelic-pop through space-rock and mad improvisations to symphonic, ethereal, jazzy-pop, heavy-rock, latin-themed music, folk-music and pure progressive-rock covering every subject under the sun in linear concepts, abstract concepts, emotional concepts and reaccuring concepts. And everytime they did this they created their own rules (for other others to take or discard as they wished). Pink Floyd may not have written THE rules on prog, but they showed everyone how it should be done, and (horrors!) even made a bit of money doing it.
 
To me that is what progressive means - not long compositions, layering, wierd time-signatures and clever lyrics (though Floyd all did those in abundance, and in many cases they were one of the first bands to do them)
 
On this site I have read pages of arguments on how X is prog but Y is not, or how band Z made some prog albums and then made some non-prog albums, and to be honest it is all just opinion. A band is either a prog band or it isn't and if a prog band makes a non-prog album, then so what? what does that mater? what does it prove?
 
I've been listening to Wish You Were Here for 32 years and it still astounds and astonishes me. I would like to hope that we will be saying the same thing about Porcupine Tree and Pain of Salvation in 30 years time. (honestly, I do, and I think we will).
 
You say it isn't prog. I disagree: WYWH is a very cynical album about the music industry, something that Roger Waters started in 1969 with Cymbaline and again in 1972 with Free Four, (and has carried on with for the rest of his career). But cynicism, being a negative emotion, is never an easy starting point, yet Floyd managed to make the music carry this sentiment without being completely contemptuous of what they were trying to say, because I find that the music is strangely optimistic (ref: the title track) - a conterpoint to the lyrics - that's a fairly progressive concept isn't it. Tongue
 
I'm sorry if WYWH isn't prog enough for you, but let us have this discussion in 2039 and see if you think the same. (I'll be 82 by then, so I might just permit you to shout, but only so as I can hear you) Smile
 
We are just two lost souls
Swiming in a fish bowl, year after year
Running over the same old ground.
What have we found? The same old fears.
 
Wish You Were Here.
What?
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Points: 1402 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 14:09
Originally posted by Arsillus Arsillus wrote:

Dude, stop freaking out over that list. It's a nice addition to the site based on collective ratings. And it's good for n00bs. But other than that, don't take it so seriously! It's not like an official declaration on the "best" prog albums. Stern%20Smile

So stop complaining about the list. Pinch

But for the record, WYWH is an awesome album. I wouldn't put it an #2, but whatever. Talk about the four most haunting notes in music.

 
Agreed. There are quite a few albums I wouldn't have in the top 100, but then, that's only my opinion
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Points: 176 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 13:31
^^ Hmm.  Personally, I don't think exceptions should make a band eligible for inclusion in the site.  There are quite a few bands who have one or two songs that could easily fit into 'prog', but if those elements are almost always not present in their music, then the band probably should not be called a prog-band.

Then of course you get into what if a band starts out as prog and turns into something else, or starts as something else and turns into prog... 

I'm not going to talk about Deep Purple in particular though, because I'm not familiar with enough of their music to do so.
Check out the Unsigned Bands section!
"Like the time I ran away, and turned around and you were standing close to me." Yes' Awaken
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Points: 4079 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 13:21
Originally posted by emdiar emdiar wrote:

I'm sorry. I seemed to have logged on to some spoof prog site on which up is down and black is white and Lewis Carroll is chief moderator.
 
Deep Purple? Prog? Never in a hundred million years!!!!!!!!
 
No one will deny they have strong heavy rock moments. But here a re two exceptions.
 
Listen to "Concerto for Group and Orchestra"
 
I also think "Abandon" and "Deep Purple" lends themselves to Prog.
 
Jon Lord also made attempts to fuse classical to rock on the keys.
 
If DP is Prog, then neither is Floyd. That's how I see it.
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Points: 7374 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 13:01
Originally posted by toolis toolis wrote:

Originally posted by The Whistler The Whistler wrote:

Originally posted by Arsillus Arsillus wrote:

Talk about the four most haunting notes in music.

 

But there are six notes in the "Aqualung" riff...?



maybe the other two notes aren't that haunting..






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Points: 890 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 12:57
Floyd is a great place to start for anyone interested in prog. listen to all their albums  and you'll see they're Prog with a capital P. Purple are Heavy Rock. No Purple fan at my old school back in the day ever saw themselves as being a member of the prog crowd. What's more, none of us proggers considered Purple to be "our thing", with the possible exception of "Child in Time", which we considered a nice try, but that's all. Keyboards do not a prog band make. 
Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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Points: 176 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 12:42
My brain is spinning in my head.

I feel like I shouldn't post here because It's just continuing the madness... but I can't seem to help myself.  My fingers are moving by themselves!!!!!!!

The star ratings aren't a rating of how proggy an album is, but rather how 'good' it is overall (which is at least to an extent a matter of taste).  So once an album is on the site, it's fair game for the top 100... it sounds like what you want is a list of the 'most proggy' albums, but that would be quite difficult considering how hard it is to quantify what 'proggy' is.

Besides, it's not worth worrying about.  If someone comes on here thinking to themselves, 'I'm going to get a list of good prog stuff so I can find out if I like it' they aren't only going to buy whatever's in the #2 spot (or #1 for that matter).  They'll probably take a wider sampling of the stuff, and if they don't then they've been very silly.
Check out the Unsigned Bands section!
"Like the time I ran away, and turned around and you were standing close to me." Yes' Awaken
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Points: 890 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 12:29
I'm sorry. I seemed to have logged on to some spoof prog site on which up is down and black is white and Lewis Carroll is chief moderator.
 
Deep Purple? Prog? Never in a hundred million years!!!!!!!!
 
 
Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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