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Bridging the gap from punk to prog
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kirk782 View Drop Down
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    Posted: Yesterday at 03:30
Whilst there were some artists whose sound depicted both the screeching anarchy of punk and the progressive nature of long formed music [most notably Peter Hamill from VdGG] but was there any artist which started from punk and then switched their sound/careers all the way to prog or vice versa.

Whilst not a proper example, but Joe Strummer of the Clash's solo career had a vary diverse set of instruments and leaning towards longer complex songs[ One called Minstrel Boy with a violin choir, I think, ran all the way to 17 mins long on the studio variant]. I would be interested if any more artists grew from the embroys of punk and not only adopted more sounds, but embraced a career that could rival any new era progressive rock band.
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I can think to many new wave artist who switched to prog, i.e. David Sylvian and Talk Talk. I can't think to anyone coming directly from punk
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Points: 604 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote questionsneverknown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 09:58
Two groups that come to mind are Wire and Pere Ubu. 

Wire's debut Pink Flag (1977) is an important work from the initial period of UK punk, but by the second and third albums, Chairs Missing and 154, they were already doing something far more radical and experimental. Looking back, while Pink Flag has some of the signs of punk (brash, fast and brutal), it is already pushing at the edges and avoids being simply fast rock 'n' roll.

Pere Ubu are perhaps an even weirder case. Their first EP and album have some tracks that were accepted as part of the mid-70s punk landscape, but the band were probably already (paradoxically) post-punk before punk was really a thing. By the end of the 70s, they carried on into stranger and stranger experiments (with former members of Henry Cow and Red Crayola joining as members).

Both bands are probably better described as post-punk than punk, but I'd also say that the line between post-punk and progressive music is very, very thin. It's certainly not symphonic prog, but post-punk offered some of the most adventurous experiments in rock in the late 70s, early 80s. 
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Post-punk is great, but I'm not a big fan of punk or hardcore punk at all.

I'd agree with the above poster that post-punk was indeed very adventurous and experimental!
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Points: 21334 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nogbad_The_Bad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 hours 29 minutes ago at 11:03
Good call on Wire and Pere Ubu
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Points: 604 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote questionsneverknown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 hours 29 minutes ago at 14:03
The Stranglers often get mentioned in this context as well, especially because of Dave Greenfield's keyboards. Hell, they had a few concept albums too.
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The damage that we do just goes on and on and on but not long enough.

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Points: 7413 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 hours 46 minutes ago at 16:46
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

I can think to many new wave artist who switched to prog, i.e. David Sylvian and Talk Talk. I can't think to anyone coming directly from punk


I don't think many true "punk" musicians had the musical chops to hack Prog, but I could be wrong.  I look forward to answers.  I knew of a few in Chicago in the early 1980s, very talented guitarists with local bands like The Corrosives.  Amazing time to be alive! 

The band Gang of Four comes close, this song channels Discipline-era King Crimson to my ears.  RIP Andy Gill, we had a brief email correspondence about his gear once! 




Edited by cstack3 - 16 hours 41 minutes ago at 16:51
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Points: 10680 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Easy Money Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 hours 59 minutes ago at 20:33
Black Flag founder Greg Ginn did some fairly experimental type stuff.
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Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:


I can think to many new wave artist who switched to prog, i.e. David Sylvian and Talk Talk. I can't think to anyone coming directly from punk



I don't think many true "punk" musicians had the musical chops to hack Prog, but I could be wrong.  I look forward to answers.  I knew of a few in Chicago in the early 1980s, very talented guitarists with local bands like The Corrosives.  Amazing time to be alive! 

The band Gang of Four comes close, this song channels Discipline-era King Crimson to my ears.  RIP Andy Gill, we had a brief email correspondence about his gear once! 





That reminds me that the Police did the opposite and posed as Punk rockers early in their career so they could get gigs, although Copeland, Summers and Sting were quite accomplished musicians. Copeland came from the Prog world, Sting's roots were in jazz and Summers studied classical guitar and composition at Cal. State University, Northridge.

The British press eventually labelled them as posers. Summers admitted they were to skilled and professional to come off sounding amateurish. Copeland stated the Police were "charlatans and fakes" and used punk to get noticed and their musical skills outed them as such. I guess it's tough to be a very capable musician and try to sound like a "true" punk rocker.
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Points: 1068 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheLionOfPrague Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 hours 39 minutes ago at 20:53
Youth of America - Wipers

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Practice Makes Perfect - Wire

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9M0vuDE5gig&ab_channel=Wire-Topic


Jesus of Suberbia - Green Day

https://youtu.be/4z7oi-QxE8s


Masoko Tanga - The Police

https://youtu.be/W0k6nXLwZrY
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kirk782 View Drop Down
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Points: 211 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kirk782 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 hours 18 minutes ago at 23:14
I have heard Wire's debut Pink Flag but never visited their later works. Pere Ubu, I have heard a lot of appreciation for, though I haven't heard them. They have a long list of albums. What was their best run, in your opinion [Starting from a bad LP can leave a sour taste as I once discovered when I listened to Bridges to Babylon as my Rolling Stones' introduction.]?

The Police, yes, posed as a punk band. Iconically, The Police also went worldwide to support their first album and they chose countries specifically where rock wasn't popular. Sting remembered having a bad welcome from audience in Egypt. I think they were the first proper rock group to play in my country, India; though the crowd would have just swayed at the sounds rather than lyrics since the Police then weren't too popular outside UK, let alone in nations where rock wasn't the main form of consumption.

Also, does anyone know if Gang of Four chose that name after the "Gang of Four" in China? It wasn't weird for groups to associate themselves with controversial names and this name had overtly political overtones.
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In 1983, LA punk band Bad Religion released Into the Unknown, an album that resembled progressive rock. Although it was largely disliked at the time among punk circles in California and beyond and was eventually put out of print, it developed a cult following over the following two decades and was reissued in the 2000s.
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kirk782 View Drop Down
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Points: 211 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kirk782 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 hours 7 minutes ago at 23:25
There was a lot of gatekeeping in the punk scene as to who was a true punk or not. Some defined punk as amateurish playing that could be taken by anyone and everyone and others as an attitude rather than confined to music itself. The Clash then were cannibalized by the music press for releasing a 3 disc album and associating with all kinds of sounds including music hall on Sandinista . [ Which is kind of ironical because none of the mainstream prog giants ever ventured into the triple disc formula except for the live "Yes Songs" ].

Also, wasn't Talking Heads original debut LP also resembled somewhat the sounds of punk [or was it then called new wave or something else]?
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^Talking Heads somewhat qualifies, as does XTC. But neither moved into "prog" in the strictest sense (as the prog gatekeepers will say, who aren't too different from the punk gatekeepers). Though one can certainly argue the music of Talking Heads was "progressive" in the realm of post-punk and art rock.
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Points: 620 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Criswell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 1 hour 49 minutes ago at 07:43
Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

^Talking Heads somewhat qualifies, as does XTC. But neither moved into "prog" in the strictest sense (as the prog gatekeepers will say, who aren't too different from the punk gatekeepers). Though one can certainly argue the music of Talking Heads was "progressive" in the realm of post-punk and art rock.

I would put Tears for Fears in the group above also...
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