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Prog Semi Final #1 - Yes v. Pink Floyd |
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micky 
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 Posted: January 15 2015 at 17:18 |
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LIES!!!!!!!  |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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micky
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 18:23 |
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aye. Agreed on both points Richard. Roger - Of course the negativity was very thin in Yes... as it in general with Symphonic. Remember those days man... it was all about love and hope. That positive hippy vibe.. the suckers didn't know that Reagan and Thatcher were just around the corner. If one wants negativity.. I'd look elsewhere than symphonic. Perhaps Prog Metal where you will have as much luck there trying to find happy upbeat hippy drippy trippy sh*t man. and yes ... but not just Floyd.. one reason I so love Space Rock is the atmosphere and the various kinds of emotions it can inspire. No subgenre other than perhaps the electronic stuff can do that. Edited by micky - January 15 2015 at 18:25 |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 18:43 |
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I wouldn't say that about all of symphonic in general. ELP have that edgy, metal-like attitude about them (even without guitars!). So even if they weren't mournful, they were at least badass. I won't touch Genesis knowing you have a high opinion of them *cough cough* but the theatrical element in their music by itself helped them cover a wider gamut. Yes are neither badass nor do they embrace aforesaid negative emotions. You put it down perfectly - hippy. Strange, considering it's often said of Floyd that unless you do drugs, you can't possibly get them. I obviously did not listen to these bands at the time. Listening to them through the noughties, I find Floyd more grounded than Yes in the sense the former actually seemed to recognise the collapse of the welfare state and its impact while Yes music now comes across as oblivious to everything that was happening around them.
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micky
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 19:07 |
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well said Roger... and for me ... that state of obliviousness.. is often a wonderful place to be. Just as it likely was back in the day. Music is all about escape man.. and that is not always drug-induced (implied or actual haha) atmospheric trips to the deepest darkest unexplored regions (LOVE them as I do)... but often just about being taken to groovy places.. better places happier places than the world we live in man. Yes music to me was always green grass and tea parties under sunny skies on a hill overlooking a quaint English village... accompanied by a nyphomanic blond who only knew one word... yes. |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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sleeper
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 19:49 |
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Lol, if anybody starts using my reviews I'll be laughing, they're pretty bad, especially early ones like my Yes reviews. |
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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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micky
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 20:10 |
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yeah. I know what you mean. I cringe when I think of my early reviews. God those were terrible. Actually embarassed by them to the point where I won't read them again. My problem was I only progressed from terrible to mediocre. I did have a few fits of inspired reviewing greatness but all in all, reviewing just wasn't a talent of mine. Funny because I do lot of creative writing and actually have been commended on it. However trying to review music? I just never found a particular 'voice' and never felt comfortable doing it, especially when (as I often joke) I am continuously looking into the heart of the sun and blinded by my wife who is one of the best damn reviewers I've ever read. Hard to feel mine are in the same league as hers so I just do what I do best and so much better than her spam baby.. |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Dellinger
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 21:32 |
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I remember something about Dave having a coke problem during the 80's. |
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Dellinger
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 21:35 |
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Well, even though I'm not particularly a fan of those songs Yes covered, I must admit that the treatment they did to the songs was really great, turning simple short pop tunes into long prog ones. I really wish they had covered some other songs I truly like. |
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 22:03 |
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I agree with what you said earlier that Anderson is the problem in that regard. If I have to lose myself in an escapist trip, the vocals have to be captivating or better yet, not there at all ha ha. A beautiful melody like And you and I should engage me much before but the vocals then suck out all the energy. GG also had the same problem but their tracks are short and smart and don't overstay their welcome. I also think Yes got a bit templated over time. Like, Siberian Khatru makes me go deja vu; the third track in the Yours is no disgrace-Roundabout template. They didn't seem to experiment as boldly as KC though more so than Genesis or Floyd. Hell, I love all these bands. This is all just nitpicking for the sake of distinguishing them and voting. Edited by rogerthat - January 15 2015 at 22:29 |
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micky
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Posted: January 15 2015 at 22:14 |
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oh yeah. Beats just posting...
'Floyd' or 'Yes' . of course we are nitpicking.. as I told that one dude in the K.C/Gen thread. It is all in fun, but it is nice (though a bit hard) to have a discussion when really all that matters is what you like, and don't like. Can't argue with that really  Music is not concrete... is all in the eyes and ears of the listener isn't it. It is just nice to read about people trying to explain why they like something.. more fun when they try to explain why they DON'T like something. |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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CosmicVibration
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 09:17 |
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The difference between Pink Floyd and Yes is like the difference between Confucius and Lao Tzu. Confucius mounted a horse and navigated across the earth while Lao Tzu mounted a dragon and ascended into the heavens. I dig them both but favor Yes by far. Yes lyrics are not a “meaningless string of words” and “ridiculous”. Jon uses a lot of metaphors in his writing, if not understood then of course they will sound nonsensical. His transcendental messages are insightful and spiritual in nature. They truly resonate with me. I don’t view Jon as some sort of prophet. For the most part he is simply regurgitating the wisdom of the prophets.
Dreamer easy in the chair that really fits you Long last treatment of the telling that relates to all the words sung Dreamer easy in the chair that really fits you Love comes to you and then after Dream on on to the Heart of the Sunrise" – Jon Anderson |
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 09:32 |
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Yeah, I am not among those who necessarily regard his lyrics gibberish. But as an Indian, I am inclined to take his whole spiritual trip with a bucketload of salt. Is there really some magical wisdom waiting to be grabbed in the East? I am not so sure and all the poverty I see on the streets doesn't reflect a lot of wisdom. If we were that wise, we would have solved our problems long before. I can understand the novelty value of it from a Western perspective, especially the almost chant-like vocals in parts of TFTO (which I dislike quite intensely).
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CosmicVibration
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 10:26 |
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You are right, most are not wise. To postulate further, underneath the human exterior too many are not even humane. To turn things around it’s important to take heed of the core messages from the wise ones. Sensible messages of harmony, love, peace, balance etc. The masses always dictate the circumstances of the planet. I think in this day and age of technological evolution, spiritual evolution is more critical than ever. Man can destroy the entire planet with a push of a button. The precursor to spiritual evolution is to simply be humane. Our free will can turn this place into a heaven or a hell. We can also stagnate in purgatory, but not too much longer, technological advancement will see to that. |
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 10:30 |
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Before peace and harmony must come mere tolerance. There seems to be an intolerant Nazi inside one and all, just depends on pushing the 'right' buttons to awaken them. Once we have learned to step back a little, a lot of things would get easier. Anyway, that's another discussion, another thread. While I don't disagree with any of what you said, I was only expressing my more jaded reaction to Yes based on my own worldview, my background.
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micky
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 18:16 |
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hmmm... interesting.... I think you do it a disservice Roger by equating it to a 'novelty'. This is a subject I'd love to go deeper into.... but this likely isn't the place for it |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 19:11 |
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Well, colour me skeptical of people who describe all these fantastic experiences with mystics in the woods that changed their lives forever. When Prince Siddhartha left the comforts of the palace, haunted by the problems of the human condition, he lived all by himself in the forest, found enlightenment and thereby was named the Buddha....and never came back. Once people come back to the 'normal', material world, then, no matter what, the old problems of the material world will return. Because it's the endless wants we chase that contribute to the bad feelings we end up harbouring for some of our fellow citizens. The only way to break out of that cycle is to get to a place where those wants can no longer be fulfilled. How much of his earnings exactly did Anderson write off to charity, for instance? And why was he so upset at getting thrown out of the band at an age where perhaps he should have become an ascetic and renounced his personal possessions? So...for me, it's ok, just harmless fun (of, albeit, a very different sort) and no more. Anderson is a thought provoking rock lyricist....but no Ramakrishna Paramhansa. Although his tone may make it appear as if he wishes to share something that he believes is profound, his own life experience suggests that perhaps it is not so profound after all.
Edited by rogerthat - January 16 2015 at 19:12 |
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LearsFool
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 20:43 |
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Anderson might have had his thought provoking moments, but Tales doesn't seem like one of them. He was a lyricist who wrote more to sound good with the music than to actually share ideas, and here, what few ideas he would have shared... well, he was just guessing at what the Hindu scriptures contained, just from what little he ascertained from a footnote in Yogananda's autobiography. An autobiography he had only known for a few weeks when he started to cook up his wild idea; he was introduced to it by Jamie Muir at Bruford's wedding party in early March of '73 - the year album was cut and dropped - and was busy writing the compositions with Howe by April.
I'd say the lyrics come out the way a song comes out when a band tries to sound like another band that they've never actually heard, only ANDERSONISED!
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Dellinger
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Posted: January 16 2015 at 22:13 |
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I don't really understand all this aversion towards Anderson's vocals. I find him to be one of my very favourite singers, and find his voice really beautiful. What I love so much from yes, specially on the CttE line-up, is that absolutley every member was among the very best on their instrument (or at least among my very favourites), and that includes Jon.
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rogerthat
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Posted: January 17 2015 at 00:42 |
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He does have a very beautiful voice but I am afraid he doesn't do very much with his instrument. There is hardly any modulation and next to no vibrato even where there ought to be. Even in terms of the emotions he can evoke, his range is quite limited. Most good singers have a soft, mellow side of their tone AND a dark, hefty side as well (even without using any 'grit'). But if Anderson does have that, he doesn't use it. I have heard Yes fans justify it as being what the music required. Maybe but it doesn't work for me. I have to kind of shut it out of my mind and focus on the rest of the music. At the other end of the spectrum is Howe who is, by many accounts, a great guitarist but I don't like his tone on the electric. Nylon string/acoustic is a different story altogether. No complaints of any sort against Wakeman, Squire and Bruford though.
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micky
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Posted: January 17 2015 at 06:08 |
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ahhh.. I see. I think I missed your point Roger as I was in 'drive by and shoot' posting mode yesterday. I mark a very definitive milepost in life when I discovered Hinduism in college years ago. It sure as hell was no novelty. It gave form and substance to what I already felt and believed as well as molding my future outlook on everything.yes i can see the point of calling musicians flirting with eastern religions and philosophies a 'novelty'. However if musicians did, like George Harrison, introduce people to them, even if it surely was no novelty to him it is a good thing is it not? They do no harm, and anytime you can get people starting to think big picture rather than their own selfish selves. It is damned well a good thing |
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Kati wrote:
oh no. Don't do that. You WANT others to use it... it means our sh*t-house crazy notions actually have some traction and basis. I could have copyrighted a bunch of my Genesis critiques.. but to my chagrin.. I started finding others that started using them before I could copyright it. 
