Traffic
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Polls
Forum Description: Create polls on topics related to progressive music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2987
Printed Date: December 01 2024 at 19:55
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Traffic
Posted By: Easy Livin
Subject: Traffic
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 14:49
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Traffic have been mentioned in a coupe of threads recently. While I enjoy their music, I would not consider myself to be a fan as such. I do think though that they should be listed in the archives. For many people, the band are best known as the makers of the single "Hole in my shoe" from the late 60’s. To judge them on that basis is like judging Genesis on the basis of "From Genesis to Revelation". Traffic made many fine prog albums, often with a jazz/fusion emphasis ("Low spark of high heeled boys", "Shootout at the fantasy factory", "On the road"). Other albums like "John Barleycorn must die" and "When the eagle flies" were more rock or folk rock orientated, but still genuinely progressive. Traffic predated Steve Winwood’s more pop orientated solo style. His work on tracks like "Every Mother’s son" ("John Barleycorn") both on keyboards and vocals is outstanding. Jim Capaldi was another member of the band who went on to find solo success and made some great albums. So, who agrees that they would make worthy additions to these hallowed pages? |
Replies:
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 15:05
| Maybe is not the ultimate example of a pure prog band, but they did some amazing music. For profanes, I recommend the low spark of high heeled boys, both the song and the album. |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 15:52
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Fabulous band - amazing vocals from Mr Winwood - but not prog |
Posted By: Fitzcarraldo
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 15:58
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I take it "profanes" is a Freudian slip, mirco?! In the 1970s I had most of TRAFFIC's LPs, still have "The Low Spark Of High Heeled Boys" on cassette and have been thinking about buying the albums on CD. Therefore I suppose I'm a bit biased really. TRAFFIC's music was considered Progressive Rock in the 1970s but I'm not sure it's what people today think of as Progressive Rock. However, I do think TRAFFIC is closer to my own concept of a Progressive Rock band than ROXY MUSIC and 10CC, which several forum members have been lobbying for inclusion. I've always thought of the latter two as pop (good pop, but pop nonetheless). What I've said about TRAFFIC I could almost say about ARGENT (also excellent music), and they're in the Archives, so I suppose on balance my vote would be to include TRAFFIC. (Actually, thinking about it, TRAFFIC is more Prog than is ARGENT.) If anyone reading this has not listened to TRAFFIC, check out any of the albums mentioned by Easy Livin for some great music with a jazz-rock feel. My personal favourite is "The Low Spark Of High Heeled Boys". The 12 or so minute title track is simply excellent.
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Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 16:23
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Fitzcarraldo wrote:Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:14
This is a coincidence, I've just bought myself the remastered Welcome To The Canteen - and been slightly disappointed (with the exception of Gimme Me Some Loving, which I'm on as part of the audience). This album and their music at that time was underground (part of the recording was made for the OZ Benefit and you couldn't have got more underground than that in those days). I think the lost years of Traffic, changes of personal etc., combined with an early catalogue of psychedelic tunes (both on albums and singles), meant a reduced acceptance as a prog band at the time. Low Spark, John Barleycorn did something to reestablish the crediblity as a band who could put whole albums together - Low Spark probably has jazz rock credibility. But Welcome To the Canteen is one of several examples of albums that do not readily dropping into the prog rock category - much closer to Ginger Baker's Airforce sort of rock with African rhythms (and two of the line-up here were also in Airforce). Therefore I've got mixed feelings about their inclusion - btw I would guess more brass rock bands covered Traffic or Spencer Davis Group tunes than any others - e.g. Chicago, BST, Dreams. |
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:21
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Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:28
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You are right but I had to double check my original vinyl version. But
it has always been a Traffic album to me and most others - and I
believe that Oz Benefit Concert was advertised as the reformed Traffic
gig - Dave Mason was back. Island catalogued the album under Traffic -
and Amazon.UK (from whom I bought the Cd) listed the album under
Traffic |
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:32
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Same to me, but my question is about the "formal" or "legal" side... |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:38
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Lets see, no less than five albums that either fall into
the broad spectrum of progressive rock or bordering elements. Mr Fantasy Traffic John Barleycorn Must Die The Low Spark of High-heeled Boys When the Eagle Flies Much more diverse and talented than most progressive rock bands, there style covered many branches of progressive rock and had probably as much influence on music coming out of the UK during the early 70s as the Stones, the Who, ELP and Jethro Tull. As with Steely Dan in the states they created a distinctive version of jazz rock that was very powerful. I would say if Rushs output with its kitchen sink, everywhere, fairy tale lyrics is good enough. Steve Winwoods cosmic observations deserves to be included. Easy choice in my mind, though much of there output could be considered mainstream rock, think Rush pretty much falls into that catagory too! Tragically underrated by progheads, their Phase One albums are some of the most durable, least-dated music of the '60s. Phase Two (1970-73) was their most fruitful period, particularly the classic album John Barleycorn Must Die. Fans of the early, folky-jamming Caravan ought to check this out. Phase Three (When The Eagle Flies) finds them moving into more direct fusion territory. Two members of this lineup (Rosko Gee and Rebop Kwaku Baah) turned up in Can -cut and paste Safe and essential inclusion |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 17:41
I take your point -and suggest because Dave Mason was back playing with these guys, for that very reason he didn't want to be known as a member of Traffic again, hence the use of the individual monickers. |
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 18:03
| It's a bizantine question, anyway. The music if from Traffic albums, the players are the same that played in Traffic... what else can it be if not a Traffic album? |
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 19:22
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This may spread some lights over Welcome to the canteen:
T raffic went on tour in the summer of ’71, adding Rick Grech and “Reebop” Kwaku Baah (both late of Ginger Baker’s Airforce) plus Jim Gordon for support. When original member Dave Mason joined them on six dates, the resulting performances were used to complete Traffic’s five-album contract with United Artists in the form of the live album Welcome to the Canteen. If you think they bothered to plug their latest brilliant opus, think again. While the album cover lists the individuals involved, and the album label credits “Traffic, Etc.,” this isn’t a continuation of the superlative John Barleycorn Must Die but a throwback to the catch-all Last Exit. In fact, only a handful of Traffic songs appear on the album: the thoughtful “40,000 Headmen” and “Dear Mr. Fantasy” from their debut and the lively “Medicated Goo” (their last single with Mason). The remaining tracks feature solo material from Mason (“Shouldn’t Have Took More Than You Gave” and the compelling “Sad and Deep As You”) and a nine-minute version of the Spencer Davis Group nugget, “Gimme Some Lovin’.” It was the latter that, in edited form, became the album’s single, charting higher (#68) in the US than any Traffic song before or since. The trouble with Welcome to the Canteen is that, for a septet, the arrangements aren’t nearly as interesting as Capaldi, Winwood and Wood achieved as a trio. Where John Barleycorn Must Die was clearly a step forward, Welcome to the Canteen is a step back. Earlier fans might appreciate the reunion, but the sound quality is disappointing (on vinyl at least) and the venues (Croydon and London) less than electric. Like a lot of live albums, it’s a detour to nowhere, although it’s apparently a better bet to please fans than the subsequent On the Road. |
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 12 2005 at 20:05
I add that their contract for United Artists Records was only for the U.S. and yes, "Welcome to the Canteen" didn`t have the name "Traffic" in the cover. It was more a legal thing with United Artists, not with Mason. Since late 1971, the Island Records label, distributed then in the U.S. by Capitol Records, released their next albums in the U.S. : "Low Spark...", "Shout out at the Fantasy Factory" and "On the Road". "When the Eagle Flies" was released in the U.S. by the Asylum Records label. United Artists years later also released two Traffic compilations: "Heavy Traffic" and "More Heavy Traffic". There also was an unreleased live album recorded in 1970. United Artists released a double album called "Winwood" in 1971 with songs recorded by Winwood with Traffic, Spencer Davies Group, and others. Winwood didn`t like this release, so UA had to withdraw the album from the market. This album is sometimes sold in ebay.com as a "rare album". |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 03:19
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I don't know why you're asking for them to be in the Archives, when they're already here... http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive_rock_discography_BAND.asp?band_id=1490 - http://www.progarchives.com/Progressive_rock_discography_BAN D.asp?band_id=1490
(so why aren't Queen |
)Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 03:21
I hate the vocals but they are prog!!! |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 03:22
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Have you heard the keyboard solo on the piece "low spark" from the album "low spark"?!!
Much more prog than late 70's /80's cheesy bands often quoted here... |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 06:20
I like the vocals, but they are not prog - as I said.
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 06:24
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a deaf dialog...
Why aren't they prog? |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 06:24
| Steve Winwood sings like a caserolle... |
Posted By: Beau Heem
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 08:42
IMO, it's good to have Traffic in the Archives, although most of their albums should never be listed as Prog.
Well, obviously Queen isn't a prog band as such, but Queen II is an album which I hope each and every progRock fan knows from top to bottom... not being essential to any Queen fan, it is still their best effort (with a night at the opera) and in my ears fits in the progarchives just as well as, say, Traffic. I'd hate to see A Kind of Magic reviewd here, though...  -Beau ------------- --No enemy but time-- |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 09:04
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The "obviously X aren't a prog band as such" argument doesn't carry much weight when you consider some of the hugely less prog bands already in the archives... (no names - you know who I mean...) |
Posted By: mirco
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 09:07
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Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 09:09
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Simple - because they don't have enough prog elements. R&B with extended jams, yes. Prog - no. Good grief - we'll have Spooky Tooth, Crazy World of Arthur Brown, Edgar Broughton Band and Savoy Brown in the archives next; all bands I love, and progressive, but none of them prog. |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 09:12
Asia well know, I can't name names... |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 14:21
Traffic have just been added this week Cert, perhaps in response to this thread? Many thanks Max/Rony! |
Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 16:27
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what about wishbone ash? ------------- The Worthless Recluse 
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Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 16:57
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Wishbone Ash have come up quite regularly in the forum Frenchie, including this one on bands with one off prog albums: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=823 - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=823 Co-incidentally, you had the last word (so far) on that one! |
Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 17:30
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sorry! ------------- The Worthless Recluse
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Posted By: Syzygy
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 18:32
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I'd say all of their studio albums from 'John Barleycorn...' onwards are prog, although I do take the point about some of their albums being padded out with extended jams. Having said that, the best prog acts were often more than a little inconsistent. Tull retained a strong blues/r&b base at least as far as Aqualung, and the middle section of Floyd's Money is a direct quote from Booker T and the MGs. Even my beloved Crimso filled a good part of Earthbound with rather pedestrian jamming, and what about ELP's take on 'The Nutrocker'? ------------- 'Like so many of you I've got my doubts about how much to contribute to the already rich among us...' Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: January 13 2005 at 19:55
On the basis of a couple of distinctly prog tunes on a handful of albums............................? |
Posted By: Rob The Good
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 02:47
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HEY!! THE CRAZY WORLD OF ARTHUR BROWN IS MOST DEFINITELY PROG!!!! Atomic Rooster was created out of the ashes of Crazy World...Atomic Rooster is in here. Arthur Brown's Kingdom Come is in here...THE CRAZY WORLD MUST GET IN!!! IT MUST!!! ------------- And Jesus said unto John, "come forth and receive eternal life..." Unfortunately, John came fifth and was stuck with a toaster. |
Posted By: Guillermo
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 11:23
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I forgot to say that I consider Traffic as a Prog band. Now, with Traffic included in this website, I can write more reviews. If ELO and Jon & Vangelis could be included in Progarchives, I could write more The "Welcome to the Canteen" album is good. But, I remembered that it has related sad stories: Reebop and Chris Wood died in 1983. Rick Grech died in 1990. Jim Gordon is in prison since 1984. He has schizophrenia since then (others, like Derek and the Dominos` keyboard player Bobby Whitlock, who played with Gordon in that band, say that he had mental problems since the early 70s), and he killed his mother in 1983. Instead of being sent to a psychiatric hospital, due the Californian laws then he was sent to a prison . A very sad story, because he was one of the best session musicians in the U.S. since the 60s. |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: January 14 2005 at 15:09
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Hey, no problem Frenchie, I wasn't having a pop! Wishbone Ash are/were a fine band.
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Posted By: bokal
Date Posted: January 17 2005 at 12:04
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I've got only their Mr Fantasy album, but it's really a great, incredible album! Their early songs Hole In My Shoes and Paper Sun (included in the american album and in the CD version) are little psychedelic rock pearls! ------------- Space Stoned Rock |