Hi-fi - allocating budget to your kit
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Category: Other music related lounges
Forum Name: Tech Talk
Forum Description: Discuss musical instruments, equipment, hi-fi, speakers, vinyl, gadgets,etc.
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Topic: Hi-fi - allocating budget to your kit
Posted By: Guests
Subject: Hi-fi - allocating budget to your kit
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 04:38
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This thread is regarding the allocation of a budget to specific components of our hi-fi system. For those of us who value sound quality equally as important as our music I wish to recommend an excellent tome that was brought to my attention on another forum. The book in question being “The Complete Guide To High-End Hi-Fi” by Robert Harley. Whilst perusing this superb book, which many consider to be the Hi-Fi enthusiast’s bible, I came across the section regarding allocation of costs when choosing your system. He recommends the following budget for a system based on the source component being a CD player. Please note that his figures are just that, a recommendation, and NOT set in stone. Pre-amplifier 20 % Power Amplifier 20 % Digital Source 13 % Loudspeakers 40 % Cable / Interconnects 7 % My figures are as follows: Pre-amplifier 16 % Power Amplifier 31 % Digital Source 15 % Loudspeakers 31 % Cable / Interconnects 7 % My figures are fairly close to his recommendation, being determined by many factors, although my system was built prior to reading the book. So, dear users, what are your approximate percentages? If you have more than one source, and I’m sure many of you will have, include them as well. I think, for the sake of argument that stands / isolation platforms should be included in the cables / interconnects figure, as I have done with mine.
Also, please omit any modern digital stuff such as mp3 players/pods etc.
As you can see I have omitted costs. This is for two reasons. Firstly, it’s not relevant as we are talking about proportional figures. Secondly, it will eliminate any pre-conceived notions regarding the relative quality of the kit. And please note – this is just a light-hearted exercise – just a bit of fun. |
Replies:
Posted By: NilsTentacles
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 04:50
| I can't put it in percentage like that. but I'd say, the gear that has the biggest impact on the sound signature are the loud speakers, or headphones if you like. not saying you necesary has fork out most money for them, but I believe this is the area where you have to choose carefully. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 04:53
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Daniel - how come? Don't you know how much your kit was? |
Posted By: Apsalar
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 05:07
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okies, just for a bit of fun, here we go
Pre-amplifier 20 % Power Amplifier 20 % Digital Source 13 % Loudspeakers 40 % Cable / Interconnects 7 % ----------------------------------------------------- Mine (omitting heaphones/HPamp and turntable), speaker stands are included in cables: Intergrated Amplifier 46% Digital Source 14% Bookshelf Speakers 18% Cables/interconnects 22% |
Posted By: NilsTentacles
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 06:25
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oh sorry, I thought that these figures were a recommendation on how to spend!
but anyway. I've kind of forgot how much to spend on each part. although it's not really old, the turntable I got 5 years ago, and the other stuff is a newer. |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 21 2007 at 15:20
What about your new Nordost cables BTW? |
Black Velvet wrote:Posted By: Apsalar
Date Posted: April 22 2007 at 01:59
They arrived the day before yesterday. I have only really had one proper listen, which was late last night (may not have been totally alert). I'm failing to see the complaint about harshness; I was playing 1/3 octave band which is a very atonal album and I found it gave the sound a greater depth. It should be interesting to make note of further differences as I give them a solid listening. But on first remarks, they were definately worth the step up. |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 22 2007 at 10:23
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...are they new? If it's the case, there's a run-in period.
My Stefanaudio art headphones cable needed nearly 100 hours!! |
Posted By: NilsTentacles
Date Posted: April 22 2007 at 11:26
yeah, and after 100 hours, do you remember how it originally sounded? nah, I thoght so. |
Posted By: arcer
Date Posted: April 22 2007 at 15:07
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Hmm...
Preamp 18%
Power 26%
CD 15%
Vinyl 26%
Speakers 10%
Cables 5%
Definitely the speakers need to be improved...
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 23 2007 at 03:28
It rather that it's better and better hour after hour, it doesn't change suddently but progressively. |
Posted By: NilsTentacles
Date Posted: April 23 2007 at 05:48
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that's obvious, and just my point. I could perhaps tell a drastic change in sound, if the previous sound signture was something that I've gotten used to for several days of listening. sorry. we're completely off topic again. another thread for burn-in related matters. |
Posted By: Flyingsod
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 00:15
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Pre-amplifier 20 % Power Amplifier 20 % Digital Source 13 % Loudspeakers 40 % Cable / Interconnects 7 % My figures are as follows: Pre-amplifier 25 % Power Amplifier 25 % Digital Source 40 % Loudspeakers 10 % Cable / Interconnects 0 % yeah...0 ------------- This space intentionally left blank |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 01:04
Freebies? Home-made? What do you use?
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 03:46
So what's new with the cables? |
Posted By: Apsalar
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 04:08
| Taking into account, my experience with cables it has been an unfair contest been the Blue Haaven's and my old $40 specials, there was a big difference to be heard. They are showing an increase in clarity. One of the main appeasing factors is it takes much grain out of high end trebles. I think this might be because it brings the bass forward more. |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 04:26
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Advice on hi-fi should be taken as guide, mains and signal interconnects are an extremely important factor, no good units will perform well with cheap interconnects, by allocating only 7% to interconnects it seems Robert Harley could learn something new! the signal source is also crucial, and decent mid-fi quality speakers can really shine with excellent source components, so....based on average market prices quality amps and speakers can be bought quite reasonably..
Cable / Interconnects
Digital Source 25%
Pre-amplifier /
Power Amplifier 25%
Loudspeakers 20%
try reading this book...
  http://www.russandrews.com/lookup/1/region/UK/currency/GBP/customer_id/PAA0591016507895DMMQXKDNBWFXIEHD/product-Sound-Solutions-6000.htm - http://www.russandrews.com/lookup/1/region/UK/currency/GBP/customer_id/PAA0591016507895DMMQXKDNBWFXIEHD/product-Sound-Solutions-6000.htm
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 05:47
I much agree with that. It does not mention vib-cancelling accesories and power filters. Talking components, the most expensive elements are CD set up and preamplifier, whereas quality amps and speakers can be found at a fair price, as you say. |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 06:57
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"It does not mention vib-cancelling accesories and power filters. "
these could be included in interconnect budget percentage...?
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 07:11
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Yes, let's call that "optimization"!
Do you own the book BTW? |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 11:18
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[QUOTE=oliverstoned]Yes, let's call that "optimization"! Do you own the book BTW?[/QUOTE] yes, would you like to borrow it?
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 13:07
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What do you mean?
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Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: April 30 2007 at 14:21
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the sound solutions book i thought you were referring to, you are welcome to borrow it, i can post it if you wish..?
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: May 01 2007 at 06:19
| Yes please! |
Posted By: Flyingsod
Date Posted: May 02 2007 at 23:41
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my cords were freebies. when ya buy regular audio equipment they come with patch cords. Super hi end stuff doesn't ? Or the guy at sears throws them in._popupControl();
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: June 05 2007 at 14:44
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Thanks to Mystic fred, i read this book. This is rather good and i especially liked the beggining when Russ Andrews explain that a system is a chain where everything is equally important. I also liked that he advices to invest an important part of the budget in cables. What i disliked is his lack of experience. For example he advices to use one dedicated power line for the system. That's good, better than zero, but he should advice to use as many lines as possible, if possible one per device. Is it because he didn't tried himself? He doesn't say much about vibration treatment, i was horrified to read about "blue tack" (a past used to glue posters), this is really something to avoid in a system, cause it's a soft mateer which traps vibrations. So i'd say that's a good book to start for people like MER i.e who have to learn the basic laws of hifi and musicality. But our friend Russ has still a lot to learn. And unfortunatly the Cardas brand with which he has a partneurship is not real great, with a too round/soft sound aesthetic and not only great products. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 06 2007 at 01:53
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"So i'd say that's a good book to start for people like MER i.e who have to learn the basic laws of hifi and musicality." Very nice try, but I'm not taking the bait. 
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Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: June 06 2007 at 03:29
some very interesting points, Olivier, i am especially guilty of using blu-tack - if it wasn't for the good ol' blu my speakers would have crashed to the floor many times due to my clumsiness
 i avoid using spikes as they drill their way into the bottom of the speakers.i think they may have recommended using a dedicated power line/source for purity, the line would be uncluttered from interference - but for me using one socket and extension block close to all source units is the shortest, therefore the most economical, route? also i can't have lots of wires running across the floor - it would frighten the cat .
 i don't know Cardas at all i must have missed them, RA especially recommends Kimber products.
pleased you enjoyed the book!
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