I undertand that the argument is divisive and can lead to heavy discussions but...

Politics as well as religion and even cultural differences are present in every form of art. This is, in my opinion, one  of the things that makes prog and art in general, different from mainstream pop.

Would YES be the same if Jon wasn't a sort of newage guru?

Would we have Animals without Roger's politics?

What about Area, Battiato and many RPI artists?

Is Neal Morse allowed to write and sing about his religious belief?

Should this thread be deleted/closed because it's about politics?

What I mean is that despite the argument discussed, what matters is that the forum rules are respected. Single posts can be "censored" if not compliant with the rules that we accept every time we do a forum's login. 

I simply disagree with closing the thread opened by CSTACK3 only because he says he's not happy about Trump's election. 

I guess Roger Waters is unhappy as well, and in case he releases a song about Trump, we should be allowed to discuss.

Last, I want to tell CSTACK3 that he has Trump but we in Italy have Meloni. I can't say what is worse.  

On the other side, PA is open to the whole world. We have forum mates from Israel and Iran, Russia and Ukraine, in some cases from nations ruled by dictatorships where freedom of speech is not granted. For some of them, posting about politics can be dangerous. 

What is your thoughts about it?

If i want to talk politics, i would not choose a music site. Discovering music is the point of a site like PA. 

Well. if I want to play the "keyboard warrior" there are, as you correctly say, many social media where one can start or take part to a keyboard war.

What I really mean is that despite the argument, the current forum rules are enough to prevent from the behaviours that you mention. 

So, let's talk a bit about the last Pink Floyd single: can it be reviewed without its contest?

I partially agree about "do it through...". But imagine a thread about Roger Waters. It would surely move to his politics. Where is the boundary?

In brief: if a post is against the forum rules it has to be deleted. If who posts this way does it several times can be banned from the site. 

There are forum sections "not related to music". Why can't a polite political discussion be made in these sections? 

Instead of closing the thread I would have moved it there. 

Just one thing: you have just taken a position about "politics in PA forums". Regardless whether I agree or not, this is exactly the discussion that I wanted to start. 

P.S. - I'm not on Facebook, Twitter or even Linkedin that I left when it turned into a Facebook 2.0 when it was bought by Zuckerberg years ago. Too many trolls and bots around. I'm not interested at all in that stuff.  

Agreed. The same reason why I'm here. 

What I mean is that music and arts are about "everything", even instrumental music can be "political" in some ways. Speaking of Neal Morse I remember to have written that despite the fact that I'm atheist, I respect him and recognize his sincerity, so I appreciate also his "worship sessions".

Isn't religion as divisive as politics?

Simply: when somebody ends up in abuse or insults is usually banned from the site. And it happened also out of politics. There are rules in place and we agree on the rules at every forum login. For me it's enough. 

Not what I meant. Most political threads ended up closed because of abuse and inappropriate posts and behavior. I don't think that's gonna change with future threads on this topic. 

And does everyone take responsibility? Add to this the occasional users that just are here to incite  discussions for a giggle, the troll kind. I guess some people like this. 

It's not a matter of "taking the heat" or 'protecting oneself", like I said, there is a reason why most threads of this kind got closed. How about we don't repeat the same mistakes over and over... 

If people have fun with bickering and trolling, good for them. Not my thing. 

The decision not to have such threads for a while seems reasonable for me. Why do people want more of that thing makes less sense to me though. 
 

But if they blow off some steam and lose control to the detriment of other users, that's not good either (obviously). 

So are you saying it's perfectly fine to be abusive, but if you can't take it, walk away then...  ?!

Your post here just confirms it was a good idea for admins to put a stop to this kind of threads for a while.  

^ so to this thread as well, you mean?

I think I have raised an interestig discussion. I know that the guy in your avatar would disagree with me, as for what I know, he has never been involved in politics.

But what if I start writing about Palestine while commenting "Luglio, Agosto, Settembre Nero" from AREA.

Settembre Nero (Black September) was one of the so-called "terrorist" Palestine factions. The song starts with a short poetry in arabic spelled by a woman with a sad voice. That poetry speaks of peace. She asks her man to give up to anger, pain and weapons. Demetrio Stratos solo vocals then introduces a middle-eastern flavored music that later turns into a sort of free-jazz form. 

It could be what you call "a cheap excuse", but are you sure that we can speak of this song without mentioning the geo-political issues it's about? 

Saperlipopettel pointed to "threads not related to music" forum section. That's where this thread should be moved to as well, maybe.

The point is: has any of us been "abusive" in this thread? If so, it's a thread's fault or an individual's fault?   

You can probably remember what happened years ago in one of the many "Genesis vs Yes" threads. There's no need of politics in order to be bad. 

In my view, politics is a subject like any other. Thinking to Trump as an example: am I allowed, in your opinion, to criticize or even endorse the man regardless his political positions? I find him hateful as a person, and I would find him hateful even if he was on the other side of politics. I'm not American and I personally didn't like any of the candidates. I wouldn't have voted at all, probably.

Said so, I'm happy to read about your opinions, now that I have hopefully clarified mine. 

This is just a discussion. Taking actions is admin's stuff.

Next thread: Religion

"neutral" is a word that I don't like. If I have an opinion about any thing, why should I be neutral? I hate reggaeton music, should I be neutral speaking about it?

I agree. Whatever is discussed in this forum, should be about music. Politics, religion, and other controversial topics, should be discussed in a forum dedicated to those topics.

A reaggeton related thread would make me rethink about the site, much more than any controversial subject. 

I never said you were wrong, and I never implied disagreement with me is trolling or abuse. 

You are basically saying that hurtful comments (well, that can mean a lot of things like insults, verbal abuse, racism, xenophobia, etc) are just part of the conversation. Nasty internet comments are the most common thing, deal with it, if not just piss off...  Right?! 

And you are surprised admins and others want to take a break from that?! 

A reaggeton related thread on PA is one of the signs of the coming of apocalypse. 

Just one last though before I leave the discussion to other participants as I think I've already told my opinions:

What about the "revolutionary aspect of Rock"?

What about Dylan, Rolling Stones, even John Lennon, Janis Joplin, Doors, Woodstock and so on.

Rock and politics have reciprocally influenced each other. Of course Elven realms and Unicorns are common topics in prog, but there's much more. 

Music concerns every aspect of life. The faith of Neal Morse, the Second Attention of Jon Anderson, the "Spaces between friends" of Roger Waters, love in general, sex and drugs and rock and roll, Anarchy in the UK et cetera...

Remember the musical "Hair"? And Jesus Christ Superstar initially considered heretic by tha catholic church? "In the beginning Man created God"  from Aqualung. 

Just one last question: can I say that I agree with Ian Anderson's sentence from Aqualung or should I be "neutral"? 

The forum rules are clear enough about PA's netiquette. Enough to keep the site safe from "keyboard lions". 

  

So we finally agree about something 

I really do not do politics, and when I vote, I'm the quietest person you ever met.

We had a hard time as a family in Portugal way back when, and even after dad passed away, there were folks still checking out mom as she got older and published some more of dad's work. 

In the end her family suffered horribly because of it, with one of her brothers shot ... and we do not know, how many threats there were to the family, as both mom and dad never even whispered anything about it all ... 

These days, I think that some things should remain personal and not a discussion ... politics is one, aside from the House or Senate, or equivalent in other countries. I like the idea of sharing some ideas and knowledge around, but other than artistic ideas, the others have all gone down badly for many folks ... and there were a lot of leaders that took advantage of the idea to be a carnivore. And in some countries you could say humans are just another animal!

While I think there are folks here on PA that are more mature and with it, in the end, I think that we will always fight for what we think is right, and not care about who is ahead of us, similar to folks here not liking people saying completely different things .... sort of like my God is not your God kind of thing.

But I do think, that shutting down everyone's comments and views, is (normally) an avenue to a much more difficult situation soon enough ... there are millions of examples out there ... you can't control folks long enough ... and eventually it explodes.

I would love to see some peace and love, not anything else ... I'm ok with dialogue, but even that is not something that many folks can handle on PA. It's not about right or wrong ... it's about being!!!

If you could, go back to the first few pages of that thread and you will see the comments, for the most part most of it was extremely negative. Darn right ugly, believe me I know!!

Talking about lyrics, feelings and even the stance an artist or band has on politics or religion is fine since that to me would be in the context of musical art. But flat out talking about politics just to talk about politics is never a good thing, never ends good at least.

I for one am 100% GLAD!!!!!! That PA finally made this call, it is 5 years too late but better late than never I say.

There are a gazillion sites to go discuss your political thoughts, good or bad......but please not here. This site needs to be fun again.