Edenbridge, more prog than metal?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Suggest New Bands and Artists
Forum Description: Suggest, create polls, and classify new bands you would like included on Prog Archives
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=33292
Printed Date: March 03 2025 at 22:32
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Topic: Edenbridge, more prog than metal?
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Subject: Edenbridge, more prog than metal?
Date Posted: January 16 2007 at 17:47
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Hi, folks: I wrote a small biography about Edenbridge to include them on this site, though some friends are still trying to label the band. Some guys think they´re more progressive than metal, some think they´re more into metal than prog. I´d like to know your opinion about this great austrian band. best regards! Tarcísio B. Moura |
Replies:
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 16 2007 at 17:53
I liked their last album, but they're not one of my favorite bands. I think that they're symphonic, but not really progressive. I would not add them here - but I wouldn't add Nightwish either.
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Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: January 16 2007 at 18:54
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I don't even think they are worthy of inclusion,because I think they are more power metal than anything. -------------  |
Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: January 16 2007 at 19:07
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Incidentally,they were unanamously rejected for inclusion by the Prog Metal Team. ------------- |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 05:58
I really don´t understand why Edenbridge was rejected by a single person, let alone the whole team. They are much more progressive than a lot of other bands that are included in this genre. Not every band has to sound like Dream Theatre to be labeled as such. Besides, they have some songs on every single CD that are much more progressive than power metal. I think more attention should be paid to the band as a whole. Listen without prejudice! Like every prog band you should listen many times a song before you have an idea about their sound. |
TheProgtologist wrote:Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 06:10
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Tarcisio, I understand your being put out, but remember that there is a reason why we have specialist teams on this website. The people in the Prog Metal team are extremely knowledgeable as to their subgenre, and they listen to bands very carefully before making a decision. Moreover, if you look at the bands included in PM, you'll find there are very few DT 'clones', so to say, and many much more distinctive-sounding bands - just to mention a couple, Agalloch and Kayo Dot, who have nothing whatsoever to do with DT. Some of the things your post implied are almost offensive towards the members of this hard-working team. |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 06:56
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Dear Ghoist Rider: I´m very sorry if I ever wrote anything that offended anybody here. I apologise for that. I have a deep respect for the site and everybody involved, even when I do not agree with their opinions. I never meant to imply that the prog metal team is not competent. I believe they are. I was only apalled to what I read. Edenbridge always sounded to me as a progressive band, and since I love prog music for over 30 years and it´s been my greatest love in music in general, I do feel I have some knowledge in this genre too. Ok, they are maybe too metal for certain ears, but so is Dream Theatre. The reason I was telling that is that both bands have progressive and metal elements in their music, albeit with different approachs. Still, I felt Edenbridge was being belittled, at least that´s my opinion concerning one post. Royal Hunt for exemple is too a more power metal band than anything else but still they are labeled in Progarchives as prog metal. Maybe it´s a matter of taste, I guess, but being informed by the one guy that the whole team rejected the band right away? It just seemed unfair to me. Anyway, I don´t want to say anything bad about anyone. I´m open to talk about the subject. If I sounded offensive is maybe because I was hurt, I did not expect that kind of answer here. But that´s no excuse. I excuse myself profusely to anyone who may felt offended. Sorry guys, I did not mean it. But I still think Edenbridge is prog metal. And one of the best. Respectfully Tarcísio B. Moura |
Posted By: Masque
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 07:05
Melodic power metal with some prog elements ... they should be here. I am extremely knowledgeable in areas of prog metal and most areas not all but most of prog rock, its my life's work ... Edenbridge are about as progressive as Kamelot so they should be here you are correct Tarcisio.  BTW Edenbridge are far from my favourite band ------------- |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 07:33
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^ Slightly less than Kamelot IMO ... but it totally depends on which attributes of the music are most important to you.
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Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 07:44
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Hello Masque: How are you? thanks for posting your opinion. I agree. Kamelot is a great band and has done great, intricated and complex pieces of work, specially in those two latest CDs. They should be in ProgArchives alright. I hope to see them soon. Best wishes Tarcísio |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 07:52
^ Kamelot are in the archives - there were already here when I joined over a year ago.
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Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 08:16
HI, MIke: Is Kamelot already in Proarchives? I did not know. Thanks for the information. They deserve to be. Cheers Tarcísio |
Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 11:27
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There were bands included here before the formation of the PMT that really shouldn't be here.Rhapsody,Nightwish & Masterplan chiefly among them,but a few other bands like them that are very barely prog metal,if at all.But I don't think we should compound those mistakes by adding similar bands.Edenbridge is a power metal band,and just because Kamelot(or whoever)is here doesn't mean they should be added.
If you look at a thread that is stickied in this section that lists and links all prog metal additions since the PMT,you will notice that while there are some Dream Theater type prog metal bands being added,the majority of bands we added have been a little different than your average prog metal. ------------- |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 12:25
Dear Progtologist: I am very sorry to read your words. Up to now I found ProgArchives a very open minded site. I can´t complain, progressive music is a broad concept. It means music that progress beyond its formal boundaries. And so are many bands you mentioned. Either if you like them or not. I was never a big prog metal fan, to be quite honest. But since I heard Edenbridge I knew they had all the elements that make a prog band. Of course they are primary metal. The heavy guitars are there, but also there are atmospheric keyboards, shifting rhythms, classical and eastern music influences, over 10 minute songs, different approaches on the lyrics and so on, even some piano only songs. Not to mention the classical trained girl singer, who never once screams on any song. Not the average power metal band as you claim. They have both metal and progressive elements. A prog metal band should be like that. Or not? Well, I´m not trying to change your mind over taste. Either you like a band or not. But, see, you and your buddies are in a position most people, like me, are not. A lot of prog fans do like those bands and I was very glad this site was flexible enough to include such groups that even I can´t say they have nothing to do with prog music at all. Even after loving pregressive music over 35 years of my life and having thousands of CDs at home, I can´t really tell you exactly what can or cannot be considered progressive. So I respect this site´s criteria. And based on that, I can say Edenbridge fulfills enough prerequisites to be considered as such. Besides, to you knowledge, Edenbridge is not well accepted in many Heavy Metal sites and fan circles because... they think it´s too much progressive to be taken as meta! Believe it or not! I hope in the future you guys be more generous and flexible about your criteria. Prog music has been villified too much over the years, or ignored. We should be more united, open minded and accepect the differences. I think there´s enough room for all. Long live Progarchives Respectfully Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 13:54
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Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 14:28
What bothers me about this is 2 assumptions you have apparently made. 1.We aren't open-minded enough 2.We only add bands we personally like Concerning the first point,I think the members of the PMT are some of the most open minded people here.You are talking about a team that has added bands like Mastodon,Death,Age of Silence,Noekk,Becoming the Archetype,Ion Dissonance,!T.O.O.H.!,Enslaved and I could go on and on.I personally am very interested in bands that not only push the limits and boundaries of prog metal,but are RE-DEFINING the genre itself. Second point,this is not a popularity contest,the negative mail and downright hate mail I receive is a testament to that.I have voted "yes" to and added bands that I myself might not care for,but are undoubtedly progressive metal. Just wanted to clear that up. ------------- |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 17 2007 at 23:53
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Dear Prog Metal Team: I don't want to cause any more stir about this issue. So I hope this is my last report concerning the subject. Let me explain my point: 1) I don't hold any grudge about no one here in particular nor the PMT. I'm disapointed, yes, but I respect your opinion. 2) I'm not convinced. To me, to Edenbridge fans, all rock magazines and websites I read about the band and to anyone I've talked to but you, the kind of music Edenbridge plays is Prog Metal. And this is something I hear since they started in 2000. Your arguments did not explain why they should not be labelled as such. 3) The music they play is above all this talking. It speaks for itself. If people in Progarchives think this band should be in another genre, be it. My only intention was to spread the word about a good band to potential listeners. One last remark. Prog metal was, a few years ago, rejected by everyone but the fans. Prog specialists claimed it was too heavy to be called prog, Metalheads said it was too progressive to be considered metal. But it was a great time, anyway. Exciting new music, with its boundaries not well defined. Everyone was welcomed to the fold. A bit like it was in the 70's about prog music itself at the time. Now we discuss what is what. A pity. I think if a line must be draw, that does not mean some can't cross it. As far as I know that's what prog muisc is all about. I'd like to thank you all for your opinion, and everyone in this site for this space to speak our minds. I hope to see Edenbridge in Progarchives soon, wherever they decide it should be on it. Respectfully Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 00:02
| PS _ I do consider the guys in the PMT competent and hard workers. As much as anyone in this site. I loath any hate mail. Addresss your point with good arguments or nothing at all. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 03:27
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^Incidentally: You're welcome to visit my website ( http://www.progtology.com - http://www.progtology.com ) - there you'll be able to not only rate Edenbridge albums, but also help determine their genre, it's all community driven. Yesterday I revisited Edenbridge - The Grand Design, have a look: http://www.progtology.com/db/albums/_auto_5425367.xhtml - http://www.progtology.com/db/albums/_auto_5425367.xhtml ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 03:32
Tarcisio, did anyone address you any hate mail? If so, could you inform any of us Admins by PM, please? This is not something people should get away with. Disagreeing civilly is one thing, sending hate mail is quite another. |
Posted By: kazansky
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 04:40
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I've only listen to The Grand Design, and from what i've heard, they do have some prog element on their songs, less that Kamelot, i agree. Therefore, i don't think that they're 'prog enough' to be added in the site.
Just my opinion... ------------- The devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 05:13
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^ agreed. As I pointed out in the review that I posted on the previous page, the last track is quite progressive, but the others aren't. IMO they deliberately chose to make the other songs less complex. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: kazansky
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 05:21
the vocalist is quite an eye candy though  ------------- The devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 05:50
Dear Ghost Rider: I think I did not wrote the right words. I was addressing a message to people who may want to write hatemail. One of the team wrote he got some of that. I think it´s unfair since we have such an open space to reply here. That´s all. Fortunatly I did not get that kind of mail. Thanks for your interest. |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 18 2007 at 05:59
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[QUOTE=kazansky]I've only listen to The Grand Design, and from what
i've heard, they do have some prog element on their songs, less that
Kamelot, i agree. Therefore, i don't think that they're 'prog enough'
to be added in the site.
Just my opinion... Hi, Kazansky: Try their previous CD, "Shine" or the first one, "Sunrise In Eden". Edenbridge never claimed to be a prog band per se. But they were never a straight ahead Heavy Metal one either. Prog elements are all over them, it depends on what CD you´re referring, they´re all different. Since the last one was advertised, but it si not available in my country yet I can´t say how it sounds like. Maybe it is the reason for so much controversity here! Still, I think the only logical label to them is prog metal. I´d like you to hear those records and reply if they are not. Cheers Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 19 2007 at 18:41
Dear Mike: Thanks for the invitation. I surely will visit it. |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 19 2007 at 18:52
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Dear Mike: I visited your site and read your review. But since The Grand Design is still unreleased in my country I can´t really judge, I haven´t heard it yet. If you have the opportunity try their "Shine" or "Sunrise In Eden". Cheers Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: kazansky
Date Posted: January 21 2007 at 09:11
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Recently, i just got the album Shine. Though this album has more prog element that The Grand Design, i'll put their 'proginess' at about the same level as the band 'Epica'(still less than Kamelot). So still not prog enough to be included in the site IMO... ------------- The devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 21 2007 at 09:24
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^ Strange - for me Epica are easily on Kamelot's level. Do you know Consign to Oblivion?
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Posted By: kazansky
Date Posted: January 21 2007 at 09:26
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i have it and Phantom Agony. IMO Epica are slightly less than Kamelot
btw, Epica also not listed in the site right ? ------------- The devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 22 2007 at 11:53
Dear Kazansky: I wonder if we are talking about the same CD. Not prog enough? Less than Kamelot? Wow! You got to be kidding. And I AM a Kamelot fan! I´ve been a prog fan for over 30 years, have listen to thousands albums and CDs and being myself a musician who played bass and guitar since I was 17 I think I have a little knowledge of what are prog elements to make a band progressive or not. To me, the fans and dozens of sites Edenbridge is a prog metal band. Ok, the PMT does not consider them Prog Metal, I don´t agree, but I respect their opinion. But they do have a lot of prog elements. Enough and more than dozens of bands included here, whatever they deserve to be on PA or not. And they´re very good! Respectfully Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: kazansky
Date Posted: January 22 2007 at 11:59
well, people do have different opinion on different things . actually i'm a bit confused with this album. some of it are prog, maybe at Kamelot's level, when some are not, and IMHO there're less prog track in this album
perhaps i'm not experienced enough to pass my judge on this . maybe the PMT could try to give this one a try ? ------------- The devil we blame our atrocities on is really just each one of us. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 22 2007 at 13:15
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^ Ok, I'll listen to Shine as well (tomorrow).
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Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 22 2007 at 15:27
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Of course they have songs there are more or less progressive than
others. That´s why when I sent the songs to PA I tried to give a wide
view of their music. Songs like Last Step Beyond and Sunrise in Eden
are pure symphonic prog (ok, with heavier guitars), while Take Me Back
is an acoustic tune (it reminds of Renaissance ballads like I think Of
You). On the other hand, you have tunes like Skyward, a fast power
metal song, albeit with a twist (the atmospheric keyboards, the very
melodic solo and the angelical vocal are definitly odd for a metal
band). They add eastern and new age elements, but if you listen very
close you´ll see that their main source was, even in their heavier
songs, classical music. That´s the prog element that is always present
in Edenbridge´s work. Lanvall never plays a guitar solo like your
average HM or even Hard Rock musician does. Edenbridge´s music is a mix
of different, odd sources, but they are subtle. No wonder many people
don´t really understand them. All reviews I read about their last CD cites it as their weakest, which may have been a source for this misunderstanding. A bad CD does not really spoils a career. |
Posted By: WaywardSon
Date Posted: January 24 2007 at 08:24
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I haven´t heard enough of their music to give a definite yes or no, but what I have heard I really like a lot.
I would also like to see more woman fronted- prog metal bands in the prog metal genre, at the moment it´s just too male dominated.
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Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: January 24 2007 at 12:17
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Hi, Waywardson: Thanks for writing your opinion here. Yes, Sabine Edelsbacher´s voice is really beautiful. There´s a bonus DVD on their Livetime In Eden live CD with them playing live and proving she needs no studio gimmicks. I did not notice how few prog metal bands have a girl singing. You´re right, because she makes a big dfference singing a style like this. Best regards! Tarcísio Moura |
Posted By: Tarcisio Moura
Date Posted: February 07 2007 at 12:15
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I finally had the opportunity to buy The Grand Design. I´m still
wondering if you guys did not see any prog elements on it. Ok, it´s
their most lightweighted album so far - bordering the commercial -,
still the basic different elements are there. The 10 minute title track
is an excellent piece of prog. Of course Shine was much more complex
and experimental, but like I said before, you can´t really judge a 5
studio band by only one of them. The whole of their work is
amazing. And quite original. Cheers Tarcísio Moura |