Is Pop Music Innovative Or Good Anymore?
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Forum Name: General Music Discussions
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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=75129
Printed Date: November 30 2024 at 00:44
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Topic: Is Pop Music Innovative Or Good Anymore?
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Subject: Is Pop Music Innovative Or Good Anymore?
Date Posted: January 17 2011 at 23:13
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Frankly I don't pay attention to it. But you dial it back a bit and there was a magical time when there was some pretty cool things going on. It seems some stuff used to get commercial success because the music was genuinely good. No point in a poll because I'm guessing the overwhelming answer would be no. But maybe there are some gems out there. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Replies:
Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 01:38
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i like Cee Lo Green's - "F*ck You" . it's really catchy and of course the chorus. it's got a little 60's/70's soul feel too with a sweet little bass solo to it, but it's a cool popular song. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 03:53
I disagree with this statement. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Slartibartfast wrote:Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 05:17
Anyhow, a couple of years back when Coldplay hit their pop heights the mainstream media continually describe them as innovative. Lady GaGa is almost always described as innovative, as is Kanye West. I suppose that whether any of these artists is good is a matter of personal taste, and whether they trully are innovative, or if they're just "different than the usual" I couldn't really say. Fringe popular bands like Muse and Radiohead might fit the bill, but again, level of innovation and quality of goodness are up for debate. ------------- 
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Posted By: Doniphon
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 05:41
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The definition of pop has changed so much I don't think it means anything at this point, if not young and barely dressed "celebrities" disguised as musicians. Not that "pop" has ever been a real genre, everything from Frank Sinatra to the Beach Boys and late Genesis have been called pop at some point, so I guess it's more of something that has to do with popularity. And popular music is terrible, at the moment. The time of The Carpenters, Mamas and Papas and others topping all charts have passed, now thanks to the internet radio and TV play are unnecessary and the only popular acts are those worshipped by people in their young to mid teens. The songs you hear everywhere aren't necessarily the most popular, they're just the ones the labels are feeding to the masses. With the internet, everyone can listen to punk rock or noise or prog, it's not really a matter of being part of a subculture or going to obscure music shops anymore. So the only listeners labels can aspire to are those more susceptible to influence and brainwashing because they're usually left to rot their brains in front of TV and Facebook: teenagers. And people wonder why talentless Autotune users get popular? Because it's not difficult to influence someone who's maturing and doesn't know what to do with his or her hormones. And that's a messed up thing to do to because it gives them bad examples. Let me make an example: there was this girl who did Hannah Montana or some show like that. Let's say two parents are too busy to look after their daughter and leave her in front of Disney Channel, and let her watch this Hannah Montana TV show. Let's see this girl is a 12 year old child and let's say three years have passed, now she's 15 and Hannah Montana is grinding her intimate parts against various males on MTV. What example do you think that would possibly give? Especially now that she's maturing physically and feels so confused inside. What has music to do with that? Same thing with male teenagers seeing those pumped meat bags swearing around and dry humping "ghetto" girls. Or that lady *a*a (I will not pronounce her name), you always hear about how much she cares about "different" people and how she teaches teenagers to be themselves. But she had tons of plastic surgery! That's hypocrisy at best. I haven't watched TV in years and I'm aware of all those things. Why? I don't know, probably my experience on the internet and in real life. But I know for a fact that pop music is an absolute disgrace today. Pop music is an absolute disaster because it's not about the music anymore, it's about the corporations pushing their creepy agendas. In the internet age, labels should become irrelevant. They know that and do these dirty tricks to stick around. I'm not saying you should be a hipster and listen to obscure music exclusively, just avoid packaged music. It's obvious that teenagers need some kind of "rebel" to identify with, like Buddy Holly or James Dean or Dee Dee Ramone. But those working from the labels aren't rebels at all, they're just doing what the label tells them to do. A disgrace to humanity. The same applies to the "indie" fad that many major labels are pushing. It works like this: they buy a small label (usually called "indie"), they promote its artists and then pretend said musicians are still working for a small label, while said artists are making six figures a year. An example? Crystal Castles is signed to Fiction Records, which is owned by Polydor which is a subsidiary of Universal. And Crystal Castles fans act like annoying "indie" hipsters all the time. That's another fad I hope will die. ------------- Quando un uomo con la pistola incontra un uomo col fucile, quello con la pistola è un uomo morto. |
Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 07:23
So I think that the 80's style of Pop writing was present through the 90's and still lingers in today's music. I don't know what to say about the Pop music written today because I simply don't have an interest. I know that many Pop artists have done remakes of Beatle songs and many others and that gets up my nose a bit. I seem to observe a change of some kind in Pop writing over the last 2 decades but don't have the right to comment on all the details or the dislikes I have personally due to my lack of focus on the issue. |
Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 08:07
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(Kind of relates to the post above) : ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 08:11
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There are plenty of great pop songs now. "Crazy" by Gnarls Barkley is one that I actually play live. Pop is about fun, energy, entertainment. Lady Gaga is definitely that. It's a whole package, a look, a sound, a presentation. The Beatles, Madonna, Prince, Backstreet Boys, Evanescence, it's all part of a package. Music is only a piece of it. The audience is not folks like us who have listened to tens of thousands of hours of music already and need something a bit off the beaten path to still feed us.
"Truly Innovative" is a tough one. Most of the artists even on PA aren't "truly innovative."
------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: CloseToTheMoon
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 09:06
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When something as simple as "Pop" is divided into various sub-genres, it's hard to label it "Good". If I were to turn it on my local top 40 station (please don't make me), I would probably hear all of the following; hip hop, r&b, club beats, soft rock, mall-punk, and the occasional sh*t-rock (Nickelback, Kid Rock, etc.). I love a catchy hook and my iTunes has everything from ABBA to Zappa, but I can't relate to 70% of my age group. ------------- It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen. |
Posted By: Formentera Lady
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 09:18
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Currently I quite like the sound of Timbaland and his productions. I especially like the album "Loose" of Nelly Furtado which is primarily produced by Timbaland. I blame the specific synth drum beat sound on him. I think, this is quite a "new" and interesting sound. |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 09:25
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Some pop music I like (Lady GaGa, at times), but most of the time it's a good vocal hook or a synth line...nothing really innovative there. There is this female empowerment thing going on now (slutwave, oh yes) but that's hardly innovative. Ani DiFranco's been writing about orgasms for two decades, with much more talent and class. Nothing's really innovative. Even everything lady GaGa's about can be traced back to Bjork, both in fashion and music. Plus the music was better. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 09:39
| It depends. If you're referring to the things that get massive airplay from the mainstream media channels, they're crap. But there's a lot of good "indie" stuff out there. |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 11:01
There's a lot of stuff that's not super duper popular but selling reasonably well and good to listen to. Fiona Apple's work is really good, for instance, a lot better than, imo, Carpenters or Michael Jackson. What super duper popular stuff I have heard, i.e. the Shakiras and Beyonces is really boring  but that probably has a lot to do with the fragmentation of tastes so that it's no more possible to make an iconoclastic album and sell it to a big audience, much 'safer' for the big players to make assembly line identical units of pop and which usually gets lapped up too.
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Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 11:07
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It's certainly good. I don't know about innovative. I listen to much more Katy Perry and Lady GaGa than I do most things. I'll take them over Yes and ELP any day. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: let prog reign
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 11:14
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Posted By: Lizzy
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 11:33
Same here, although I have to admit that I haven't actually listened to a full pop album apart from Jacko's and some of the divas - i.e. Celine, Mariah etc (thanks mom!  )I don't know about the innovative side of pop, because there will always be a particular sound even in the case of 70s bands for example, that one hasn't heard before, but there still is some fairly good pop out there (Lady Gaga, even Katy Perry), not as much as in the pervious years though. ------------- Property of Queen Productions... 
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Posted By: The Neck Romancer
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 12:26
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Innovative pop these days? I know Everything Everything (amazing band, their debut from last year kicked so much ass), Massive Attack and Coldplay, although only their first 2 albums are worth listening; the rest of their discography is just repetition of the formulas of Parachutes and A Rush of Blood to the Head. ------------- 
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Posted By: akamaisondufromage
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 12:59
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I like pop music (THere, I said it) but I only like what I concider good pop music and not surprisingly, I don't look for the same things in my 'pop' as I do in my 'Prog'. I don't take in much pop these days as I no longer listen to those radio stations and most of it is unlistenable. However, every now and then someone makes something really good (Crazy, Hey Ya, Can't get you out of my Head (Or was that the video?),) Inovation is probably pretty difficult as for something to be pop it has to be catchy and short and conform. It is possible and it happens.
Don't know anything very current though ask someone young!
 ------------- Help me I'm falling! |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 13:28
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Pop music is at its best when it's being smart/clever/erudite/witty/provocative - anything that shows there is a brain and a personality (however prefabricated) at work behind the glitz and the gloss - of the modern era, artists like Tinie Tempah, Lily Allen, Biffy Clyro, Florence & the Machine, Kate Nash, Katy Perry, Gorillaz and (to some extent) Lady Gaga and Eminem, while not being stunningly profound or earth-shattering, are demonstrating that ti still takes talent and skill to produce Pop music as an art form rather than just a product. ------------- What? |
Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: January 18 2011 at 13:37
| Radio tends to overplay music that is popular. I liked pop music when it was underground. |
Posted By: CloseToTheMoon
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 07:36
I was a big Neptunes fan in high school. They don't get nearly enough cred as pop producers. ------------- It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen. |
Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 08:48
I sort of agree with this (but haven't even heard of the artists cited apart from Lady Gaga, Eminem and Gorrillaz  )Casting your line further outside the goldfish bowl of celebrity however, we do reel in a former school of pop music that is intelligent , witty, thought provoking and occupies very familiar mainstream waters e.g. Bob Dylan, Madness, the Go-Betweens, Blondie, The Kinks, Pretenders, The Stranglers (the list goes on) The foregoing all write very conservative music using the types of structures (verse, chorus, middle eight etc) still endemic in contemporary popular song writing styles. Notwithstanding audio and computer software developments, technological aides become irrelevant if they do not engender new forms and structures after all. The only real difference I can It would of course be naive to claim that record executives did not exploit Debbie Harry and Chrissie Hynde's obvious sex appeal to shift more units, but neither stooped to conquer success as women playing the industry 'man's game' c/f Madonna, Lady Gaga. I wouldn't imagine Gaga's fan base has sufficient nous to intuit their heroine's ironic embrace of a patriarchal mindset she is exploiting for her own mercenary ends. (Good luck to her I say, but she is even more of an unwitting staunch reactionary than Madonna)  ------------- 
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 09:57
------------- What? |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 13:12
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Forgive me if this question has been raised, I didn't read everything...
Was Pop music ever innovative? I mean, yeah it evolved and changed over the years, but I wouldn't really consider that innovative. I would think that the most innovative pop (even if that percentage is very small amount of innovation) would move outside the realms of pop alittle too much for it to be pure pop.
Good is obviously subjective. I do think pop music is as bad as it ever was in todays age (90s-00s), but I do have a soft spot for 80s pop.
So to answer the question...no and no IMO.  ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 14:11
| To give just one example, Beatles was pop music. |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 14:17
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To start yes. But they were clearly more than that, at least in the period I assume you are referring to.
But that is a good point nonetheless. Their base genre was pop. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: WalterDigsTunes
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 14:22
| Of course it isn't. The last time pop music offered anything innovative, forward looking or worthwhile was in the eighties. |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 14:24
I'm referring to all their career, and I call all of it pop because no matter how sophisticated, witty etc. it was, it was also highly accessible, melodic, ergo the huge sales, larger than life impact on the masses, etc.  |
Posted By: thehallway
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 14:36
Elton John and Billy Joel =  ------------- http://www.thefreshfilmblog.com/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 22:26
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Slarti, who knows? I have no idea what's going on with pop music these days. My kids are grown up. I'm approaching senescense.
I used to pride myself on listening to the latest. Hey, I bought some Prince in the 80's. I bought grunge in the 90's (whatever, Iive in Seattle). I just don't listen to the radio anymore, nor do I watch MTV. My kids buy a new Tool CD. I, old fart that I am, hang out on the web. Some dude at some web site mentions Mars Volta. Someone on this site mentions Decemberists. I go prowling Amazon and am blown away.
The 80's were the last and final stand of pop/rock music as I know it at least over the public airwaves. It's all retreads and garbage now. Lady Gaga, who I think from what I've read has some redeeming qualities and I might even enjoy, is unknown to me. How would I hear it? Ain't listening to no radio. Ain't watching no MTV. The 80's. My Sharona. Devo. The Cars. Our beloved XTC. f**kin' Kim Wilde The Kids of America, not to mention Marshall Crenshaw. Wall of Voodoo. Missing Persons (Zappa connection there). Hell I don't know, Spandau Ballet and Human League. sh*t, play me some Flock of Seagulls, I don't care. They did.
Pop used to stand for something. I ain't heard it lately, not for a decade, but I'm guessing it now stands for nothing. ------------- Can you tell me where we're headin'? Lincoln County Road or Armageddon. |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 22:45
We may have different definitions of pop music.
And as an aside from this conversation...I can't see pop music being that way again. Perhaps its unfair to hold pop groups to the beatles standards, but even still...half of it would be a massive improvment over todays pop. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: Anthony H.
Date Posted: January 21 2011 at 22:59
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This is a great song. It's pretty much the only good pop song in the past five years, probably. -------------  |
Posted By: thehallway
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 10:40
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Ce Lo is an anomaly; it's basically soul!
Modern pop is not really like this ------------- http://www.thefreshfilmblog.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 10:44
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On a somewhat related note, in the 60s there weren't also so many labels and genre-tags. So a lot of music that might be pop in some sense is today already classified as something else. For example, Brand New Heavies are classified as acid jazz but it seems reasonable to call this track pop: |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 15:52
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There is still a lot of pop / pop-rock music to die for... Etc etc |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:06
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Joanna Newsom is not pop  , she is, according to Roy Harper's own words "a pioneer of folk rock music like him".------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: akamaisondufromage
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:14
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^ There are some folks who think anything that is not prog is pop oh well they haven't heard 'Those f**king c**ts treat us like pricks' by Flock of Pink Indians. Myabe that was innovative? ------------- Help me I'm falling! |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:28
Yeah, if you want to use the most precise tags and descriptors, then nothing's pop. But even so, Joanna Newsom is folk rock in the same universe where Jethro Tull is atmospheric black metal  If we're into precise tagging, I'd say that what Joanna plays is acoustically supported vocal music, with a great emphasis on both composition and melody. Pop, in my book. |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:30
Many people here think that if it's good, sophisticated, artistic, etc., then it can't be pop. |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:38
I remember a guy at a jazz gig, who told me that he hates pop when I was talking about ELP You are right, generally speaking every artist/band from the Beatles to Cradle of Filth can be regarded as pop. Only jazz and classical music would escape this tagging  ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:46
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Some more: |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:48
Jazz and classical escaped only because they had no MTV and VH1 back in their day  |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 16:58
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^^
I have fond memories of songs I've heard by Sufjan Stevens at one of HMV's store in London. ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 17:03
| You'd love that album, it's very sophisticated and ambitious, even progressive at times. I recommend it to you (the new one from 2010 is nowhere near that good, IMO). |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 17:08
^
thanks Alex, recommendations are always appreciated.  ------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: lucas
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 17:25
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Alex, do you know Johnny Jewel's projects, Chromatics and Glass Candy. Quite enjoyable pop music.
------------- "Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood) |
Posted By: akamaisondufromage
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 17:53
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With a broad brush ------------- Help me I'm falling! |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 19:12
This is great! I never heard of this guy before, he's quite prolific. Out of the Glass Candy discography, which album would you recommend? |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 19:13
Very nice. They remind me of the Beatles and Supergrass at the same time somehow |
Posted By: Formentera Lady
Date Posted: January 22 2011 at 19:45
I have to admit, that I am a little confused about your examples of pop music  . So I'll chime in what I think is good recent pop : |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 07:50
| I am sorry guys, but no pop "artists" these days stand a chance against what pop used to be in the past: Depeche Mode, Elton John, Michael Jackson, Duran Duran, Tears for Fears, Soft Cell, Level 42 etc... Those guys had "balls", nowadays there are only puppets. |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 08:15
I assume sarcasm, not sure though. If not, there be a few jokes lined up for those who choose to swing.
As others have mentioned, it depends what counts as Pop. If you mean top 40, the internet has vastly changed the face of music. There's lots of great music in the realm of Pop, but top 40 is completely different than it was in the days of Casey Kasem. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 08:20
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I'm pretty sure it's Walter's cousin or something.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 08:24
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Maybe I need a schtick...seems to be a necessary part of being on the boards these days. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 08:32
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I thought you did, just not as pronounced as a caricature like Walter.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 09:24
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Hmmm...curious. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 09:34
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See typical Negoba response.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 09:40
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Neither Peter Gabriel, Devin Townsend, Chris Poland, or Khan were mentioned. How can that be typical? I need to check out Joanna Newsom. Keep seeing that name floating around and I know nothing about her... ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 10:04
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true She's absurdly good. Great folky stuff. Start with Ys. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 10:31
I don't consider Depeche Mode music of the past as opposed to the pitty worthy present, they are in an excellent moment of their career, not at all like some of their contemporaries which are now some sort of Madame Toussaud's act (U2, Metallica, etc.) |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 11:32
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Depeche Mode is still great, but they don't chart as well as in the past. I was talking chart-wise. All these bands I mentioned were on the top 100 of Billboard in their days, while the top 100 today is filled up with garbage. Alternative artists are a completely different game, for example, Trevor Tanner, which makes marvelous pop music. Now if people are going to start taking garbage as Lady Gaga, Kanye West and Kesha seriously, I'm sorry for them. These "artists" have all limited shelf life and nobody will even remember their names 10 years from now. I know, I've been watching the same movie all over again for the past 30 years.  |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 11:56
This is nonsense, especially for Kanye West. We get it, you apparently can't see the value in sampling. But you're culture-blind if you think Kanye's going out of public consciousness soon or that by extension all pop music has a limited shelf life.
Metacritic:
http://www.metacritic.com/person/kanye-west?filter-options=music&sort_options=date&num_items=30" rel="nofollow - http://www.metacritic.com/person/kanye-west?filter-options=music&sort_options=date&num_items=30
He is incredibly well-received critically and very well-known publicly.
Meanwhile, ask ten people of varying ages to say who Genesis, Yes, or ELP are. Not even 10% of older folks would know because most of that stuff has been forgotten by everyone but people on this site.
Everything has a limited shelf life, and you're delusional if you think anything you like is diffrent from pop music in this respect. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:03
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He seems to think that because he's remembered some bands and forgotten others, that everyone else must have the same memory. I guarantee I'm listening to more Katy Perry 30 years from now than I am Depeche Mode. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:15
Wow, that is really sad. By the way, do you still listen to New Kids on the Block, MC Hammer, Puffy Daddy, Britney Spears and Billy Ocean a lot? And responding to the fact that only 10% of the people would know who Yes or Genesis are, I think the number would be smaller, like 5% or so. But then again, what percentage of the earth's population knows anything other than the last winner of American Idol? |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:20
------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:22
What a sad pre-determined view of things you have... You that think have such an "advanced" taste have the most slave taste of them all... You like what the world, YOUR world, tells you to like. ------------- 
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:24
If someone knows the winner of american idol, they must know who the NOT-winner was. There, 100% proof that 100% people who know the winner of AI know about something else... And at least they must have seen (and thus heard) the commercials... -------------
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Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:31
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Perhaps we live in very different worlds. It's funny because last time I checked the world was a big garbage can and western civilization was nothing but a endless rehash. That is why art is so important now more than ever before. Wow, I can't believe I'm having this kind of conversation on this website... |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:34
I find your incredibly narrow perception of music to be sad. I find your attempt to attach objective values to a purely subjective experience to be incredibly misguided and absolutely pathetic, probably reflecting some inner insecurities you have which necessitates your belief in a world of objective measures T00L rocks duuuude ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:35
Funny. Me too. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:37
That's pretty misanthropic bro.
You know, most pop music is based on very appealing chord progressions to most people. Even if you think Kedollarsignha's lyrics and voice are dumb (yeah they kinda are), the music should at least be catchy and memorable if the producers are doing it right. Though synths might not be everyone's thing. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:37
So why do you embrace western civilization so strongly? If you think it's such a pile of trash... And the "Art importance" part couldn't be more irrelevant. i can't believe we're actually having a conversation with you when all you do is say "X is trash because I say so". Actually, if you said it like this, at least it would sound like honest subjective view of things... -------------
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Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:45
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He hates pop, but enjoys Tool, which is a type of music not that far divorced from Top 40 hits in the grand spectrum of musical styles.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:58
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Wow, I never said that Kanye West is garbage because I said so. The subjectiveness of musical taste was implied,it isn't? Everything everyone says all the time is subjective, even the opinions of the 80 critics who gave Lady Gaga's last album 5 stars. The value of lyrics like: "Let's have a toast for the douchebags, Let's have a toast for the a****les, Let's have a toast for the scumbags" is up for each one to analyze. By the way, I despise western civilization from the post-war age afterwards. How would I reject western civilization when those three first guys in your signature laid some of its foundations. The ultimate sadness of the current state of affairs is exactly the fact that what those 3 guys made doesn't mean anything for 95% of the world's population anymore. And, yes, I was born in the wrong age. I really belong to the 18th century.  |
Posted By: akamaisondufromage
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:03
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Anyway, pop. Will eat itself as they say. I do like Hot Chip. Pure pop really, always remind me of OMD though.
Like a monkey with a miniature cymbal, the joy of repetition is really within you... ------------- Help me I'm falling! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:13
Oh, because this: Past Present Movers Moments We'll Process The Future, But Only To Touch Him We Know, Send Flowered Rainbows That Chased Flowers Of Dark And Lights Of Songs To You, Show All We Feel For And Know Of, Cast Round, Youth Is The Truth Accepting That Reasons Will Relive And Breathe Hope And Chase And Love For You And You And You So much better just because is pretentious gibberish? Free your mind. I put those guys in my signature because without their music my life would be empty. But that doesn't mean I'll go and cut open my veins every day because today 99% of young people don't know who they are. And who knows, maybe the random guy listening to Kanye West is enjoying it as much as I do when I listen to the Mass in B minor...
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Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:30
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Neither will I. On the other hand I won't follow the hype just because that is what 90% of the people is doing. I will try to enjoy as much as I can the things that feel true and beautiful to my eyes. As long as you are true to yourself I'm Ok with it. Now, will I feel sorry for people who can't appreciate what I think is beautiful, yes I do, but I'm not losing any sleep over it either.
------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:31
The value of lyrics like
is up for each one to analyze. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:32
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I sense a dramatic change in the tone of your posts suddenly.
------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:32
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Up each one's ..... -------------
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Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:37
No change in tone whatsoever. The fact is that you guys were misreading what I was saying. I was telling you that Lady Gaga is garbage, and in this statement was implied the fact that she is garbage in my opinion. But for some reason you guys didn't seem to understand this. So here it is: Lady Gaga, Kesha, Justin Bieber, Fergie and Rhianna are all useless fabricated products with no talent whatsoever, personal opinion implied.  ------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:42
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You dare to criticize Justin Bieber you nazi-fasci b*****d?!?!?!?! -------------
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Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:47
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And by the way, calling "garbage" what other people like (and many with a passion) is not the best way to go around it... "Zappa is garbage". See how offensive that sounds? "I don't like Zappa at all, his music doesn't do anything for me, it's a lot of useless comedy and little melody or structure." Now that sounds petulant but more respectful. "Zappa is not for me." Perfect answer. Though of course you're free to say things how you like to say them... -------------
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Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:48
Yeah but Gaga has a donk you gotta admit that. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 13:49
Let's just say that Justin Bieber is so terrible that he makes me really miss this guy:  Now, that's your really good and "progressive" hip-hop, yeah! ------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: akamaisondufromage
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 14:14
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Ah yes pop music?
Basement Jaxx in recentish time.
------------- Help me I'm falling! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 15:35
Donk beats steve howe every time.. -------------
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Posted By: Proletariat
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:06
so ok, she chooses to write catchy tunes rather than epics... but she isn't talantless she is atleast moderately studied.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoK7T0Xhfss" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoK7T0Xhfss
this is a video of one of her pre-popstardom preformances, it should prove she is not talantless
so yes, some pop still has talent ------------- who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:07
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^I was not implying Lady Gaga is empty donk with no talent... I was saying quite literally that donk beats steve howe every time... for me. -------------
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Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:11
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POP, good POP: ------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: Proletariat
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:11
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T, I wasn't replying specifically to you, mostly I was replying to overmatic but didn't want to search for the initial post. And who dosn't love donk? ------------- who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob |
Posted By: Negoba
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:20
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She has a Honky Tonk Padonkadonk???
Next you'll be telling me Today's Hot Country is art too. Then my head'll asplode.
Lady Gaga's history is pretty clear that she tried to make it on the music alone, it didn't work, so she went the crazy persona with crazy visual route. It worked. Her tunes are catchy. Savvy like Madonna.
But I'll listen to Prince when I'm the mood for 80's dance pop. ------------- You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all. |
Posted By: Proletariat
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 16:26
anyways I don't see Lady Gaga as being 80's pop... for one her the way her music is produced is more listenable (to me) than the trebble heavy 80s sound and while she uses many similar techniques to 80s popstars I find her melodys more enjoyable plus sometimes she even goes the avantgarde route in her live preformances.
Prince is a good analogy to Gaga though because both are popstars in the dominant mold of their day but each is more talanted than average and each takes a greater share of the compositional and instrumental duties than that of an average popstar from their era. ------------- who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob |
Posted By: himtroy
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 21:52
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Pop music....no substantial worth....catchy...average musicians. Pop was never "good", it was just more tolerable before. I'll take Ma Ma's and the Pa Pa's California Dreamin over this "music" I hear today. It's absolutely horrible and could not lack more originality. People like Lady Ga Ga, Fifty Cent, and all these other generic pop musicians care WAY more about they're image and if the news is following them than they do about music (which explains a lot). It's disgusting
------------- Which of you to gain me, tell, will risk uncertain pains of hell? I will not forgive you if you will not take the chance. |
Posted By: Proletariat
Date Posted: January 31 2011 at 22:57
Yes, Genesis, Pink Floyd... all were pop bands
Wyatt for example was one progger who absolutely insisted his work was pop... ------------- who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob |
Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: February 01 2011 at 05:34
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Let's just put it this way: If you're true to your music and honestly believe in what you're doing, is the people who will define its pop-ability. Pink Floyd was at one time pop because people really enjoyed their music, but you never had PF conscientiously making music for the charts. These so called artists nowadays use their music just as an instrument, and you don't see people seriously discussing Kanye's music, but only his public appearances and the garbage he speaks. And Lady Gaga, which only makes the headlines for the wrong reasons. Then you have Amy Whinehouse, Fergie etc... The list is endless. But I'll say it again, if you really can't see any difference between Alice Cooper and Lady Gaga then... ------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: Proletariat
Date Posted: February 01 2011 at 18:45
... so your saying because they get publicity... and the publicity is not about their music then they are automatically bad?
how is that different from not getting publicity at all? and why would that matter? ------------- who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: February 01 2011 at 19:43
I remember going to a prog concert at the Atlanta Agora (I forget who) and they were running videos pre concert and a Prince one came on and there were a lot of boos. It was from a pre Purple Rain album. My wife wanted to go to the Musicology simulcast and I got a free CD and I like it. Then someone here suggested I try The Rainbow Children and that is pretty good, too. I have a sneaking suspicion that the more I like something he did the less his regular fans care for it. ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: overmatik
Date Posted: February 02 2011 at 06:43
No, publicity itself doesn't invalidate an artist. Alice Cooper made lots of publicity stunts in the 70s, like blocking a street in London with a truck carrying a gig's announcement. But Alice Cooper had an amazing piece of work backing him up, really groundbreaking material. Gosh, even Billy Idol had good music to back him up!But Lady Gaga never makes the headlines because of her music, but because he played a gig naked, or went to a party in a meat-dress etc. You don't have people discussing her music, her lyrics. And as I said before, these artists are disposable and with limited shelf life. Where are MC Hammer, Puffy Daddy, Billy Ocean, Spice Girls, Five and dozens of others? These guys were making the headlines in their times, but they had only media and no quality to back them up. They are ghosts now. ------------- "Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity. Calculate what we will or will not tolerate. Desperate to control all and everything. Unable to forgive your scarlet letterman." |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: February 02 2011 at 08:29
Actually yes you do. The only reason anybody cares about what she does it because of her music. She was writing successful pop songs before anybody knew she existed. You've assumed that she writes music for the charts based on nothing. You've invented it. She makes pop music. Pop music charts well. That is all. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |