"animals" concept

Here's an interesting article:

http://www.ingsoc.com/waters/personal/animals.html

I think that you can say that Animals is "inspired" by Orwell's Animal Farm ... but only in using animals to describe social classes. I can find no similarities in the stories ... Animals doesn't even really have a story.

Snow Dog wrote: Shack Man wrote: UGH! Its not that hard.  It IS based on George Orwell's Animal Farm and is written for the way of life during WWII and following years. Dogs = Military, Pigs = Government, Sheep = Civilians As I've said before in another thread. There is no connection between Animals and Animal Farm and it has nothing to do with WWII!

OMG there totally is! [thumbs nose, sings childish taunting song]

there are differences, but there are enough similarities to say that it IS based on the book at least LOOSELY. 

otherwise, I guess I could write an album about a young girl's encounter with a wolf at her grandmother's house and say that it is not in any way based on any fairy tale....

DeathRow wrote: Where in the lyrics is their a similarity to Orwell's Farm? Clearly it's about life in the hood, as the Pigs horrass us poor sheep, and the dogs are biterly fighting innocent hoodies, for the bones thrown to them by the pigs. And of course we the meek sheep, do not take it for granted, and we rise, soon to be put back in our place by the pigs. Some, and only similarities to Orwell';s vision on Fascismo-communism. The cover: A factory, as opposed to the farm in Orwell's version. The names of the different crownies, pigs, dogs and sheep. The storie as tolled by Roger Watters, is very incoherent, and has no relevance to anything remotly similar to Animal Farm.

Did you ever read the book? Did you ever read the lyrics?
I mean, Waters didnt make a musical version of Orwell's novel. Animals
was inspired by that book and other subjects related to the working class
(sheep) being exploited by the big fat rich Employers (Pigs) who maintain
control of theyr assets by paying to another class (the ignorant and brutal
dogs). Is that dificult to understand? Its quite clear actually

Empty Spaces wrote: I dont quite agree with the sentiment that 'dogs' are really the "aggressive, ruthless capitalists" it seems people percieve them as: I always thought 'dogs' was on eof the more melancholy tracks, about people who simply work to try and stay ahead but are "fitted with collar and chain" anyway. The Dogs, not the sheep, to me represent a large proportion of the population who are forced into doing ignoble acts by pressures beyond their influence. Even waters takes a sympathetic approach to the Dogs in Pigs on the Wing (2) when he says "and any fool knows/ a dog needs a home/ a shelter... from pigs on the wing" To me the sheep bear many more of the tendencies of a brutal communist regime as depicted in 'animal farm'. This is especially true of the corrupted religeous imagery (the weirdly synthesised variation of the Lords prayer), the single mindedness, and the violence depicted: " Bleeting and babbling we fell on his neck with a scream/ wave upon wave of demented avengers...". To me, the sheep are the thuggish masses who are easily led into madness by the Pigs- perhaps the reference to killing the dogs even demonstrates scapegoating of a (more or less) innocent facet of society Pigs are almost certainly meant to represent exploitative leaders, especially given the direct references made. The 'Pigs on the Wing' tracks describe how a person has to try and eek out what they can (in this case trust/love) from the various flawed social strata. Also, as a final point, at the live 8 thingy, did the camera fix on battersea power station mid way through one of 'Floyds songs?

The dogs do represent the businessmen that attack eachother for social rankings, not exactly like orwell's representation of the dogs, he had the dogs represent the military, but Water's has said that they represent the military to a degree in the album. The lyrics are more aimed at business men though,

 " Club tie, and the firm handshake, sudden look in the eye and that easy smile, you have to be trusted. By the people that you lie to, so that when they turn their back on you, you'll get the chance to put the knife in."

This is no doubt representing business men. As for the sheep, they must represent the mass workers and most of the population, if not, then how would an uprising take place, and the lyrics clearly show an uprising during the Lord's prayer and the lyrics after the prayer.

Yes, there was a picture of the Battersea Power Station on the big screen behind them during live 8, I noticed that too.

I dont quite agree with the sentiment that 'dogs' are really the "aggressive, ruthless capitalists" it seems people percieve them as: I always thought 'dogs' was on eof the more melancholy tracks, about people who simply work to try and stay ahead but are "fitted with collar and chain" anyway. The Dogs, not the sheep, to me represent a large proportion of the population who are forced into doing ignoble acts by pressures beyond their influence. Even waters takes a sympathetic approach to the Dogs in Pigs on the Wing (2) when he says "and any fool knows/ a dog needs a home/ a shelter... from pigs on the wing"

To me the sheep bear many more of the tendencies of a brutal communist regime as depicted in 'animal farm'. This is especially true of the corrupted religeous imagery (the weirdly synthesised variation of the Lords prayer), the single mindedness, and the violence depicted: " Bleeting and babbling we fell on his neck with a scream/ wave upon wave of demented avengers...". To me, the sheep are the thuggish masses who are easily led into madness by the Pigs- perhaps the reference to killing the dogs even demonstrates scapegoating of a (more or less) innocent facet of society

Pigs are almost certainly meant to represent exploitative leaders, especially given the direct references made.
The 'Pigs on the Wing' tracks describe how a person has to try and eek out what they can (in this case trust/love) from the various flawed social strata.

Also, as a final point, at the live 8 thingy, did the camera fix on battersea power station mid way through one of 'Floyds songs?

They're both about control and share many metaphors

(pigs: rich fat cats,

dogs: hard bastards that get paid by the pigs,

sheep: those poor overworked commoners )

but I'm pretty sure they're fundamentally different ideologically.

Edited by goose

Where in the lyrics is their a similarity to Orwell's Farm?

Clearly it's about life in the hood, as the Pigs horrass us poor sheep, and the dogs are biterly fighting innocent hoodies, for the bones thrown to them by the pigs. And of course we the meek sheep, do not take it for granted, and we rise, soon to be put back in our place by the pigs.

Some, and only similarities to Orwell';s vision on Fascismo-communism.

The cover: A factory, as opposed to the farm in Orwell's version.

The names of the different crownies, pigs, dogs and sheep.
The storie as tolled by Roger Watters, is very incoherent, and has no relevance to anything remotly similar to Animal Farm.

My understanding is this:

-Dogs are the aggressive, ruthless capitalists
-Pigs are the hypocritical watchdogs and guardians of moral values
-Sheep are the mindless followers and oppressed

so, just wondering...i have an ideia of the meaning of this album, but still some doubts....

dogs are the "bad guys" and they are always trying to take advantage on the others...but if thats correct the last part does not make sense to me....

"who was born in a house full of pain.......who was told what to do by the man........who fitted with collar and chain.....who was only a stranger at home......who was drag down by stone"

maybe he's sayng that they "became dogs" because of society or something like that?

sheeps are the mass....stupid and alianated, ignoring the fact that they are being explored

pigs?...it seams to me that they are the rulers that explore the sheeps....not sure....

what about the pigs on the wing? any specific meaning?

and what does he mean by:

"you're nearly a laugh but you really are a cry" ? maybe that it's that their situation is almost funny and quite sad at the same time..?

explanations and corrections are welcome.