classical

dude wrote: Please forgive me for introducing what some may consider an "Elitist" thread,but since the invention of the modern piano  by Christefori(1709 i think) ushered in a whole new wave of music(and expression) there have been many composers of classical music,Who do you beleive were the most "progressive" and how do you beleive they may have influenced modern progrock...EG ELPs excursions into the classical realm are an example( i can think of other examples but i am very interested in your thoughtful opinions!!)(this ties in with an earlier thread on classical for proggers..which i beleive is importent given the nature of the music we love!!)

belIEve! Are you dyslexic, dude ? About your question, I think BACH has influenced many people (for the "church" organ as said previously in another thread danbo and the points-counterpoints) : Yes' "Close to the edge" or "Awaken" for the use of the organ, ELP (on "Tarkus"), The Nice (they have released a prog version of the Brandenburger Concerto), Robert Fripp, Ron Jarzombek in Spastic Ink, Steve Morse (the title "point counterpoint" on Southern steel or "flat baroque" on Coast to coast relate clearly to the BAROQUE era, and Bach in peculiar)... Otherwise, I think CHOPIN influenced many shredders : Tony McAlpine, Vitalij Kuprij... The french romantics (ST-SAEANS, DEBUSSY) had a huge influence on Kit Watkins  (just listen to some of his compositions on Happy The Man's first record : "Starborne" or "Hidden moods") and on the brazilian violinist Marcus Viana (leader of the symph-prog band Sagrado Coraçao da terra and one of the most gifted violinist I heard in my life). Tony Banks was also surely influenced by some romantics. And LISZT almost surely influenced guys such as Jordan Rudess. However, jazz-oriented bands such as Magma or Soft Machine were probably more influenced by guys such as Duke Ellington than F. Chopin. And the RIO and Zappa-influenced bands have surely more in common with Stravinsky, Varèse and Ligeti than with the romantic composers. Oh, I forgot to mention Mussorgsky without whom "Pictures at an exhibition" would never have been.

 I apologise on his behalf, Dude.

Shall I start publicly pointing out all the errors/poor English in other people's reviews?

I think not.

In any case, if you feel moved to correct a prog buddy, there is the Private Messenger. (Much more considerate and diplomatic, you know.)

Edited by Peter Rideout

Back to the main topic. Focus were the masters of neo-classical rock along with Gentle Giant (see my review on Hamburger Concerto). Nothing against Emerson. I'm a big fan of the Nice & ELP but classical musicians tend to see his re-workings of the classics as butcher jobs. I'm sure Mussorsky was doing backflips in his grave when Pictures came out.

Vibrationbaby wrote: Back to the main topic. Focus were the masters of neo-classical rock along with Gentle Giant (see my review on Hamburger Concerto). Nothing against Emerson. I'm a big fan of the Nice & ELP but classical musicians tend to see his re-workings of the classics as butcher jobs. I'm sure Mussorsky was doing backflips in his grave when Pictures came out.

I don't know much about Mussorsky, but maybe the old composers would be flattered and intrigued by the attention given to their music in a new format, and might have embraced the new technology, like music-writing programs on computers. Perhaps Beethoven would have loved to have played with a synth.

We'll never know, but it's fun to speculate!

Now those "hooked on classics" dance mixes of the disco era -- they were unforgivable CRAP!

YES I HAVE OFTEN THOUGHT OF THAT IMAGINE EMERSON LAKE AND BACH...HOLY MOLY!!!! OR PiNK FLOYD WITH GUEST ARTIST MENDEHELSSON how they would have done the "fingals cave" overture

Edited by dude

A good example of how classic masters might have reacted to  modern interpretations of their music using the new technology ie. synths, electric guitars amplification etc. were some comments made by Segovia regarding John Mclaughlin's Mahavishnu Orchestra. He thought highly of McLaughlin's speed and technical ability but couldn't stand his overdriven, over-amplified & distorted guitar. He was a true enemy of the electric guitar. My wife is a classical musician and teacher as I mentioned on another thread and likes some of the stuff I listen to but she will often make comments like, "sure, he can play the notes but he is not getting the music." She is a little bit more open minded than a lot of people she brings to the house. When I know a particular person is easily offended by loud rock music then I'll throw on something like Guru Guru UFO crank up the stereo and get the dogs barking.

Just imagine Yngwie Malmsteen duetting with that 17th-century violin shredder Tartini!

And Stockhausen, Varese et al have surely done more for electronic music than anyone? Frank Zappa (may he rest in peace) was profoundly influenced by Varese, from the accounts I've read. Stockhausen, of course, invented sequencing back in the early 1940s. Check out his music - especially Gesang Der Junglinge or Kontakte - it will blow your mind, or send you into a deep state of total confusion...

 

WARNING: convoluted run-on sentence ensues!

In answer to the original question: by the way we view the history of music, the aknowledged masters of classical music from the  Baroque period (J. S. Bach, Handel, Pachabel, Vivaldi), to the "Classical" classical period (Beethoven, Hayden, Mozart), through the Romantic period (Brahms, Tchaikovsky, Wagner); were by definition progressive, taking what had come before and adding to it to go someplace new.

We remember the above composers precisely because they made something new and brilliant that shocked their contemporaries and survived unto the day.

Stormcrow wrote: WARNING: convoluted run-on sentence ensues! In answer to the original question: by the way we view the history of music, the aknowledged masters of classical music from the  Baroque period (J. S. Bach, Handel, Pachabel, Vivaldi), to the "Classical" classical period (Beethoven, Hayden, Mozart), through the Romantic period (Brahms, Tchaikovsky, Wagner); were by definition progressive, taking what had come before and adding to it to go someplace new. We remember the above composers precisely because they made something new and brilliant that shocked their contemporaries and survived unto the day.

Exactly!

Glass-Prison wrote: Rachmanhoff

Correction : Rachmaninoff.