Odd question but I am looking to relocate and want to be in an area with a good density of prog friendly musicians.  Currently in NYC where prog is generally just free improv jam sessions, I'm looking to do very structured pieces.

I mostly play synths / samplers. Style wise I am drawn to VDGG Pawn Hearts era, early Genesis, all GG, Can, pre-Bruford KC, a lot of postwar classical and musique concrete.  I do follow new bands like Preoccupations, Dry Cleaning, but my heart is with that classic prog (sigh).

I've spent enough time in SF to know it has a huge experimental and electronic scene, Seattle is good too.  Would appreciated other recs.

Surprised about Portland, why would bands skip there?

I'm also old enuf to have seen Genesis' first show in the U.S. and saw Yes play third on a bill to Procol Harum. Everyone passes thru NY but it never produced a progressive band of its own, maybe a few oddballs like Buke and Gase.  I know what you mean about NJ/PA but those are mostly metal oriented or practically cover bands.

SF is always good for experimental / progressive but no way I can afford living there.  I do prob need people more comfortable with electronics than guitar rigs and West Coast beats East on that. 

Argh what a pain I am.  I really just need 2-3 people who say "lets do this".  In NYC people want to rehearse 3 times and play out, they are not into learning a lot of time signature changes.

MortSahlFan wrote: Amsterdam

That's interesting, do you happen to know any good venues, or particular good experiences with prog aficionados in the city?

The closest cities to me are Pittsburgh and Philadelphia and I'm only aware of Zombi, The Red Masque, Julie Slick, and Echolyn from these areas. I'm sure there are others, but only these four are in my head at the moment. Philadelphia was a favorite of some prog bands back in the 1970s. Genesis were big there long before they became big in the rest of the States.

I've been stabbed a few times in Brooklyn so Oakland isn't very attractive to me :)

I spent a year in Palo Alto but everything within 1 hour of SF is still over $2K for a one bedroom.  And you're either in a city - or very close - or you're not.  Last time I hung out in SF the bars were packed with programmers from overseas who had never seen a naked woman (there were naked women hanging from giant hoops in the air).  Music scene was still good but the demographic is shifting fast.

Some small grungy cities like Albany NY have surprisingly healthy scenes and are close to larger metros like NY and Boston.

Ex-forum member Simon Godfrey of Tinyfish, Valdez, Shineback and Tidehouse fame now lives in Philadelphia and he seems to know a lot of people on the prog scene.

Hi,

Logistics. The USA is way too large and the costs incurred in making the trips out West makes for things that are very difficult.

In the 90's when GONG toured around here, they were on a bus, and went up and then down I-5, and I know that the producer (Sean Ahearn) did not make a whole lot of money, and then on his try at the 1999 San Francisco Progressive Music Festival, he took a serious bath ... I would think that not even half the tickets were sold, despite a fairly good lineup, although some of the bands that were shown early in both shows, were probably not quite well known, but it's hard to fault a Japanese band, a SF favorite and a few others, although I am of the opinion that one of the best and most professional of appearances, was Lana Lane and The Rocket Scientists, that put on a tremendous show, and on the 2nd day, Per Lindh also put on a great show, however, even with the late Magdalena, they put out more of a hard rock show and left her behind, and I wonder why the more expressive material was not heard. 

Magma, apparently, did really well both times here in Portland, totally sold out, and the funny thing about it, was ... it was all about the French contingent in Portland ... they were out en masse! 

Otherwise, over the years, not many shows were well attended. Damo Suzuki was sad, and half empty, many years ago, Alan Stivell was half empty at the Arlene Schnitzler Hall, and Tangerine Dream was also half empty. 

Portland, itself, is not a "progressive" place at all ... witness one of the most shameful things I have EVER seen, and it was RETURN TO FOREVER (subbed by ZAPPA PLAYS ZAPPA) played in Eugene totally sold out ... but not a whiff in Portland! I don't even think ZPZ has come here, or Dweezil would be in some bar, and only get a few nickels and a beer for his show. The  RW's Wall, was not a sell out. Barely half way, too!

One of the worst parts, is the "traditional" jazz scene, that is often a show case for the Mt. Hood Jazz Festival, and I'm still looking for one ECM artist in their lists of folks, but some of the stuff for me, is quite 2nd rate and not worth going to. 

Seattle is more interesting. Saw KC there.

I miss SF and LA, and the availability of music ... but the majority of "progressives" will not make it up in to this area a whole lot, although I have been told (based on Mono and Album Leaf) that the Japanese contingent makes Seattle an attractive location.

This has been my experience. It is one of the main reasons why I want STREAMING to get off the ground, to help more of these bands ... I simply don't think I will see it in my lifetime, since folks are so damn stuck on living in the past and thinking that they have to touch the artist in order to believe in him/her! That's when you know it's not about the music anymore and for "progressive" to survive, it needs to lead the way into the future, like it did 55 years ago ... not live in the past!

Hi,

There were/are some interesting things going in Portland. One of them is that "orchestra" of electronic weirdness, whose name I fail to remember (sorry!), which I have seen and it feels to me like a group made up of college students and graduates doing their version of electronic music. Interesting all the same, although I have not found it well defined, at least based on my interests and having heard so much Eastern music and a lot of spiritual material, and electronic music that borders on something else, that sometimes can not be exactly called "music" ... it's more of a meditation, I would say!

I think Portland has a group of folks, a sort of club, I have to find it again, that does shows now and then, but I really do not know much about them at all. 

The local rags, think that electronic music is something that dogs and cats do on the street and in your back yard! They don't even know how to mention them next to their favored rock music.

If I were a band, I would skip Portland, since I would not be able to get paid for it, and my band and I would love to have at least a nice meal for the show anywhere else!

Strange that we do not have more replies from prog folks in the West Coast ... maybe that states it all about having "prog friendly cities", and the idea that too many folks in the West Coast simply don't give a damn.

I would have expected at least 2 or 3 folks from Seattle, 2 or 3 from SF and even 2 or 3 from the LA area ... I do know that Guy and Paul would be there in the LA area as they usually go see many of the progressive things coming around, but they don't post much at all. Guy does post the material played on his show on the Space Pirate Radio thread. 

No one, though, really knows "progressive" and experimental music as well as Guy, and he has shown it day in and day out for the past 48 to 49 years. No other "progressive" music show could say as much, or be able to list the material as much as Guy does. It is, downright insane, and it is in the West Coast, not in the Eastern Coast. 

That's the extend of my knowledge on these things ... since I do not tend to look at "progressive" anything ... since the advent of Guy's show in 1974, the word "progressive" is a joke and not about MUSIC in my book. It's about commercialization of some music, specially the "top" bands ... forget the rest. 

I'm the OP and I think many would assume asking about prog friendly cities means I love Rush or PT, in fact I despise them all lol.  I listen mostly to avant-classical from musique concrete, composers like Sofia Gubaidulina, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oeei7-Yxusg" rel="nofollow - Andriessen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oeei7-Yxusg , Henry Brant and newer bands like Dry Cleaning, Shame, Preoccupations, etc.  I still think early long form English progressive is genius and all that followed showed a complete lack of interest in its classical sources. No Steve Wilson or Neal Diamond Morse links!  Listening to Guy's show now, great, thanks.  I should have said "new" instead of prog but both sound meaningless.

Hi,

My take is different, if not weird.

For me the German Progressive and Electronic music is far more progressive and interesting than that out of England. It's even more special when you consider how the electronic creative spirit still lives in Germany, as well as the music development, which shows that (in many ways) that the English version is not really progressive per se, as it was handed a nice publicity thing, via Melody Maker and the other periodical in London, that helped it come alive. 

Sadly, it was obvious, other than Keith Emerson for my tastes, that the "great musicianship" of the big names in London, were not that great as musicians, and they all went back to "songs" and could not sustain their ability with something like a piano concerto ... witness Rachel Flowers doing TARKUS on piano ... and you, as a student, turning that in to your professor, and getting laughed out the door! So it would have been with Keith, and instead he and his mates found a way to express it that worked. That is "progressive", in most senses of the word, but not like PA and other "progressive" websites tend to discuss and show it, which is mostly a commercialization of the top 5 or 10 bands (with multiple albums of course!!!) so that outsiders and foreigners don't have a chance to even be "thought of" as creative and special musically.

The one thing about Germany, and it is not something that PA folks can relate to, is that the "krautrock" improvisations, were all over the theater, film and literature departments, not just music, not to mention that Germany had one of the highest and best show of eastern music from around the world, during the Olympics, that only Peter Michael Hamel (Between) can describe it and show what a magnificent showcase it was that rock fans ignored, because anything like MM or ME were not intelligent enough to see the art in the music ... only their "favorites".

After this many years, and I was there for Guy's first SPR show (Jan 27th, 1974), one of the things that you learn really fast is that ... "favorites" is not about music. It's about fans. 

How to wake up the West Coast? I don't think it's possible. I tried to do a progressive music show and had samples at the local public radio "station" ( I still don't think it's a station!!!) ... and the lady in charge asked me right off the bat ... what is the social importance of your show? Like an hour of it a week, made a difference, but I wanted more than an hour to free form, and she didn't want that! She wanted hours of crap and the same stuff, and one guy from some country playing some of their music that none of us can get. It was uneducated, and stupid, and I looked at her and said ... I don't think you know music, or that you care. Thanks. And left! The station is still a rag station, that is not surviving well, because the interest simply is not there and Portland is a big small town in the country ... the biggest thing here is country radio playing the same thing over and over! 

LA and SF have a lot of music from everywhere, but mostly it is hidden in a bar in the middle of nowhere, while Seattle is a bit weird and strange for me ... if it's not Nirvana, Heart or something else, it is not seen anywhere, and their public rags only showcase the same bars playing the same bands over and over! And the stuff these bands play is the same crap that most fans talk about! Either metal, thrash or similar. Heaven forbid that one of those bands shows up with a keyboard player!

Those are the only 3 cities I can mention about the West Coast ... the rest of the USA is a bit weird and off center for me. Chicago/Madison was fairly good in the late 60's but it was killed by cops, and folks bent on destruction of anyone that had an inch too much hair and a colorful piece of clothing! Not to mention that getting your head beat up was very important, your very own badge of honor!

So share those German bands who are more truly progressive. IMHO the English and German branches had totally different intentions, apples and oranges.  And don't assume we Yanks don't know our Brecht, Klee and Fassbinder.

It's in the countryside, inside a furniture shop and very quirky, but not too far from London

If you like classic prog then this is a great venue.  Steve Hackett plays here regularly.  Focus are playing in November.  Carl Palmer has played here.  I saw Gryphon playing here the other year and loved it (unfortunately I live a little way away, so it's a bit of a journey for me, or I would go every week!)

Plus Roger Dean has his studio here, and I met him in person last time I was there and he did a personal drawing for me.

Great place for prog fans!

https://www.tradingboundaries.com/live-music/" rel="nofollow - Live Music - Trading Boundaries

Hi,

The thing that makes these things "progressive" is how they all came up at the time as the film and theater and the other arts, and were using experiments, and improvisation as one of its main forces of design and emphasis. I don't exactly enjoy considering Neu, Harmonia, Kraftwerk and many of those early bands as "progressive" per se, since they were trying to learn anything that was already being done within the context of classical music and within the studies about many other cultures of which the International Show in the Olympics (72) was an incredible showcase that probably gave folks like TD, KS and many others a good idea what could be done with the electronics. But the other set of musicians, were more into the sounds that could be made and added to a beat to create a nice rock sound. 

I don't assume anything. But seeing us "Yanks" (to use your expression) and not knowing any of those names is a different story. I don't think they know "enough" in order to be able to say a whole lot, although I imagine that folks in NY get a lot more arts and get to see and read a lot more than the rest of the country. 

NY is probably the hottest center of experimental and progressive music in the world ... with one problem ... FINDING IT! And no one, even the "we Yanks" telling us something about it, is not visible, and it's really hard to believe that people are so thin and uneducated when it comes to film, theater and music, and only know the top ten of everything. 

NY will, likely, know a Klee ... but in Nashville, or Portland (OR), or even Seattle? Who's that?

The educational level and differences are a huge issue ... NY is full of the arts of all kinds. In Seattle the word arts means the same crap that is seen in the arts and crafts show every year ... the same ribbon winning folks ... and they think their art is what the arts are all about.

If people knew these things better, and discussed it some, it would be another story. It's like reading any discussion on David Bowie and not a single person can see the connections to some other form of theater, for example. It's sad, and it discredits the real source of it all ...