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Nogbad_The_Bad ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21342 |
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Mr Barney, if you know you're not going to like an album where Neal Morse is a principal songwriter why do you spend the amount of time needed to absorb the music and then the time to write a review? Personally I wouldn't waste the time on listening to it in the first place more than the amount needed to get a feel for it.
For the record I'm in the same place and simply avoid his albums. |
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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pjt ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: June 05 2009 Location: Budapest Status: Offline Points: 15 |
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I'm an atheist, and I live in a country that has one of the ruling parties being a Christan Democratic one, and the other one is playing the religious card one too often. Believe me, I know how to despise organized religion wanting to control everybody's lives, for more power and more money. But I'll never mock an individual for having faith in something I don't have. I'm an atheist, and I'm a liberal, I won't tell you how to live while it's by the written law, and the unwritten law of peaceful coexistence. So I won't tell Barney to be a believer, more so, since I'm not one either. But I won't belittle and mock Neal Morse for being religious. And if he preaches too much, I won't listen to his music. IMHO, it's not tongue-in-cheek to laugh at "Neal Morse's imaginary friend", it's belittling and mocking, and IMHO a review is not a place for that. Edited by pjt - February 08 2014 at 08:37 |
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Guldbamsen ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23104 |
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Like I said, the review speaks more about the author than it does about the actual album. Whether one agrees with the content or not, I leave entirely up to you. This is also why he is "judged" the way he is in this thread, and quite rightfully so. Freedom of speech is a bitch, especially when others don't like what you have to say.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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Ivan_Melgar_M ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19557 |
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Are you sure Dean? All this are from the Atheist thread
And I'm not the only one who noticed
Don't deny it Dean, it's obvious. Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - February 08 2014 at 10:39 |
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Guldbamsen ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23104 |
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Please don't import yet another religious squabble into this thread Ivan. We have enough in here as it is.
Plus it isn't that strange that you'll find a bit of a struggle conveying the Christian notion in a thread that is and was labelled as non-religious from the get-go, which is the point many people have tried to make, yet you continue undeterred. Let's put it this way, I don't go into the Christian thread and start talking about atheism. And no this is not the starting gun of yet another new discussion. I don't wish to engage in a religious discussion with you. I respect people and their right to believe in something greater than themselves, whether that be religion, communities and so forth, but this is not the place for such discussions. That goes for the rest of the folks who wish to chime in on this matter. Please use the already existing threads
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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zumacraig ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 10 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1301 |
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Why post the review? Because this is a review site. We need critical reviews to make the rating system have any meaning. And this liberal, post modern view of 'all opinions are right' is just as dangerous as religious delusion. That's a legitimate, thoughtful critique which gives Barney's review some heft. Much more useful than many of the reviews for the new TA which just gush over anything Morse and company do.
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Stardust we are.
-Roine Stolt |
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M27Barney ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: November 09 2006 Location: Swinton M27 Status: Offline Points: 3136 |
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I was expecting a little bit of criticism, but was not expecting such a whirlwind in a teacup
![]() My review is the only one stating a disappointment in the release. Like that or not it's a fact. I am never going to be a "fan-boy" - I may have periods of completionist urges when I suddenly find a band that impresses me with a release, but these are then tempered with a period of cooling off, this is when I am best placed to personally judge. I think that anybody who gets upset because I called God - Morse's "imaginary" friend needs to get some balance into their life! Like I said, the god of Abraham is currently proven to be a creation of man - until that thesis is refuted with definite facts (like gods telephone No or website) he remains - "imaginary" Prove me wrong!!! |
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octopus-4 ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl,Neo & Post/Math Teams Joined: October 31 2006 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 14565 |
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Well said! When Camel released The Single Factor, just after a quite good album like Nude I was very disappointed. They are still one of my favorite bands and I have rated that album with one star. The same with one of the artists I'm surely a fan of, Vangelis. See You Later is another album that I've rated with one-star. That reviewer likes Transatlantic and is disappointed because Kaleidoscope is for him just a reprise of The Whirlwind. Regardless what disappoints him more, in this case the religious lyrics, he has the right to write it. I've been more offensive with Vangelis and Krisma when I have written about how rubbish the lyrics of "Suffocation" are, but nobody told me anything, maybe because the argument was less sensible than religion. |
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I stand with Roger Waters, I stand with Joan Baez, I stand with Victor Jara, I stand with Woody Guthrie. Music is revolution
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Ivan_Melgar_M ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19557 |
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I didn't do it Guldbamsen Dean said
I had to demonstrate it's not BS,. that it's the truth
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Dean ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
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see here. (and it's still BS)
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What?
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pjt ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: June 05 2009 Location: Budapest Status: Offline Points: 15 |
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It's ironic how those who write simply can't read. Please, humor me, and read what I actually wrote, I'll repeat it here for your convenience: I'm an atheist, and I live in a country that has one of the ruling parties being a Christan Democratic one, and the other one is playing the religious card one too often. Believe me, I know how to despise organized religion wanting to control everybody's lives, for more power and more money. But I'll never mock an individual for having faith in something I don't have. I'm an atheist, and I'm a liberal, I won't tell you how to live while it's by the written law, and the unwritten law of peaceful coexistence. So I won't tell Barney to be a believer, more so, since I'm not one either. But I won't belittle and mock Neal Morse for being religious. And if he preaches too much, I won't listen to his music. IMHO, it's not tongue-in-cheek to laugh at "Neal Morse's imaginary friend", it's belittling and mocking, and IMHO a review is not a place for that. |
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Dayvenkirq ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 25 2011 Location: Los Angeles, CA Status: Offline Points: 10970 |
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Second Life Syndrome ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 20 2012 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 361 |
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The God of Abraham has been proven a creation of man? When did that happen? You, sir, just lost credibility. Sorry.
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theprogmind.com
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octopus-4 ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl,Neo & Post/Math Teams Joined: October 31 2006 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 14565 |
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God is am astronaut. don't you know?
Edited by octopus-4 - February 08 2014 at 15:57 |
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I stand with Roger Waters, I stand with Joan Baez, I stand with Victor Jara, I stand with Woody Guthrie. Music is revolution
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proggman ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 14 2013 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 1458 |
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You know what! I can do the same and say that God is real and you have to prove me wrong. |
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When he rides, my fears subside.
For darkness turns once more to light. Through the skies, his white horse flies. To find a land beyond the night. |
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rogerthat ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
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Barney's review is provocative. Hardly a poor one, though. I have read professional reviews making references to the cleavage of the female member in the band, or in any other way to her appearance which, needless to say, you would not be subjected to if it was an all male band and which has nothing to do with the music. I am not sure that there would be a similar ruckus about THAT because it's totally ok to be a closet sexist, right? As much as his review reveals his own views and the person that he is rather than the artist he is criticising, complaining about it and the tone of the complaining also reveals a lot about the complainant's priorities, if I may.
Not 'proverbially bad' to borrow an expression Starostin is fond of using. Would have liked it if he had split it into a few paras though. As it stands, it looks like a scribble and is difficult to read.
Edited by rogerthat - February 08 2014 at 20:37 |
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octopus-4 ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl,Neo & Post/Math Teams Joined: October 31 2006 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 14565 |
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Unless God plays an instrument, I think this discussion should be, at least, moved to another section. It has nothing more to do with music.
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I stand with Roger Waters, I stand with Joan Baez, I stand with Victor Jara, I stand with Woody Guthrie. Music is revolution
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Second Life Syndrome ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 20 2012 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 361 |
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True. And yet his review was 50% about religion, so shouldn't it be moved elsewhere? I think it's fine to keep the review where it is. It just makes me sad that someone feels the need to write a review like this.
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theprogmind.com
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rogerthat ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
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Well, there's got to be somebody to flag the album as Christian rock? The high ratings and all round rave reviews make it look very tempting but, say, an atheist who does not want to be assaulted by Christian rock should at least be able to learn that from the reviews. I should hope that what does and does not constitute a poor review is not determined only by its propensity to offend certain sections of people but also by how informative it is or isn't. I didn't read all the reviews since I am not a fan of this band (and am neither atheist nor Christian, by the way) but Alan B's review was the only other that flagged this aspect. Though it was not mentioned as a drawback. That's a shame. Surely, if indeed Christianity is that central to Morse's lyrics, it should be mentioned in the reviews as fair warning because it can provoke strong reactions either way.
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rogerthat ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
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Well, there's got to be somebody to flag the album as Christian rock? The high ratings and all round rave reviews make it look very tempting but, say, an atheist who does not want to be assaulted by Christian rock should at least be able to learn that from the reviews. I should hope that what does and does not constitute a poor review is not determined only by its propensity to offend certain sections of people but also by how informative it is or isn't. I didn't read all the reviews since I am not a fan of this band (and am neither atheist nor Christian, by the way) but Alan B's review was the only other that flagged this aspect (though it was not mentioned as a drawback). That's a shame. Surely, if indeed Christianity is that central to Morse's lyrics, it should be mentioned in the reviews as fair warning because it can provoke strong reactions either way.
Edited by rogerthat - February 09 2014 at 10:00 |
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