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The Whistler 
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
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 Topic: "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"
Posted: October 15 2007 at 02:36 |
 Barla wrote:
I have heard only the Transatlantic version of "In Held Twas I" (what does that mean??) and hasn't surprised me much. Is it very different to the original song?
BTW, I need to check Procol Harum out.
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I think that the band is screwing us over a bit if they say it has no meaning; I think that there's something there, it just happens to be slightly scattershot and purely tongue-in-cheek (the song I mean, the title IS just an anagram of sorts).
As for the Procolers, of course you have to check 'em out. I still believe that they're the most underrated band ever. And, in a pure act of shameless self promotion, I've just reviewed this album of theirs (as well as the debut (both are classics, by the by), but that's older. More informative band-wise though).
Edited by The Whistler - October 15 2007 at 02:37
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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jammun
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 14 2007
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Points: 3449
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Posted: October 11 2007 at 22:24 |
According to the band, In Held Twas In I means nothing. It was random words from the various sections of the song.
On a side note, what are the best CD versions of these? Are they the Repertoire releases? Some other label? I really need to replace my 40 year old vinyl.
And I seem to remember that the piano break in Walpurgis is a Bach Two-Part Invention.
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Barla
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Location: Argentina
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Posted: October 10 2007 at 19:18 |
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I have heard only the Transatlantic version of "In Held Twas I" (what does that mean??) and hasn't surprised me much. Is it very different to the original song?
BTW, I need to check Procol Harum out.
Edited by Barla - October 10 2007 at 19:19
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
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Points: 7113
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Posted: October 10 2007 at 05:19 |
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Very popular with the prog set, when you think about it.
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
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Points: 10617
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Posted: October 08 2007 at 08:57 |
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Yes it was, nice thing about lifting from the powdered wig set is that you don't have to pay royalties.
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
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Points: 7113
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Posted: October 08 2007 at 03:49 |
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Yeah, they have VERY similar drum intros. "Walpurgis" has a somewhat Bach-ian feel about it...and I believe that, speaking of Bach, "Whiter Shade" was a take on "Air on a G String."
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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salmacis
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Content Addition
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Posted: October 06 2007 at 10:38 |
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^I meant that both 'Garden Fence' and 'Walpurgis' have a sort of classical feel about them that 'Whiter Shade Of Pale' did; 'Garden Fence' with its organ refrain and the organ/piano work on 'Repent Walpurgis'. Whether or not they borrow from any classical works as 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' definitely did, I've no idea though.
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
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Points: 7113
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Posted: October 06 2007 at 02:27 |
salmacis wrote:
PH's early material has been endlessly recycled to the point that one can be easily blase about it due to the mishandling (compared to, say, Genesis who have not been burdened with endless compilations, really), but listening to their debut they were ahead of their time. 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' is the most obvious example of their classical/rock crossover, but 'She Wandered Through The Garden Fence' and the doomy instrumental 'Repent Walpurgis' is in a vaguely similar mode, IMHO. 'In Held 'Twas In I' is their most adventurous piece, and I would argue one of the most adventurous pieces in rock music up to that point. I certainly feel it had an impact on Genesis' 'Supper's Ready', to name but one.
I think the band's classical/rock fusions were more subtle than The Moody Blues' were. I think Procol Harum's music has generally stood the test of time better; there are moments of pure hilarity on The Moody Blues albums to be had nowadays (mainly the 'poetry'; even though on Procol Harum's 'In Held 'Twas In I' there is a narrated section, I think it's much more tongue-in-cheek than The Moody Blues' ones), and I find the string arrangements on 'Days Of Future Passed' to be a bit tedious, plus there is very little actual integration between the band and the orchestra. This unfortunate 'band plays a bit, orchestra plays a bit' trait was used as the template for Deep Purple's similarly non-cohesive 'Concerto For Group And Orchestra'. |
Oh yeah. The Procolers were way more inventive, technically inclined and FAR less pretentious than the Moodies...probably because they were tongue in cheek. Amazingly enough, the poetry that opens the "In Held" bit I find to be largely inoffensive, unlike, say, "Senior citizens wish they were young." And Procol Harum invented metal, you know.
"Garden Fence" and "Walpurgis" the same? What, you talkin' 'bout the drum intro? They're identical really. But other than that...
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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Easy Money
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Joined: August 11 2007
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Posted: October 05 2007 at 22:59 |
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I would recommend the original recording of 'In Held Twas in I' over the live one with orchestra, it has a lot more creative production in a late 60s psychedelic kind of way. Also I would get it on vinyl, most old records with lots of analogue effects sound better on vinyl. Just make sure your copy is in good shape. It is a really cool record. That style of late 6os sound cannot be duplicated again.
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jammun
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 14 2007
Location: United States
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Points: 3449
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 22:26 |
Apparently, life IS INDEED like a beanstalk. Saw this today:
LONDON - The lead singer of British band Procol Harum is appealing a judgment awarding the group's former organist 40 percent of the royalties from their iconic hit "A Whiter Shade of Pale."
So the band, or their lawyers, are going to go a few more rounds in court.
Regarding my assertion that Conquistador was a minor hit, I stand corrected. It apparently reached #16 on the Billboard Top 40. Being a prog fanatic at the time (meaning I only listened to FM), I plead ignorance, which I realize is no defense.
So who's going to start the "You better listen anybody, 'cos it's me and you that's it" thread?
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JayDee
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:44 |
bhikkhu wrote:
They covered "In Held 'Twas I" on their debut. I highly recommend getting both of their albums. |
Hell yeah! 
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soundsweird
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 08 2005
Location: United States
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Points: 408
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 22:45 |
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I just listened to the "Live" CD today, actually just the track "In Held Twas I", after seeing this thread the other day. The live version is similar to the studio version, but not identical. The live version of "Conquistador", incidentally, did get a lot of airplay at the time, so I wouldn't characterize it as a "minor hit". As proof, I offer the fact that most karaoke books I've seen list "Whiter Shade" and "Conquistador" by Procol Harum. The album had great sound quality for its time, and I'd compare it to "Caravan & The New Symphonia" in terms of the blending of rock band and orchestra (and choir).
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jammun
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Joined: July 14 2007
Location: United States
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Points: 3449
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 20:46 |
Yep, they did an album with the orchestra you mention. The album's version of Conquistador was a minor hit at the time. I think this album is overlooked (in comparison to Days of Future Passed or the Deep Purple Concerto) because new material is not being presented. Basically it's the band playing some of their better known songs with an orchestra in tow. I don't think I've ever seen it on CD, but then again haven't been looking for it. Edit: checked Amazon and it's available (import).
Edited by jammun - October 02 2007 at 21:56
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debrewguy
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 18:08 |
salmacis wrote:
PH's early material has been endlessly recycled to the point that one can be easily blase about it due to the mishandling (compared to, say, Genesis who have not been burdened with endless compilations, really), but listening to their debut they were ahead of their time. 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' is the most obvious example of their classical/rock crossover, but 'She Wandered Through The Garden Fence' and the doomy instrumental 'Repent Walpurgis' is in a vaguely similar mode, IMHO. 'In Held 'Twas In I' is their most adventurous piece, and I would argue one of the most adventurous pieces in rock music up to that point. I certainly feel it had an impact on Genesis' 'Supper's Ready', to name but one.
I think the band's classical/rock fusions were more subtle than The Moody Blues' were. I think Procol Harum's music has generally stood the test of time better; there are moments of pure hilarity on The Moody Blues albums to be had nowadays (mainly the 'poetry'; even though on Procol Harum's 'In Held 'Twas In I' there is a narrated section, I think it's much more tongue-in-cheek than The Moody Blues' ones), and I find the string arrangements on 'Days Of Future Passed' to be a bit tedious, plus there is very little actual integration between the band and the orchestra. This unfortunate 'band plays a bit, orchestra plays a bit' trait was used as the template for Deep Purple's similarly non-cohesive 'Concerto For Group And Orchestra'. |
Didn't Procol Harum put out a live album with the Edmonton Philharmonic Orchestra ? If I remember some reviews, it's seen as one of the few successful attempts at melding the rock group & classical orchestra.
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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salmacis
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Content Addition
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 10:32 |
PH's early material has been endlessly recycled to the point that one can be easily blase about it due to the mishandling (compared to, say, Genesis who have not been burdened with endless compilations, really), but listening to their debut they were ahead of their time. 'A Whiter Shade Of Pale' is the most obvious example of their classical/rock crossover, but 'She Wandered Through The Garden Fence' and the doomy instrumental 'Repent Walpurgis' is in a vaguely similar mode, IMHO. 'In Held 'Twas In I' is their most adventurous piece, and I would argue one of the most adventurous pieces in rock music up to that point. I certainly feel it had an impact on Genesis' 'Supper's Ready', to name but one.
I think the band's classical/rock fusions were more subtle than The Moody Blues' were. I think Procol Harum's music has generally stood the test of time better; there are moments of pure hilarity on The Moody Blues albums to be had nowadays (mainly the 'poetry'; even though on Procol Harum's 'In Held 'Twas In I' there is a narrated section, I think it's much more tongue-in-cheek than The Moody Blues' ones), and I find the string arrangements on 'Days Of Future Passed' to be a bit tedious, plus there is very little actual integration between the band and the orchestra. This unfortunate 'band plays a bit, orchestra plays a bit' trait was used as the template for Deep Purple's similarly non-cohesive 'Concerto For Group And Orchestra'.
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MonkeyphoneAlex
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 27 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 234
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Posted: October 01 2007 at 08:16 |
Atavachron wrote:
^ Mike Portnoy (Dream theater), Ronnie Stolt (Flower Kings), Neal Morse (Spock's Beard), Pete Trewavas (Marillion)
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Roine Stolt, actually. Sorry if I'm being a prick about it.
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"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST."
-FZ
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MonkeyphoneAlex
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Location: United States
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Posted: October 01 2007 at 08:14 |
bhikkhu wrote:
Transatlantic did a pretty nice cover of it too. |
Indeed they did. I prefer the original, though. But isn't that always the way it is?
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"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST."
-FZ
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 7113
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Posted: October 01 2007 at 02:27 |
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Only "both?" That's sad...oh well, I like the Procolers, and I like doomed bands (Family, Carmen...). I'll keep 'em in mind.
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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bhikkhu
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Posted: September 28 2007 at 09:39 |
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They covered "In Held 'Twas I" on their debut. I highly recommend getting both of their albums.
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 7113
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Posted: September 28 2007 at 02:35 |
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Oh. Cool. Progressive supergroup. And they covered...what exactly, the album? The title tune? "In Held?" I'd do the title tune. It's awesome.
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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"Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"
