"Saucerful Of Secrets" the beginning of Krautrock?

A friend at the next record store, when I was still working as a record salesboy, told me with serious way "Saucerful Of secrets is beginning of Krautrock" and it sounded profound but there was some truth in it.

What is your opinion ?
Do these words hit you at all? Or say that he didn't have Krautrocok at his highest appreciation. (prefered the 60's really)

 Some earlier band that come to mind right now are Amon Duul, Xhol caravan

acido


Edited by acido - January 17 2007 at 18:17

curious to hear Phillippe's views.. always considered Amon Duul to be the beginning. 

Yeah, there's definetely some proto-ambient in that song. I just gave it another listen.

You can just as well ask my opinion too (mick), cause I don't think so at all.

Edited by Ricochet - January 18 2007 at 06:11

Considering the influences that krautrock must have been based on, inevetably. Soundwise saucerful has other moments also, such as the trippy-urban set the controls, let there be more light (1st part especially), and pick up thy stetheoscope with its feel.

Sean Trane wrote: ADII, Guru Guru, early Can (with Mooney), the first two TD albums etc.. one the one side >> rythmic psych phase   Early first two Kraftwerk, first two Cluster, first two Popol Vuh and the next two TD albums (Zeit and Atem)

Yes these are big influences on the early stages and the booming of krautrock, but most of what you mention made their debut after 1969 so they could have had their biggest influence during when they were accessible to others, at least, otherwise how is it done?
Amon Duul yes, and Can well Monster Movie was on 1969 but they where about before that.

acido wrote: Considering the influences that krautrock must have been based on, inevetably. Soundwise saucerful has other moments also, such as the trippy-urban set the controls, let there be more light (1st part especially), and pick up thy stetheoscope with its feel. Sean Trane wrote: ADII, Guru Guru, early Can (with Mooney), the first two TD albums etc.. one the one side >> rythmic psych phase   Early first two Kraftwerk, first two Cluster, first two Popol Vuh and the next two TD albums (Zeit and Atem) Yes these are big influences on the early stages and the booming of krautrock, but most of what you mention made their debut after 1969 so they could have had their biggest influence during when they were accessible to others, at least, otherwise how is it done? Amon Duul yes, and Can well Monster Movie was on 1969 but they where about before that.

Can´s Delay album taped 1968? probably not influencial on other groups since it was released until the 80´s but its a nice thread of evidence of what was going on around Germania at the time.
I beg to differ on the influence of Pink Floyd over Kraut!. In the spirit of this type of statements it should be noted the importance of Eastern Music in the Kraut! movement, taking in account song structures and what not. (Guru Guru "UFO", Agitation Free "Malesch")   

Doobie wrote: Can´s Delay album taped 1968? probably not influencial on other groups since it was released until the 80´s but its a nice thread of evidence of what was going on around Germania at the time.

i think the german bands took a bit of everything from britain and america and put their own stamp on it.

I think I grasp what is meant. When I listen to the late 60s Floyd albums, I can see a big influence on the early Tangerine Dream and especially Amon Duul II. I've always felt ADII's 'Yeti's second disc owed a lot to Floyd's long, spacey improvisations like 'Careful With That Axe Eugene', 'Set The Controls...' and 'A Saucerful Of Secrets'.

As for Reed being fake, I can kind of see what Hugues means. One need only listen to the stuff the Velvet Underground recorded after John Cale left, such as the album 'Loaded', which is straight ahead rock and roll, and Cale's albums such as 'Academy In Peril' to see who was the key behind The Velvet Underground's innovation. Had Cale not been there, I think they'd have been just another rock and roll act. Lou Reed, lest we forget, had done some rock and roll tracks before he hooked up with Cale, and his solo career is mostly straight ahead rock. 'Metal Machine Music', his avant garde experiment, was hardly critically well received and I believe was considered contrived, whereas Cale continues to be held in high regard for his musical experimentation. And Warhol, though I may be way off beam here, doesn't seem to have been interested in the music to a great extent as far as I can ascertain- he saw the shock value in the outrageous stage shows and a chance to tie in his artwork and concepts in with that. Look at his 'trouser zip' cover for 'Sticky Fingers' and it's easy to see a man aiming for controversy and shock value, imho- plus it seems to have scratched up the records badly!!

But The Velvet Underground I could also see as an influence on Krautrock. Them and the early Soft Machine (the first 2 albums imo) were a big influence on Faust, to my ears at least, though I believe Faust themselves had acknowledged that debt.

    

Edited by salmacis - January 20 2007 at 13:36