The Christian Thread

Epignosis wrote: Adam was made by God from dirt. Eve was made from Adam's rib while he was asleep, and Adam had a bride.

UndercoverBoy wrote: Epignosis wrote: Adam was made by God from dirt. Eve was made from Adam's rib while he was asleep, and Adam had a bride. To be honest, its the stuff like that that makes it hard for me to be a decent Christian.  I know that it can be interpreted as allegory and all that, but JLocke made a comment about having to believe that sort of thing if I wanted to truly say that the Bible is infallible.  I don't want to offend anyone here, but my gut feelings tell me that the probability of the events described in Genesis being true is incredibly slim to none.  Hope this wasn't too out of place.

Well it could become a sticky wicket. I've know hardcore, true Christians that have said "of course the bible is allegory! Its a guide (and all that) and not to be taken literally"  and others that take the Bible as word, verbatim.
I dont know if I ever asked Rob what he felt about it.

Hey Rob, here's another question  I have for you

I've been told that I dont believe in God.
To sum it up: A power, or something, that is beyond our possible comprehension. I call it god for the sake of simplicity. However, he (yeah for simplicity I'll use he) does not interfere with our lives.
"He set things in motion, but from that point on, all is free and left to its own" is how I like to describe it.
I have been told that what I am claiming is NOT god. Rob, what do you think? Are we talking the same dude up there, or is my belief just too out there for it to be "god"?

Edit: and I'm not even being a negative nelly....I just subscribe the theory that since we were created, (at least indirectly) through god, we don't need him. He instilled in us logic, reasoning, the mental capacity to do this on our own.
Whether he's off making other universes or just chilling watching us and getting a chuckle is beyond me



Edited by JJLehto - July 07 2010 at 22:33

Maybe I'm misunderstanding: but if its allegory isnt all ready irrelevant? Unless you mean in relation to other stories.
People may think the bible is crazy and ridiculous but in my mythology class we did read creation stories from all over the world.
The bible crazy? Maybe? But then some of these other ones are whacked!

Stuff like making the earth with his own hands, in the shape of a woman, and got....aroused by his own creation and started doing it (yes, the earth)
Or the Egyptian one about the god that jerked it, put it into his mouth and spit it out, creating life.

Or this one African one where god used to live on Earth with the people, but they pissed him off by being loud, wiping their hands on him, and this lady that would just take chunks of him off and put it in soup. So he left and went up into heaven.
What the!?!?


Edited by JJLehto - July 07 2010 at 22:39

JJLehto wrote: Maybe I'm misunderstanding: but if its allegory isnt all ready irrelevant? Unless you mean in relation to other stories. People may think the bible is crazy and ridiculous but in my mythology class we did read creation stories from all over the world. The bible crazy? Maybe? But then some of these other ones are whacked! Stuff like making the earth with his own hands, in the shape of a woman, and got....aroused by his own creation and started doing it (yes, the earth) Or the Egyptian one about the god that jerked it, put it into his mouth and spit it out, creating life. Or this one African one where god used to live on Earth with the people, but they pissed him off by being loud, wiping their hands on him, and this lady that would just take chunks of him off and put it in soup. So he left and went up into heaven. What the!?!?

I've never heard some of those before, The Silmarillion seems "normal" by comparison.

Epignosis wrote: JJLehto wrote: Maybe I'm misunderstanding: but if its allegory isnt all ready irrelevant? Unless you mean in relation to other stories. People may think the bible is crazy and ridiculous but in my mythology class we did read creation stories from all over the world. The bible crazy? Maybe? But then some of these other ones are whacked! Stuff like making the earth with his own hands, in the shape of a woman, and got....aroused by his own creation and started doing it (yes, the earth) Or the Egyptian one about the god that jerked it, put it into his mouth and spit it out, creating life. Or this one African one where god used to live on Earth with the people, but they pissed him off by being loud, wiping their hands on him, and this lady that would just take chunks of him off and put it in soup. So he left and went up into heaven. What the!?!? Typology and prophecy are two things that MOVE me to be a follower of Christ.  What other person had recorded prophetic and typological fulfillments?

Wait, what? Sorry man Im beat but what does that have to do with I said? I was just saying that I laugh when people call the bible crazy when there are creation stories out there much crazier, albeit not as known of course.

I dont know if this is what you were getting at, but I as was always intrigued by something my one friend said: Jesus is mentioned in every religion. Even if not the savior...he's mentioned, thats gotta mean something.

I believe Hunduism mentioned Jesus as an enlightened person.
And if not, I like it because it fits my overarching belief that: there is one thing up there, we have just come up with different names for it, and rituals around it. These may have become very intricate over time and solid, but in the end...every believes in the same thing

JJLehto wrote: Epignosis wrote: JJLehto wrote: Maybe I'm misunderstanding: but if its allegory isnt all ready irrelevant? Unless you mean in relation to other stories. People may think the bible is crazy and ridiculous but in my mythology class we did read creation stories from all over the world. The bible crazy? Maybe? But then some of these other ones are whacked! Stuff like making the earth with his own hands, in the shape of a woman, and got....aroused by his own creation and started doing it (yes, the earth) Or the Egyptian one about the god that jerked it, put it into his mouth and spit it out, creating life. Or this one African one where god used to live on Earth with the people, but they pissed him off by being loud, wiping their hands on him, and this lady that would just take chunks of him off and put it in soup. So he left and went up into heaven. What the!?!? Typology and prophecy are two things that MOVE me to be a follower of Christ.  What other person had recorded prophetic and typological fulfillments?  Wait, what? Sorry man Im beat but what does that have to do with I said? I was just saying that I laugh when people call the bible crazy when there are creation stories out there much crazier, albeit not as known of course. I dont know if this is what you were getting at, but I as was always intrigued by something my one friend said: Jesus is mentioned in every religion. Even if not the savior...he's mentioned, thats gotta mean something. I believe Hunduism mentioned Jesus as an enlightened person. And if not, I like it because it fits my overarching belief that: there is one thing up there, we have just come up with different names for it, and rituals around it. These may have become very intricate over time and solid, but in the end...every believes in the same thing

You name a sh*t load of people doing things.

I name someone who does a specific set of things called out before he was born. 

That's all.

JJLehto wrote: Oh. Well that and also you were not raised in a small African tribe, at least that I know of, so I wouldn't expect you to follow that anyway. Nah I wasn't actually questioning anything, just throwing out other things. Though I did pose a serious question to you Rob, one for myself...not to bash anything.

What's your question?  I'm kind of slow. 

JJLehto wrote: Hey Rob, here's another question  I have for you I've been told that I dont believe in God. To sum it up: A power, or something, that is beyond our possible comprehension. I call it god for the sake of simplicity. However, he (yeah for simplicity I'll use he) does not interfere with our lives. "He set things in motion, but from that point on, all is free and left to its own" is how I like to describe it. I have been told that what I am claiming is NOT god. Rob, what do you think? Are we talking the same dude up there, or is my belief just too out there for it to be "god"? Edit: and I'm not even being a negative nelly....I just subscribe the theory that since we were created, (at least indirectly) through god, we don't need him. He instilled in us logic, reasoning, the mental capacity to do this on our own. Whether he's off making other universes or just chilling watching us and getting a chuckle is beyond me

Would have responded last night but I fell asleep in my chair.  I've been doing that a lot lately. 

What you are describing is Deism. 

I can sympathize with a Deist although I myself am not one, because one Interpretation of Scripture is that when God "rested" on the Seventh day, He hasn't acted since.  Everything that has happened since, including miracles, are deterministic things He set up beforehand, like a domino effect.

However, my belief that God is an extra-dimensional being in the process of making humans holy causes me to basically reject the idea, but I can appreciate it still.

timothy leary wrote: To assign God qualities such as " extra dimensional being " still falls within the concept of a personification of the unknown, in the Bible it is stated nobody can know God or assign any definitions of his " being "

You are welcome to show me in the Bible where it says precisely this.