What is the best record as an intro to prog?
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Topic: What is the best record as an intro to prog?
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Subject: What is the best record as an intro to prog?
Date Posted: March 09 2012 at 18:27
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What is the best record as an introduction to prog-rock?
I have a clue how to answer this question: something accessible, non-embarrassing, and quintessential of the genre. It all depends on the user: either "Dark Side of the Moon" or "Red." Gee, if I had to choose, ... let it be "Dark Side of the Moon." What do you think?
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Replies:
Posted By: Gallifrey
Date Posted: March 10 2012 at 02:07
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If the person you're trying to convert likes Alt Rock, then Porcupine Tree's Fear Of A Blank Planet. If the person likes indie rock, then probably something like Dark Side Of The Moon If the person like Hard Rock stuff, the Rush's 2112 is quite good. Those are the only genres I have a real grasp on. ------------- http://thedarkthird.bandcamp.com/ |
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: March 10 2012 at 03:43
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i would let him hear Fragile by Yes, Foxtrot by Genesis, In the Wake of Poseidon by King Crimson, Lefroverture by Kansas, Images and Words by DT, Saga - Chapters Live,
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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 10 2012 at 03:46
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There isn't one. It all depends on the individual. My all purpose one would be Foxtrot though. Fragile isn't a bad option either. Leftoverture isn't bad. Would probably stick with the KC original or Red. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: March 10 2012 at 07:34
| I'd probably go with Close To The Edge |
Posted By: yanch
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 07:19
| For me it would be Foxtrot, Close to the Edge, and maybe Animals. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 12:29
 In The Court Of The Crimson King - King Crimson or Close To The Edge - Yes  ------------- 
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Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:11
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Spock's Beard - Day for Night ------------- |
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:25
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He to the He Mirage Red Time and a Word ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: infocat
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:32
This is a joke, right? ------------- -- Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
Barbu wrote:Posted By: Atoms
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:34
| I have converted few of my friend to prog by just showing them what I am currently listening to. It usually has worked pretty far. However, the only album I can comment on is: You by Gong. It was the first album my father gave me, and it got me hooked on prog instantly (and to this day Canterbury is still my favorite sub-genre in prog.). And I don't think that album is widely regarded as a "good" first prog record. |
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:37
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Agreed, i think that would be a terrible place to start. But i dislike the album anyway - so my opinion is bias. ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:39
Nope. ------------- |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:45
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It's kind of a silly question. I'm not giving a 13 year old kid who listens mostly to fake metalcore bands an album from the 70s with a style he'd probably describe with some slur directed at the sexual orientation of the makers. I'm probably going to give him something like Between the Buried and Me. It depends on the person you're attempting to target so the question really has no reasonable answer.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: mongofa
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 13:57
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Gentle Giant - Free Hand ------------- 
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Posted By: Ambient Hurricanes
Date Posted: March 11 2012 at 14:01
I'll go with the one that introduced me: ------------- I love dogs, I've always loved dogs |
Posted By: zoviet
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 00:40
yep its hard to recomm something w/o really knowing the person's tendencies first. I came from a synth pop/indie/punk rock background so i wasnt particularly overwhelmed by something like KC's In the court....when i first heard it. But whn i got my hands on Tortoise's Millions Now Living Will Never Die, hahah that was it for me........... |
Posted By: zoviet
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 00:42
| and i can tell you that among the Big 6, i still up to this day cannot get into Genesis, Tull and ELP, and Rush is still an acquired taste........so some of the 'classics' wouldnt work on some folk! |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 01:23
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I actually kind of agree with Barbu - Spock's `Day For Night', `The Kindess Of Strangers', even `V' or some of `Snow' would be an ideal place to start, simply because those albums have lots of excellent progressive sections connected with rock music that is almost commercial and...radio friendly?
I mean, they're not the most outstanding examples of progressive rock, but especially `Day For Night' could click with people more used to straight-forward pop/rock, and it's got a lot of emphasis on great melodies with a catchy chorus or two. Perhaps a way to ease someone into the `prog' way of thinking? 
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Posted By: centum
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 02:14
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I'd say there's a distance between a contemporary listener and 70's music so the into to prog should be contemporary as well Meshuggah probably introduced more people to prog that KC did after the 70s ------------- http://gelasson.wordpress.com/" rel="nofollow - DA MUZIK BLOG |
Posted By: ole-the-first
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 02:46
| In the Court of the Crimson King is the definitive prog album (and very accessible at the same time), so it should be a good intro. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 03:01
I don't know. I mean, it is really focused on the instrumental prowess and the fine marriage between timbre and melody or harmony. The pop-listening audience of today is, like, into lyricism, particularly sappy lyrics. I suppose most metal heads not well acquainted with prog would have no problem listening to Rush or Dream Theater.
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Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 03:05
| Dayvenkirq, when you asked the original question, were you asking with a specific person in mind? I mean, it makes a huge difference knowing what sort of age group the person is in, perhaps even what their current musical interests are too! :) |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 03:10
Noted. Clever point. In fact, you can assume specifics like what album would you suggest for this age range, etc.
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Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 12:29
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Although Neal Morse is far from being the best prog around, I agree that his music can be a good soft start for non-prog-trained ears (assuming the lyrics will not annoy the listener...)
Of the classics, Foxtrot, Selling England, The Lamb, ITCOTKC and Fragile are among the most paradigmatic for showing what prog used to be, what it used to mean.
Nowadays the concept of prog has expanded so much that many would never start by these albums and would instead recommend starting by DT, some Math Rock, PT, Beardfish or whatever.
A sampler of Selling England would be my pick, the intro a cappella of Dancing is very impressive, then you have the agressive part which will surely puzzle the listener, then I would skip I Know What I Like and directly to the magnificient Firth Of Fifth and then jump to After The Ordeal and let it play till the end (I know What I Like, Epping or More Fool Me are not bad but I think that this shortened sampler gives a great introduction to anyone new to prog).
Albums like CTTE or Relayer, as great as they are can be too hard to digest for a beginner.
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Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 12:58
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I think Dancing with the Moonlit Knight works well as a single track to introduce and represent prototypical prog. Fragile is probably the closest thing as an album, and is still accessible to a neophyte.
But what others have said about it depending on the audience is absolutely the essential point. Just not Naked City. Probably not VDGG. Probably not Ephel Duath either. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: PabstRibbon
Date Posted: March 12 2012 at 13:28
| I think it's better to start with a classic prog band. Pink Floyd is very good to start IMO. Listen to their discography in chronologic order |
Posted By: doribure
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 11:35
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I would recommend Porcupine Tree's In Absentia or Deadwing. Although i love bands from the 70's, i would not recommend them as an intro into prog, because for somebody who is used to the nowadays audio quality, listening to the sound of the 70's might be a turn off. Or i would burn a CD with a good balance between old and new, light and heavy stuff, from KC "I talk to the wind" to DT "Panic Attack", Rush "Subdivisions", Opeth "Hex Omega", Yes "Roundabout", PT "Gravity Eyelids", Anathema "Universal"... ------------- ■ www.dream-breaker.com ■ www.facebook.com/doribure ■ www.youtube.com/user/doribure |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 12:25
Hi Dayvenkirq,
 This is difficult to answer I think, because prog, unlike most simpler forms of music can take several listens to get into
so if you pick something too proggy(Gentle Giant or YES - Tales) you run the risk of turning off the listener prematurely.
So I think you are spot on with PF - Dark Side. (Though some proggers could say PF isn't really prog)
Also there are several sides to prog, prog metal, non-melodic(King Crimson) and classic prog. You may pick one of those and the person hates it and then they hate all prog forever! So you need to find out if they are into a more metal
or dissonant or more melodic prog. That's why I say its complicated.
I'm not a metal or dissonance guy so I would say:
Pink Floyd - The Wall or DSOTM
Spock's Beard - V
Glass Hammer - IF
YES - Fragile
RUSH - Moving Pictures
Transatlantic - sMPTE
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Posted By: iamathousandapples
Date Posted: March 28 2012 at 21:42
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Depends, but I think these are pretty good ways to go regardless Porcupine Tree - Fear of a Blank Planet King Crimson - Red Yes - The Yes Album (Actually have heard the trend of this being on a lot of recent commercials) Pure Reason Revolution - The Dark Third Pain of Salvation - Remedy Lane
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 00:51
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Tarkus tells you everything about prog. Classic symph prog with a very easy to understand title track. |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 01:04
I don't think The Wall or Dark Side of the Moon quintessentially Prog (I never really thought of those albums as Prog when I did consider albums such as Close to the Edge, Hamburger Concerto, and Trilogy Prog. I find earlier Pink Floyd more prog in a sense. I'd like to say Atom heart Mother for Pink Floyd, or Umagumma. Fragile and Hemispheres are what originally got me into Prog, but I know many are put off by Geddy Lee's vocals, and Fragile might seem a bit twee to some. I've tried to turn a number of people onto Prog, but I have tried to cater it to the person's tastes. I've had the most success with people with King Crimson, and obviously it is a very important band. I'd like to say Lizard, but In the Court would probably be the better introduction. I know that I adored 21st Century Schizoid Man when I first heard it. Not taking into account individual tastes, I do think a classic album the better intro to Prog than later stuff, and one that is considered historically important to Progressive Rock. had I started with Spock's Beard or Transatlantic, that probably would have been the end of my journey. It would have been better for me to start out with Magma, Van der Graaf Generator, Amon Duul II, Tangerine Dream, or Area, but tastes vary so much. Maybe I wouldn't have enjoyed those when I was young -- symph oriented music is where I got started. |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 21:42
Not at all Dude, "Now it's all done They live up in Monticello With some pizza pockets Some papers and a case of mello-yellow" I never joke about mello-yellow. Plus The Healing Colors Of Sound is about as Prog Righteous as you can get. Nice off-beat choice here, I say.  |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 21:44
Waaay too old Grandpa. If the person is 70 then fine, if not they will think you are some Flower Power Hippie Freak, which is not cool to today's generation. Not sure if that ever was cool... |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 21:49
Dude, how can you be so right on this one and so wrong on Chester Thompson fumbling his way through live Dance On A Volcano??? I think you found the perfect prog introduction record. ELP - Tarkus.  |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 29 2012 at 23:58
As it was mentioned before numerous times, this is a strictly subjective matter. "Tarkus" can tell you what prog is about. But what if we pick teens who are Taylor Swift or Justin Bieber fans?
 . No, seriously, if you were interacting with a young girl who is into teen-pop, what would you offer to convince her that prog isn't lame and pointless? Am I missing 1+ criteria? |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 30 2012 at 00:03
+1. KC's debut has some lengthy songs with lots of instrumental stuff, so it's hard for me to classify it as an accessible record if I were, say, a country girl. But if you do take in account the "definitive" aspect, he is right.
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: March 30 2012 at 00:48
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Kayo Dot's Dowsing Anemone with Copper Tongue.
Can's Tago Mago ------------- 
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Posted By: CloudZero
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 03:47
| +1 on 2112 |
Posted By: JS19
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 03:58
------------- 
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Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 09:18
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[QUOTE=Dayvenkirq] . No, seriously, if you were interacting with a young girl who is into teen-pop, /QUOTE] In that case they would probably arrest you. About Tarkus.... When we are standing in front of the mona lisa or sistene chapel or statue of david.... You will tell me those are not masterpieces and perfect works to present art to someone??? Tarkus is kinda like that you see! |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 09:27
Nobody tells me about all the secret code used around here. WTF is "+1"??? @Dayvenkirq, I was just having fun with ole-the-first, but he appears to have vanished... Obviously there is not definitive choice here. I am a silly English Bandit who steals flowers, but I am not completely stupid. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 10:12
Are you implying that most of the youngsters in the world, or at least in the US, are into Renaissance art? Because I'm not. BTW, come on, you know ... +1 ! ... like in Google!
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 10:48
You do not try to initiate a teen listening to Taylor Swift to prog. See if she likes something a little more sophisticated within pop first...maybe Fiona Apple. You might then see if she can break into Radiohead. If that works too, then maybe Pink Floyd. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 31 2012 at 22:30
Clever point
 . |
Posted By: Desert_Storm
Date Posted: April 01 2012 at 07:09
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I think I would probably pick a Spock's Album too, as suggested by somebody on the first page (involving the risk of making me unpopular with my second post in this forum ;) ). They're very accessible, have great melodies and are fun. Also, Porcupine Tree seems to offer a few albums that seem to serve rather well (e.g. Lightbulb Sun, In Absentia or Deadwing, depending of what the person in question listens to). Also I think a Live album or DVD is often more appropriate than a single album, since they mostly offer the best or most popular songs by a band from more than one output, which makes it easier to pick out favourites and than choose an album accordingly. I have seen Yes and ELP suggested here, that's certainly not something I would do. It took me quite some time to appreciate these bands as they sound quite eccentric and not really up to date. I love John Anderson's voice now, or the freaky beginning of close to the edge, but it seems to alienate most people that I know when I show it to them. I even was in a car once with about six people who listen to modern prog exclusively on our way to the Steven Wilson concert, and when a friend put on And You And I there were many wry looks and nobody was really able to make use of it. And this song is not one of Yes' more obscure songs. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 01 2012 at 14:32
Thanks (I think
 )For the benefit of people who don't hang on every word I type (misguided fools that they be
 ) I just said Chester Thompson was 'fine' on the Seconds Out version of DOAV and he is.Collins does give the toms a good battering on the studio version and it also seems slower and more stately..so its just different. I expect they upped the tempo on the live version so it just can't be played the same way. Funnily enough this also happened when ELP played Tarkus live |
Posted By: Stool Man
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 07:16
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Choosing just one record means omitting all the others. I'd say choose the best compilation out there, whatever that may be. It'd work as an introduction (which is what the OP asked for), and then afterwards the listener could hear other albums based on which compilation tracks they preferred. ------------- rotten hound of the burnie crew |
Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 13:57
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The Yes Album would be an excellent starting point. If you want something more modern, try The Flower Kings -- Stardust We Are ------------- 
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 14:45
I would probably start with ... NONE!
It will shock the audience and then you can move along ... the progressive movement is not something that came and went by our whims or some weird design of what music was or was supposed to become in the future ... like you and I already "knew" ...
This didn't start then, and the "progressive" phenomenon is not arbitrary based of one album, but was about the time and place, the music, the arts, the literature, the movies, the theater ... and what was happening at the time.
Anything else is superfluous and ... I think it reduces everything to Cliff Notes mentality for the masses! And the bad part? ... you can't have progressive music in a state of Cliff Notes! All of us would start the revolution all over again and probably call it Revolution #10 now ...
I think you have to make people aware of history better ... otherwise ... let's see ... do you go around saying that you listen to Beethoven because he was from the "romantic period"? .... and do you know anything, history wise about that time that helps you define that term and definition? ... now you know why I would like a much more quotidian study and definition for the term. You know the word, and you don't even know what it refers to or it means!
I say, EDUCATE ... instead of giving them just words and make it look like we know something ... that sometimes we don't ... we just have favorites!
------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 23:45
A tiny bit of what you've said is a bit over my head, but I think I got the general idea. And I very much like your point. However, I think you can throw us a name, answer to the best of your ability, even if it won't work for everyone. You may consider any standards you want since it looks like there are lots of things I haven't foreseen when writing the OP. So far these are perhaps the best answers that I've read:
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Posted By: Ambient Hurricanes
Date Posted: April 02 2012 at 23:57
But then you have to skip Bitches Crystal, The Only Way, Jeremy Bender, Are You Ready Eddy...everything but the title track and Infinite Space. ------------- I love dogs, I've always loved dogs |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 03 2012 at 14:48
Then I failed.
Again, one album or piece of music did not change the sun and the moon on a given day ... and for us to think that it did is ... weird!
It was a product of the time and place, and you can go as far back as the mopheads and what not ... but too many other arts had already been doing the progressive thing to a very extreme degree. You never saw the "Living Theater" do live experiments like only the Grateful Dead and Allman Brothers did .... you never saw the "National Theater of the Deaf" ... do improvisations in mime to rock music .... you never saw the ETC La Mama group ... use film for their "set" with the story in front of it for Carmilla ... talk about multi-media! And of course, you may know Tarantino, but you never saw Godard (or Weekend so you can appreciate Pulp Friction even better!) who was the ultimate free form spokesperson for film with more weirdness than anything you ever heard on vinyl, cassette or cd! But then, not many folks appreciate the incredible musicianship required for DT to do what they did with an Orchestra ... only master musicians have that ability ... but it doesn't matter ... only "prog" matters!
You have to see a bit beyond the "music" ... as people are not that isolated from the arts ... it's like me saying that you don't know movies, books or theater, or tv or anything ... you only know "progressive" ... and that is not true at all.
There is a lot more to life than just ... one thing! ... or we're definitly in a time warp of some kind! And a time warp on one word/idea? ... goodness ... you know how many writers have written about that in the last couple of thousands of years? ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Desert_Storm
Date Posted: April 03 2012 at 16:09
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@ Moshkito: While it's all nice and well to know the backgrounds, boundary-transcending influences and dynamics of any musical style I don't really understand what this has to do with the topic. Of course "progressive rock" was a movement of that time and it's good to see beyond the limits of music and look at the surroundings (like with any other musical period/genre), but in truth, after the initial movement passed, we put a label on it to make it easier to speak about certain bands that played a similar style of music (as we do with every musical period). So if one comes to me and asks me what this "progressive rock" thing is that people talk about, and what it sounds like, why not give him an album that you might consider more or less representative for what other such bands played at that time? And wasn't that what this topic was about in the first place? Or maybe I'm getting it all wrong, I'm not even sure if I completely understand your posts, e.g. the Beethoven comparison (if you want to label him he was late classical/first Viennese school). Of course the boundaries were all imposed on the music later on, but we still use them, and they're IMHO useful. Like if somebody doesn't know Domeniconi Scarlatti, you can tell him he was from the classical period, and he'll know more. Or if somebody wants to get to know the music of that period better, you can give him the second Beethoven Symphony, or Mozart's c-minor mass, or an early Haydn string quartet, and he'll have a clue of how it could sound the next time somebody mentions music from that period. Of course it would be nice if he knew about the influences from architecture and painting and enlightenment as well, but he has a nice point to start with with the works above, why not do the same with prog? After all the Thread Starter asked about an album as an introduction and not a detailed explanation of the whole movement? ------------- "I want you to know that you and I... are not all that different. I mean, I, too, am a neat guy. And I, too, am just a love machine." -Friends |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 01:10
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 01:13
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 12:52
I would suggest that "after the initial movement" ... things changed to something else ... that (sometimes) we do not consider "progressive".
I do this, even with my neighbor, who loves music and then saw all those LP's and CD's and he went ... wow ... what is all that? I told him that it was music, just like the stuff he likes, but it is from different places in the world, and sometimes called this or that or this or that ... and he said ... can I hear some?
And he liked YES, though he had heard "Roundabout" and had it in his collection, but did not know the band.
You know what it feels like to me sometimes? ... it's almost like we're telling folks that "progressive" is like ... if you want to go to San Francisco, be sure to wear flowers in your hair ... " and some folks are not going to like that and think that is stupid and crazy! I'm not a hippy!
So, in a way, I prefer to take that part out, with the inevitable problem that by being "quotidian" I am placing this in the middle of that "flowers in your hair" thing ... and the difference is ... there were a lot of people that did really good music ... and we just have not met those people, or that music.
It's like seeing a forest instead of one tree, or vice versa. I'm not sure that you can "exemplify" a concept with one album or one band. That is really an uneducated idea that your own professor and instructor is going to hammer you on. You can use it as an example, But your professor is going to say ... that's one example ... let's have more showing this and this and this and that ... which you did not show.
I get the issue ... make it simple stupid ... but sometimes, all you are doing is hurting the very lover and thing you want to protect and love ... and you have to help it better than that ... and I like to say ... "educate" ... rather than sound like some expert that thinks they know music better than anyone else ... none of us do ... besides suggesting that the musicians are too stupid to create their own work and not use a pre-defined process to create something ... and that is another story! ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Desert_Storm
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 14:24
Thanks a lot for the eloquence compliment :) It wasn't my intention to put somebody in his place, I was just not sure if I understood what Moshkito said, and if I did, I disagree. And it seems it doesn't get any better here 
So the music those bands played can't be called progressive anymore?
Sorry, I completely fail to understand that
Of course there were, of course we haven't. What has that got to do with it?
Well thanks for calling my ideas uneducated. By the way, what you say my professor (whoever you mean, I didn't know you knew I study or what or with whom) would "hammer me on", I'm sorry to disappoint you, but picking examples to explain the big with the small or the general with the particular is exactly what we do where I study. A professor wants to explain the, let's say baroque variation form and he starts with showing us Bach's Goldberg Variations. After we analyse it, we look what it has in common with other variation works from that time and whats different, and thus get a picture how to stake off the respective genre. This is very common in music, I've read tons of books about musical morphology and analysis and about every author that comes to my mind uses this method. So you're still free to disagree with the complete methodology but if you want to do that and still be taken seriously I would like to know a little something about your background. By the way, after typing this, it comes to my mind that it was absolutely superfluous. Taking examples to explain something is used all the time in all disciplines and in real life. Look at anything you want. In physics we teach gravity by throwing one example object on the floor and examine how it falls. In Language we pick one correct or incorrect example sentence to show what's grammatically/logically/whatever right or wrong. In biology we watch one example plant or animal develop and thus explain evolution. Look at the children: "Mommy, what are rocks?", and the mother will pick up some random rocks from the ground and say "those things". Should she better say "Well, that depends, there are many concepts regarding the definition of what is a rock and what not, and in each concepts there are many different materials in many different forms that qualify as rocks, so showing you one would not help you at all" ? Come on, it's ridiculous.
Of course multiple examples are better than one, but that was not the point. The point is that if you don't have multiple, one is infinitely better than none.
------------- "I want you to know that you and I... are not all that different. I mean, I, too, am a neat guy. And I, too, am just a love machine." -Friends |
Posted By: Anthony
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 15:08
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Marillion - Marbles ------------- Future prosperity lies in the way you heal the world with love (Introitus - The hand that feeds you) |
Posted By: silcir
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 16:08
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From a Pop perspective - MAybe Peter Gabriel MEtal perspective - DT Rock perspective - Porcupine tree Jazz - Santana perhaps |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: April 04 2012 at 21:11
I don't think there is a "best record". To whom are introducing prog-rock to? Your grandmother who thinks The Beatles are the devil's music? An eleven year-old girl who listens to the Disney Channel and Nickelodeon? Someone in a coma for the last 40 years who hasn't heard any? What are we talking about here?
------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 01:48
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 09:40
The only sad thing in all this, is that you all take the socialist part so seriously ... you have to agree with each other in order to express yourself!
You really think, that all the "progressive" music is about that? Do you have a conceptual understanding of what it really means, other than just a "hit" or another "song"? I don't believe so!
You can call me a goon (that's an honor!) or an idiot (how sweet to be an idiot!), and anything else you like. But one thing I'm not lacking is ... individuality, and personality ... because those are the two things required and needed to get some attention out there in the world of the arts.
Go ahead .. be my guest ... do what everyone else already does ... and hope to get noticed! Good luck! Then come over here and call me something else when you only had 4 streams running and several friends never made it, or cared to bother! They already have the CD's and heard it hundred times! How "prog" that is! ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 14:09
Well it was the way you said Chester plays just "fine" in your original post. It kinda came off like a youngster standing
atop the stairs with their fists folded against their sides, elbows out, defiantly exclaiming "fine" send me to bed without
any desert, "fine" see if I care! (At least that is how it came across to me and my court appointed therapist.
)So I thought it needed further discussion, which by the way, sure took you a long enough time to find that continuing discussion, here in this very thread!
But yes, I agree a 2nd time, if there was only one record to show what prog is about, I dare say you can't go wrong with Tarkus!
  And for the jokers who said Are You Ready Eddie? was a track that killed an otherwise great record, I say again:
It was a last minute jam/composition when the band was told(after recording was completed) that the album was a few minutes short and they needed one more song. Since ELP had no more songs written, they did a quickie improv and that was put at the end of Tarkus. And yeah, Are You Ready Eddie? has some absolutely kick-ass piano in it.
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Posted By: dennismoore
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 14:33
Oh dear, oh dear and Holy Bat Crap, Batman!
For the record:
Bitches Crystal is an amazing prog-hard rocker. Lake's powerful singing yet forcefull screaming may have singlehandedly invented a whole genre of harder rock, a more quintessential song, you will not find.
(Oh and let's not forget the absolute wicked screaming moog lines in that tune.)
The Only Way: it may turn off some Bible thumpers, but it is keyboard masterfulness, and since ELP is a KEYBOARD driven band, lots of keys and a genuine pipe organ shouldn't be so hard to handle.
Jeremy Bender: fun, yet very difficult to play ragtime ditty(done quite originally, mind you) whose words have left us wondering for decades, what was Jeremy Bender really all about??? I personally think it was written about Richard M. Nixon.
Are You Ready Eddy? Writen & recorded on the fly since the band ran out of compositions yet needed more songs for the record length, but still has some brilliant hard rock piano improv. despite being a last second tune
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Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: April 05 2012 at 14:42
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Still sucks. ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 14:42
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OK, how about this: my mother keeps listening to this guy Phillip Phillips from the American Idol, and she keeps listening to him out loud, and she even sent me an e-mail with a link to his performance. That's just being obtrusive. BTW, she enjoys Whitney Houston and, yeah, those freaking songs done by Phillip Phillips. She doesn't seem to care much for The Beatles. She heard Yes' "Your Move/I've Seen All Good People" several times and wasn't really impressed. She was very annoyed with Argent's "Hold Your Head Up". I played on YouTube that piano bit Tony Banks played during an interview that back in the day became the theme for the piano and flute from "Firth of Fifth", and she is all like, phlegmatically: "That's easy to play". Nor was she impressed with Banks' keyboard work in the intro of "The Lamb" (the title track): "Oh, yeah, that's tough to play". She also doesn't seem to care much for that famous memorable guitar line from SOYCD where the drums start. Oh, and yeah, I played Popol Vuh's "Ah!" off of "Hosianna Mantra" and PF's "A Saucerful of Secrets" (the title track), and she commented: "Madman's music". Please, somebody help me out to get her freaking mind off of the freaking Phillip Phillips. It's becoming a real problem now.
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Posted By: nima1024
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 14:49
| I would suggest to start with some not-very-complex Symphonic Prog tracks, I would albums, Camel & Mirage, Foxtrot or Selling England, The Wall and then we can go for Fragile, maybe. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 15:06
| ^ Any tracks in particular? ... since I have a lot to choose from. I don't know if "The Wall" is something she will understand musically. There are lots of heavy tracks on it. |
Posted By: nima1024
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 15:10
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Yes, some tracks are really very good for start, for example. - I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe) - Comfortably Numb - Slow Yourself Down - Never Let Go - Owner of a Lonely Heart - From the Beginning or Lucky Man If she could handle that, you can go for, - Dancing With the Moonlit Knight - Can-Utility and the Coastliners - Roundabout - Trilogy (by ELP) - Lady Fantasy (This is dangerous, as it's much more complex than others. :D) There are also very good songs to start. ;) |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 15:20
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^ Thank you . I hope those aren't just tracks that you like, but tracks that can potentially remedy my problem. Thanks so much. Anyone else?
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Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 15:34
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I'd just give someone Close to the Edge and tell them to listen to it and do nothing else. Just through them right into prog. ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow">  The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: nima1024
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 15:42
I also thought at it first, but the thing is that it's a long album and it might be hard for them to hold themselves and listen to the 18-mins masterpiece. We need shorter tracks at first introduction. ;) |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 16:11
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Oh, how about this: something that's NOT ELECTRIC-guitar driven, something abundant with melody, something that has meaningful (profound, but not in a cheesy or commonsensical way) lyrics and doesn't demonstrate instrumental prowess so much. I don't want to convert her (I hate the word in this context, 'cause we are not religious fanatics), I just want her to understand the genre to at least a slight extent. Now that I think about it, nima1024's recommendations fit the bill.
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Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 16:11
| This may sound cheesy, but for introducing prog to a pop-rock listener in a soft way I think that Moon Safari's Blomljud can be an effective album. It's actually melodic pop-rock with good prog structure and arrangements. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 16:12
^  . Will check it out.
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 16:16
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Also, it has to be something that's not monotonous. Edit: I forgot to mention that she hated "Inner Mounting Flame" by the Mahavishnu Orchestra. ??? She hated the fast stuff and the loud guitar.
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Posted By: gerdtheater
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 23:19
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I will start with EL&P Tarkus Rush's 2112 or Moving Pictures Dream Theater's Images and Words Yes Tales from Topographic Oceans Genesis The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway ------------- Playing a three-hour Rush show is like running a marathon while solving equations. Neil Peart |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: May 29 2012 at 23:37
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 01:25
Sorry, I don't think much of this will work. Long stuff and electric-guitar-driven songs, as I mentioned far up above, won't do. Good call on "The Lamb", though. I'm actually considering playing her "The Lamia" or "In the Rapids" (no, the latter probably won't impress her) or something like that, or maybe some of the short stuff off of "Tarkus" (the album).
I will consider that ... although I hate it when artists/bands make grotesque twins. No, wait ... she is not into jazz, let alone jazz-rock.
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Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 02:24
Cardiacs - A Little Man and a House and the Whole World Window Captain Beefheart - Trout Mask Replica King Crimson - Larks Tounges in Aspic ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 03:27
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Posted By: nima1024
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 03:32
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I highly suggest you not to start with Avant-prog and Eclectic Prog, as she will be extremely disappointed. Especially, avoid Larks' (Part I and II), I mainly do not recommend King Crimson for start, but if you really want that, Epitaph or In The Wake of The Poseidon would be much better than others KC tracks which are much complex. |
Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 03:38
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TRY the following I would say as an intro to Prog. I would say from my prog experience that there are 7 wonders of the prog world in the way of songs: Van Der Graaf Generator's 'A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers', Yes' 'Close To The Edge', ELP's 'Karn Evil 9', King Crimson's '21st Century Schizoid Man', Pink Floyd's 'Shine On', Rush's '2112', and Genesis' 'Supper's Ready'. The seven wonders of the prog world in the way of albums are similar as far as I am concerned: Van Der Graaf Generator's "Pawn Hearts", Yes' "Close To The Edge", ELP's "Brain Salad Surgery", King Crimson's "In The Court of The Crimson King", Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of The Moon", Jethro Tull's "Thick As A Brick", and Genesis' "Foxtrot". ------------- 
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 03:48
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^ Out of all these I would seriously consider DSOTM and "Shine On" (since my mother grew up with the latter, although time passed by and she didn't seem to be very enthused with it). A little refresher:
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Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 04:08
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Theres always a Prog compilation this one is not the ultimate by any means but theres enough on here to show what you can expect in the Prog genre one of the cheapest and the best is 
This is a unique 2 CD compilation packed with masterpieces of the progressive rock genres from EMI, Century Media and Super Ball's catalogues. Includes original legends of the genre such as Jethro Tull, Barclay James Harvest, Van Der Graaf Generator Steve Hackett and contemporary stars such as including Oceansize, The Flower Kings, Riverside and The Tangent. The Tracklist has been compiled with the help of Classic Presents Prog magazine’s editor, Jerry Ewing, who also contributed the sleeves notes. With an affordable low price, Prog Rocks offers a broad insight into the delights of progressive music! Tracklisting 1. Cross Eyed Mary - Jethro Tull 1. Rubycon (Part One) [Excerpt] [2000 - Remaster] - Tangerine Dream -------------
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Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 04:21
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Also check out the film clips of the artists talking about the most proggish albums. http://www.progrocks.co.uk/progrocks/Exclusive-Video/" rel="nofollow - http://www.progrocks.co.uk/progrocks/Exclusive-Video/
Worth checking the clips of Anderson, and Stolte, if nothing else. -------------
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 04:26
| ^ Top notch! Thanks! I'll check out all of this first thing in the morning. |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 05:45
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Here's a related anecdote. So, after holding on for a long time in order to give her a decent education in 60s/70s classic rock and folk, I finally let my girlfriend listen to ITCOTCK yesterday. I kept telling her to be receptive to the huge break it meant from '60s music, and I even made a preliminary playlist for that day consisting of '68/early '69 albums (Rolling Stones, Beatles, Zeppelin, Jeff Beck, Pink Floyd, Moody Blues, Van Morrison, Pretty Things, etc.) - only to realize, while listening to ITCOTCK, that the affinities are stronger than the break, in fact, and the break is in details that will only be better revealed with hindsight (getting to know '70s prog and the direction that KC later took). She loved it and asked why the hell did I keep it hidden for so long.  |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 09:34
------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 09:36
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I was coming up with the most progressive albums I could think of. ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 13:06
Thanks for the story. She genuinely meant that? 'Cause I wasn't there, and you know better. Seriously, she liked it?  ... I don't know if that's gonna work for my mother. I might put on "I Talk to the Wind", "Epitaph" (risky business), "The Court -//-" (an even riskier business). |
Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 13:56
| What about Yes Drama? the sound is pop-friendly enough but the music is prog enough. 90125 would also be a possibility, even more pop-ear-friendly. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 14:09
... A-a-a-a-and it's also on my list. Thanks.
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Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 15:57
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Dayvenkirg, how about putting on Crime Of The Century or some Barclay James Harvest for your mother? That seems to fit your descriptions.
-------------
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 16:21
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Rather than albums, I do prefer to hit people with tracks (preferably with trains on them). A few years ago with a female friend I hit her with this: And then right after with this: ... |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 16:43
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^ I didn't know Magma ventured into the world of New-Wavy synth pop. Wow . About the songs presented: I don't think she would be pleased with the monotonicity of the former and the weirdness of the latter. Speaking of weirdness: I played "More Songs About Buildings And Food" to her ... she hated that too! I tried to explain to her the meaning of the lyrics on "Found A Job", and she wasn't impressed with them. She found them cheap! ??? (I know it's only prog-related, but it's just a little hint for ya.)
I'll go check it out.
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That seems to fit your descriptions. Posted By: The_Jester
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 17:06
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I went into prog by listening to A Passion Play wich I consider a real masterpiece but I guess Selling England By the Pound would be a better starting point for it is prog, it is a masterpiece and it is a classic. ------------- La victoire est éphémère mais la gloire est éternelle! - Napoléon Bonaparte |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 17:06
| By the way, one more thing I forgot to mention: she was a bit enthralled with Derek Shulman's voice on "Aspirations". !! |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: May 30 2012 at 23:07
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That Magma experiment did not go well with her, and I wouldn't suggest
anyone try it. But I did do that as a bit of a lark when she was a
passenger in my car. Her favourite band was Bon Jovi. As for my strife, she likes very little that I have exposed to her (unless one counts exposing myself -- I don't mean that in a crude way, but more in an exposing me as a criminal sort of way -- I kid as she's very kind and considerate), but she does like GG's Aspirations somewhat, but she loved Think of me With Kindness. She liked plenty of Harmonium, some PFM, and she liked Mellow Candle's Swaddling Songs (included in Prog Folk), especially this one, even if it's a pop song: She loves this: And this: As for my mum (again while in my car): She enjoyed Aranis and U-Totem. She's only really into classical (she especially likes the romantics) music (and some jazz), and does not like rock, so I catered the music to her tastes. I also tried some other music with her that was art/ academic music leaning, but she found it far too dissonant, at the point of chaotic, which surprised me because I found it pleasantly harmonious (but my ears are more used to that kind of music so what sounds chaotic to her may sound very structured/ orderly to me). Yet she enjoys a fair amount of the avant-garde art music of the first half of the 20th century, so I think her brain just wasn't processing the harmonic structures quite right at the time. |