Ok. I am the one that started this controversial topic!!! in another post. 

It is very hard to actually to distinguish or notice a band after 1979 that is actually original. like I said also! the only bands that I might consider original and not even 100% are prog Metal bands like:

Meshuggah ( these guys are pretty original) .

Dream Theater is a band that are great musicians mixing prog, fusion jazz and Thrash Metal, great sound they created, but what originality are in their songs? 

Porcupine Tree is a band that mixed in the early days a bit of krautrock (Tangerine Dream) Rush, Pink Floyd and King Crimson. Love the band what originality?

Riverside? Opeth?

Opeth mixed  Death Metal with jazz fusion, folk with prog very successfully and made great albums. is that been original? perhaps!!!

I can perhaps continue mentioning more bands but it will not anywhere?

The question is what band is actually creating a new brand (type) of prog? 

It is very hard when we had bands like: Yes, King Crimson, Gong, Magma, Frank Zappa, henry Cow, Pink Floyd, Genesis, Jethro Tull, ELP, Univers Zero, Gentle Giant and Rush. These bands don't sound like each other at all!!!

Please mention any bands after 1979 that are different from the 70's prog bands. 

I am at work and as I was going to the bathroom, I was thinking! " But seriously what bands are actually creating new music these days? what bands are trying to create something different like did King Crimson and Zappa in in 1968? 
These bands came to mind, but in a sense are not prog as prog has just become a "Tag" Not originality!!! and you  guys know what I am talking about!!! Prog bands these days are consider prog because of the influences. 

The bands that came to mind are: 

Ulver ( these guys try hard to be different)

Therion? creator of Goth Metal Symphonic that started as Death Metal band.

Mr. Buggle 

Sunn O)))

After Crying

Haggard. 

Firstly those bands carried on making music after 1979. Simple example is Rush, Moving Pictures often appearing high in lists as does Crimson's Discipline. Kate Bush makes probably her 2 greatest albums in the 80's. Dismiss her as prog if you like but prog fans love her (go figure!)

Echolyn - who do they sound like? Presumably Gentle Giant because they use multi part harmonies? So basically any band that uses multi part harmonies is a copy of GG? Let's ignore then fact the The Beach Boys were doing it in the 60's so that means GG were copying them?! 

Do you actually understand anything about music? I'm bored discussing this already.

Jazz, classical, fusion........ 

 Do you understand anything about music? yourself? genius? you are bored because you probably can't support your argument convincible. How can you compare the Beach boys with GG? incredible!!!!!! 

Echolyn? sounds a lot like bands!!! that I mentioned. !!! bad example!!!!

Pet Sounds is a widely acknowledged influence on at least some prog bands and artists for sure.

I think you need more exclamation marks to get your point across. Try harder!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 How can you prove that? mentioned these bands:

IQ, Marillion, Illuvatar, Aknedoten?????? 
Ozric Tentacles? maybe!!!! those guys are great!!! 

 I am taking about bands that came out after 1979. 

yes !!!! i do!!! 

Echolyn was made for old prog rock fans!!!! that likes GG, Yes and early marillion sound like!!!! and many other bands. 

 I don't understand why? when we are talking about PROG! and we have those fans that mention The Beach Boys and I know someone will ALSO mention the THE BEATLES ! I know it will come!!!! 

The Beach Boys are galaxy apart from Zappa and Crimson music!!!! GOSH!!!!

That's the point...For example IQ and Marillion are taking huge influence from Genesis and others who were progressive. IQ, Marillion to me are prog as what they do is based on the earlier 70s bands.

There is nothing to prove, it's how I look at it. I'm a huge Marillion fan, but I'm not caught up on the whole "they have to be progressive or I can't like them..."

Good/great music is just that....

 Don't get me wrong or anybody here!!! I am a huge prog rock band and I love most old and new bands. That is not my point. what I am saying that is hard to find a band after the 70's that does not take their reference from the main known bands. 

you must be joking!!!! is that is the case why do you like prog? instead of post punk and alternative rock? the 80's was everything against the 70's!! except the Metal's scene that did quoted prog bands as influences. 

 Art Zoyd and Univers are from the 70's dude!!! 

 Great!!! love them!!!! I saw them in a tiny place in NYC back in 1999 ( Soho) for about $10 dollars. As I remember, there were some sort of progfest in NYC as I found out about them in a Gong concert beafore Davied passed. few guys next to me were talking about Ozric Tentacles a band similar to Gong and hawkwind so I took the chance! and I felt in love instantly!!!

What I mean by dead!!! is that prog rock is a genre not "a" music movement as it was late 60's until 1979. 

 Many musicians are embracing the music was created but that is about it!!!

Progs...

Like Dogs... Many sizes shapes and breeds. Ugly Dogs, stupid dogs, show worthy Dogs, My Husky even sings....

Still Dogs.

Seriously though... To say Prog Died in 79 is ridiculous. 

You are welcome!

I think I can make an accurate prediction about WHEN Progs will die though... 2040.  Our Huge CD collections will be in thrift stores next to the whipped Cream LPs. So will our 'Larks Tongue' T-shirts. Cuz most of us won't be here.  Some poor kid will be digging through the 1.99 CDs and think to himself... Who the F@ck is Samla mammas Mama?

Hi,

In general, almost none of the new bands around 1979 and AFTER, were not, and mostly are not considered "progressive" and most of them fit in various definitions related to "progressive".

Progressive, NEVER DIED ... and you might consider that the arts, around the world NEVER DIE, and they continue on ... regardless of what specifically they are. Film didn't die in 1979. Literature didn't die in 1979. And music, certainly, did not die in 1979 ... although how they are defined these days, would not be anywhere near the original "progressive.

What died, specially in America, was that the FM radio stations had just about all of them been bought out by the Corporate Raiders ... for a grand rape that took away all the independent and the many bands that came up in the 10/12 years BEFORE 1979. 

As you can see, by the many articles and discussions, many of these bands are getting more affection and comments than they ever did, and the chances are that they are even selling more than before, since now, it is easier to get the stuff ... all through the 70's, we had to drive to LA to get "IMPORTS" for a lot of music and I will venture to state that we helped keep all that music alive ... and the sad thing, is that the real issue is that folks lost the place that they were hearing all the new things, that got replaced by "classic rock" ... that we refuse to take down and hurt the stations that are controlled by the richest companies around in the USA ... and they are ... let's say ... sacred cows ... no one is gonna do anything about it!

It bothers me someone shouting around that it died ... what dies was a lot of our ears, that gave up a lot of music, except the top 5 or 10 that managed to get really well known ... thus making it harder for the "new bands" to make a new road ... I can only hope that you wake up to the story of the arts ... since the 60's ... and how the media spent to much time trying to kill it (in America specially) ... but they failed ... the bands might not be famous now, but they are recognized in just about all the progressive music sites. 

Where have you been? Ears shut down, perhaps?

Hi,

I don't know ... I think that a lot of the arts that we love, will survive and be appreciated, like a lot of famous composers have been ... Stravinsky never died, Beethoven never died, Mozart never died, Shakespeare never died ... and a lot of the music we love has a level of quality that belongs in that area, and I believe a lot of it will ... even with our humor in place.

What is weird is that we do not believe that anything that we hear today, will last a lot more than we will ever know, understand, or have any idea about. We simply do not know, and we are very poor about seeing the future, is more accurate than otherwise ... but the world of the arts ... always managed to survive, and there are a lot of smaller arts scenes that lasted a lot less and are remembered ... I was thinking that surrealism fits that ... you name 3 or 4 names and you are done. Beat poetry/literature is the same thing ... you name 3 or 4 folks and it's like there are no more, up to and including how Daevid Allen and Gilli Smyth actually fit in that realm so beautifully ... 

I don't want to state that most folks posting here don't know anything about the arts ... there are many that do, and a lot more than myself ... and they post regularly, and I appreciate the ability and touch they have. I do say, and proudly, that my generation stood up to be counted, and they deserve the kudos and appreciation that is ot always found or seen.

Me to. "Prog" is quite different from "Progressive.' Many Prog bands emulate or get inspired by the Progressive bands of the 70s. Ultimately, if I like the music and enjoy listening to it, and I don't care for the label it's been given. That being said, my top favorite artists are from the Classic era of Progressive music. 

Original sounding prog bands that started post 1979

Cardiacs

Swans

This Heat

Vezhlivy Otkaz

Talk Talk

Radiohead

PoiL

Sleepytime Gorilla Museum

Thinking Plague

Upsilon Acrux

Electric Masada

  love your comment!!!!!! thanks!!!!!! well said!!!!! 

 Talk Talk was a post punk/new wave alternative band. the same as Radiohead, is from todays standards! 

I know and I am fan of Thinking Plague. Fantastic band! I mentioned in a comment ealier as mentioned the drummer whom partipated in severals RIO bands.

The rest I have to check them out. 

I am listening & watching in YouTube now a band called PRESENT! a live performance in 2015. FANTASTIC!!. http://post-rock.lv/riofest.htm" rel="nofollow -

I attended the last 9 RIO festivals in France and saw Present at least three times there, always excellent. Check out their most recent album released this year. The drummer I think you are referring to is Dave Kerman - Present, Thinking Plague, 5UU's, Aranis, Blast, etc.

Talk Talk & Radiohead started out as post punk/new wave but changed their sounds into something original and wholly their own. 

 So true!!!!!

that is simply because musicians are more concerned about what will make them money and fill seats at shows rather than creating interesting music, because the average listener doesn't care about music like they did in the 60's and 70's. Radio is dead. Music stores are dead. Sam Ash just closed its doors, Guitar Center is next. People used to do side by side tests on stereos in audio stores for hours before making a decision when the general public cared about music. Stereo systems and speakers were incredibly powerful. Today the average person is more interested in spending $1000 on a bigger screen to watch TikTok. 

 After I was done with Prog! I moved on to Jazz!. ECM and such!!!

 well, vinyl is doing a huge come back!!! but I know exactly what you are talking about! 

With all due respect, in my opinion it is precisely the technical progression that destroyed prog music and music in general. Limitation breeds creativity and there was creativity in spades amongst early prog, it's what separated itself from the ultra popular (and imo extremely good) pop rock of the time. Doing more with less, becoming masters of the limited machines available and getting everything possible out of it. Of course things had to progress eventually and change but it doesn't mean it has been 'for the better'. 

Unfortunately, the recent vinyl comeback is just a way for millennial hipsters to feel different and superior to their ultra shallow and plastic peers. And can't forget the 15 Taylor Swift variants per release that get impulse bought by mindless drone consumers.  

There will be plenty of younger prog fans such as myself waiting with bated breath... I hope that's not too morbid 

your arithmetic is not working. 

OMG, like, totally check out this rad example of the epic 1986 masterpiece by the UK band Edge! It’s, like, not even neo-prog style but still super obscure!

Hi,

THAT was the commercial stand ... after the downfall of FM radio in America, and I would venture to say that many record companies went after all the fads, to ensure they made money ... and they succeeded, and ... we ... think that all of that stuff was worth while ... witness the many publications these days (USA Today and many others) continually doing articles on the fad bands ... to ensure they can get more money out of it!

I was "there" at the start, the middle and the continuing story ... I never gave up ... and it is embarrassing when we see a "progressive music/rock" fan disdain a period of music ... and continuously support the commercial standard that is today ... and not stay around for the new music.

I find it bizarre that anyone of us would think that folks lost their ability to play and create the art they created. That is the sign of a person that is not listening, or is stuck in a time warp ... and I like to say ... too much dope and not enough reality!

It's certainly a drastic and extreme opinion, but in some ways, but not completely untrue.

I mean,  what has been done with music since incorporating electricity?

For 50 years +, electricity only served when playing back records and of course its recording itself and manufacturing the supports and equipments.

For decades; the only electric instruments were the electric guitars, mainly for blues and RnR (ok and Django)

However, in the mid-60's, when Jazz (Miles) and folk (Dylan) started integrating electricity, it was howled at and considered heresy. Soooo, electricity became the "norm" from 66 onwards, it was like the discovery of a whole new continent or planet.

In just over a decade, it seems like the whole new continent was explored and conquered, except for maybe a lost valley somewhere in the mountains that came to light in later decades.

 

Whatever came after that golden period was only rehashing : Little groundbreaking has really happened except going louder (extreme metals or hardcore punks) and more repetitive (techno stuff) and quicker (music defined by bpm >> beats/minutes)

Maybe music should find its next revolution (expand into infra and ultra sounds ), maybe

.

I can surely enjoy the latest retro prog along with the latest panhead releases. To me, it hasn't "died" nor is going to "die" in my lifetime. In a world of Bob Ross trees, much is hidden between the branches.

          What I like in terms of progressive music seems to fall between the years 1967 and 1982, and later music just isn't my cup of tea, but to say it isn't progressive and does not mean that to a whole lot of folks, I cannot agree with

Hrychu wrote: Most music after the 70's was a mistake There's some truth to this not many may notice. When people like me and you remain in our bubble of ambitious indie music, it seems like a ridiculous statement. But when you look at ALL MUSIC IN ALL GENRES EVER RELEASED WORLDWIDE, and compare the ~1910s*-1979 period to the 1980-present period, the latter has seen a much larger volume of bad and mediocre records in proportion to the true masterpieces. From the connoisseur standpoint of course. Relax, YMMV.

This is a statement that would need some solid statistics to earn some validity. Honestly, I don't think that those statistics exist. To me, it just expresses ignorance of many other music domains outside of prog, rock, jazz or folk or others that get sometimes discussed here: there are many other musical territories not or hardly mentioned on these forums that are apparently terra incognita for some - and especially for those who want to defend a claim that "most music after the 70's was a mistake".

This, to me, just exposes ignorance about what music has to offer outside of the "mainstream" (rock, pop, prog and the like...). Nothing else: just ignorance.

 

Ok, we are ignorant! Please provide a list of musicians that can top the nortch!!!! these days. but prog!! not classical composter musician or jazz musician. 

That is the purpose of the post. 

But hey, [punchy one-liner, wink emote].

I didn't want to be left out.

Ok, let's go into ethnic/world music: 

Reggae/Ska's best period are by light years the 60/70's until Marley's death. It's just been a rehash since, including dubstep (and please, no Eddy Grant or UB40)

if we go to Africa, and Afrobeat or Afrofunk the vest years were the Fella Kuti years and the Nigerian scene... and that was mainly the 70's (just check RYM too see the ratings).

In India, Ravi Shankar came to prominence in the 60/70's and he's usually considered the top slot (at lerast to us westerners)

I know fairly little about Brazil's music industry (outside a few stars in jazz), but in a nutshell, it seems to moi, that the best era is also the 60/70's. 

OK, I guess you may score a point about my knowledge of the Balinese music timeline (ditto for Bhutan's scene)

Agreed! The truest and best statement so far. 

Hi,

Weird ... their jazz scene did very well during that time ... but I guess we will not deal with that because it ain't "progressive something" ... 

The musical instruments might have been behind the times, the economy alone would make the purchase of something well known nearly impossible. But it never stopped the singers, and the classical and jazz side of things ... my take would become that there was not, as yet, a proper venue for the sale of records, but when I was there, Roberto Carlos and Maria Betania had no problems being noticed at all, and we heard them on the little radio! Carcara was a single, but there was nowhere to buy it in Assis and Araraquara (state of Sao Paulo) ... 

I bet the likelihood is that there was an "economy" in the large cities, but the rest of the country was too many small towns, and I bet sales stunk badly.

shirley you jest, my young know-it-all forum member

Notwithstanding the recording technology that indeed got "better" (very debatable) in the 80's and reached places where it didn't exist before (Ginger Baker (Cream and BGA) created the first recording studio of the African continent  in Lagos Nigeria in +/- 75), it's not because the technology became available and accessible (remains to be seen in terms of finances) that it improved the artistic creation process. 

here (this thread), we're mostly talking of artistic value, not technology.

I won't talk much of samba, because I only vaguely know what that englobes, but... its heyday probably pre-dating the recording industry. 

 But you mean to tell me that 50/60/70's bossa nova (that invaded the rest of the planet) was topped in later decades in terms of quality.  I mean getting better than Jobim, Gilberto (both), Gil, Nascimento, Pascoal, & Co??

I'm curious how you're going to top that second-wave of bossa?? 

.

Yes

Genesis

Jethro Tull

King Crimson

Pink Floyd

Gentle Giant

Van der Graaf Generator

Emerson, Lake & Palmer

The Moody Blues

Procol Harum

Camel

Kansas

Strawbs

Hawkwind

Caravan

Gong

Magma

Soft Machine

Renaissance

Frank Zappa

U.K.

Area

Colosseum

Triumvirat

Once could say the same for tangential bands in fusion and rock:

The Who

Led Zeppelin

Return to Forever

Weather Report

Mahavishnu Orchestra

Santana

Fairport Convention

Pentangle

Miles Davis

I could go on, but the point has been made. That, my friends, was the first generation of prog and the most influential. And based on the ratings on PA, still the most popular and highly rated. Argue amongst yourselves, if you wish. 

Well... When you put it that way. lol

Those were the days.

Pre-Digital Era

Pre DAW Era

Big Stadium Era

FM Radio Era

Big Money (for the bands & Labels) Era

Young Boomers Era (Now in 70's or older)

Vinyl Record Era

Fewer Bands in competition due to Recording Cost and inability to promote without bankroll.

I think Younger folks may find some latter-day prog that isn't Dead and put it on a pedestal

like we did. But Jailhouse Culture permeates the airwaves today.  

 

You've already mentioned bands from the prog metal genres, but there are two other prog genres here on PA that are modern and don't really sound like the prog bands of the '70s: Post Rock/Math Rock and Experimental/Post Metal.

 

I don't really have much music from these genres, so it's hard for me to make recommendations, but I will post this from the Experimental/Post Metal genre:

 

Helium Horse Fly - Helium Horse Fly - Adrift:

 

 

Hi,

It's hard to argue on the point you make. But it does say something else, which I could see happening ... by the end of the 70's we were all back into the top of the pops ... excuse me top of the progressive ... thing and were ignoring new materials coming out, because we thought what we had heard was the best already.

That's not a good take on the art form, or any art form. There was a lot of other music in Europe that deserved a listen, and didn't get it, because the number of folks giving them a "voice" were very limited, and not living in the past ... like your posting suggests, that our audience never woke up from those 15 years, but then ... many of the folks standing up for that time, are not helping show any new material that showed up after 1979 either ... and to me, that is a suggestion ...NOT THAT THE MUSIC DIED, but that a lot of ears lost the touch for listening to new material ... and were stuck in the past. And the best those folks could say was that Marillion was a copy ... instead of realizing that the band was not a fake, over blown long gone costume party!

Again, the arts never die ... it's the public that loses interest and takes on something else ... and of course, that something else is different ... but I'm not sure we should accuse the music for not being there, when the fans are the problem ... not the music itself. The death of FM radio didn't help either, as a the "freedom" that the American FM radio provided to help so many bands, was now gone and in the hands of the great corporate rapists ... now (STILL!!!) giving us classic rock ... and we don't give a damn! 

It's not the music or the art! That never dies!

Some thoughts ... might not be appreciated by some!

It's really hard, sometimes to say that the arts died ... it never did, it just changed, or morphed into something else, that we did not listen to (in this case) ... and then all we can say ... is that it died.

It probably needed to die ... there are not many historical art scenes that lasted 50 years ... without it becoming something else ... but for some reason we're stuck in a definition that no longer FITS anything, but the music from those years from which it was brought out ... geee ... wow ... no wonder something else later doesn't fit ... but it never means that it died ... the arts, regardless of which, have never died, and we still teach and play instruments just like many other did 500 years ago! So, that takes the artistry out of the human something, and places it on a platter and throne ... that no one can reach again ... who the fudge would want another Mozart, Beethoven, Stravinsky and Genesis, and Pink Floyd ... gosh rest their souls ... but the new music and folks do not have to be like the previous ones ... 

Here is another example. Your daughter is blonde and has blue eyes ... and now she is not a "person" anymore, because she is compared to another blonde with blue eyes ... 50 years ago ... so screw your daughter? 

Why you doing the same thing to music and the arts? It has nothing to do with life or death ... it has to do with the music/arts birthing somewhere else ... and we continually refuse to appreciate the new blonde with blue eyes? 

Very weird!

I like DE's point, but sadly, it states that the definition has been "stretched" to match more than a time period ... and the newer material is not the same thing ... that's how the arts evolve!

Hi,

What it really states, is that "advertising" is not a major issue these days, and a lot of music has to stand up on its own, and this is something that many musicians are not exactly comfortable with, but it is the new reality ... and it is far out that you can find just about anything anywhere these days ... and I'm so glad to see the corporate reality out of it ... I really am, but they still control the airwaves and a lot of the Internet, though the international thing is very different ... but a band's material being shown in PA and other progressive sites, has a chance to sell some, but IF there is an issue here, it is that "progressive" is such a cult and a niche to the point of hurting many bands that live in the periphery of it all ... 

I think it will become clearer as time goes out, and some places, like bandcamp, spotify and such seem to be doing well, but I wonder how much they are helping the artist themselves. They certainly are not helping any of those artist rise in the ranks on a financial level, and that is an issue for me ... how can you take so much money in ... and no band ever comes out of it looking bigger than ever ... now we have to go backwards and look at what SW did with his band at the start (sold cassettes out of his garage .... ) and Marillion (got the fans to ensure they could get to the studio for another album) ... and eventually how some like Dream Theater got huge, without a big record company ... as did many other bands!

But I like the idea that the musician has more control now than ever ... and that commercial interests have no right to be stealing from the artists.

New Wave wasn't even particularly innovative imo. Can people even describe the alleged innovations of that time period? One of the more distinct things you can point to is perhaps the fusion of Reggae with Rock that for example the Police did. In other words, Rock bands were squeezing the last drops out of the idea of fusing Rock with other genres.

After this, there are some innovations in Metal up through maybe the early 00's. There is nothing significant after that. In other words, there is no point in bemoaning the lack of innovation in modern Prog. There is no significant innovation anywhere in music. The focus should be on good songwriting instead. The whole point of innovation in the first place was to unlock new songwriting possibilities. There are plenty of good compositions within established styles that have yet to be written, and especially within Prog given that it allows for more expansive compositions.

^ I think you've probably pointed to some of the most original modern groups there. Glad to see Jack o' the Clock mentioned. I think your choice of artists confirms my last sentence:

Hi,

I think this is unfair ... it means that their work is being compared to others, and they can not show their music on their own. 

I think this unfair, because what you get at times is ... sounds like ... and nothing is said about the musicianship of the band and its work at all.

If anyone takes away the comparative idea, you will find a lot of things that have a very interesting life of their own ... but I doubt most would see that since they are comparing things.

It's very disappointing to see new fans, and even old fans, and the only thing they can do is compare everything to the stuff they know ... look ... stop that crap ... there is only one Mozart. Only one Stravinsky. Only one Robert Fripp. and we will have the chance to find someone else, if we stop the comparison for our own enjoyment ... and THAT is not important in the debate whatsoever, except in your mind!