the importance of analog sound in prog

Dean wrote: Snow Dog wrote: Don't you get sick of doing this every six months or so Dean?       No.    Seriously, I enjoy the mental challenge, even if it does get repetitive, there is always some slightly different angle that requires a few seconds extra thought before I post something.   And of course I am hoping that one day someone will present a case that is not subjective and can be demostrated under controlled conditons that could suggest there is something to it other than confirmation bias and other psychological effects is at work here. At present that has not been done, none of the claims have been proven because no one has attempted to prove them, the onus is on the analogue/vinyl aficionados to do that.   However, I do tire of reading articles and arguments cut'n'paste verbatim from other websites though, I would like one day to have someone express this in their own words so we can get a real discussion going on this subject - perhaps the original authors of both those articles could come here and discuss this with me - I would love to know how Mr Jimmy Reds thinks digitisers quantise frequency sweeps as discrete tones, I would enjoy having him refute or argue against my critique of his article. This is why I would l like to see throw-away comments backed up with solid explanations.

Catcher10 wrote: I am not superior to anyone nor am I a smug person, [...] ...So I take a very, very small offense to part of the comments above.

Catcher10 wrote: Part of that thinking does come from the side that feels if you are not 100% into digital, CDs, mp3, laptop music and phone listening then your style of listening mode is ancient and wrong.....Ok fine, whatever.

Aw, come on, those must be the same people who only listen to Nikki Minaj or what have you.  I have seen people of my generation, which means mid-20s, proudly lug vinyls home from music stores.  You can never get that feeling while collecting your CDs from the shop, vinyls are so huge and attract attention, especially because not many buy them these days.  But I can safely carry half a dozen CDs home in the overcrowded commute to home which I can't with vinyl.   That's the way it goes. 


Edited by rogerthat - October 15 2012 at 10:23

Catcher10 wrote: progbethyname wrote: My best listening experience is when I get a hold of CDs that are recorded in the 24BIT 96KHTZ PCM format. What CD are you getting that are recorded at 24/96?? CDs are redbook standard which is 16/44.4.....You can get a digital file at 24/96, for example downloaded from HDTracks.com....So I may not fully understand what you are saying.

Dean,

Why would I not copy and paste facts from other sites who offer more detailed information and explanations?  Certainly you have discredited everything I have said or been laughably dismissive.  In your close minded world of science, 1's and 0's cannot be wrong.

If that is so.. then why are some CD players better than others? Why are there digital audiophiles? Does that not prove there are differences in subjective opinion even in the clinical factual world of digital music?

In your world.. you make the case that flat, cold, and lifeless recordings are simply the way music should sound.  That this is the REAL sound and one better get used to it.  Anything rich, warm, natural sounding is simply caused by a flawed stereo system that is adding "color" to the truth and because it sounds so much better, it must be wrong and due to analog distortion.

Your writings would make for a great comedy skit on SNL.  I can picture a character who is dressed like a metal head but wears nerdy horned rim glasses who critics the music people bring in and the character keeps repeating "well, that ain't digital mate" if it's a record, and "sounds like heavy metal" if it's a CD or an ipod.

I can tell you for a fact Dean.. you DON'T have a good vinyl set up or you would speak otherwise.  You are most likely basing your subjective opinion on listening to a substandard cartridge, an unbalanced tone arm, radio shack interconnects, solid state amplification or a tube amp that is not working at proper voltages, copper speaker cables, and probably low efficiency speakers without horn drivers.  Anyone of the issues just mentioned could make for a inadequate listening experience playing vinyl records.

Catcher, I can tell has a quality rig, as he mentioned some of the gear he has in his set up.  It's been thought out and some attention to detail has been integrated.  This is why he prefers vinyl. It sounds better.. it's not very subjective.  Just have two ears and a listen.

Dean,

Your logic is also extremely subjective by only basing things on science.  It is like saying Dream Theater is better than Rush because Portnoy can play fills faster than Neil and Petrucci can play chromatic scales faster than Lifeson.  Any arguments that suggest Rush is better are purely subjective rubbish because you own the facts.  Songs, Lyrics, textures, feel are just subjective nonsense that has nothing to do with the clinical structure of music.

Let me guess... you like Dream Theater better than Rush?

Surrealist wrote: Dean, Why would I not copy and paste facts from other sites who offer more detailed information and explanations?  Certainly you have discredited everything I have said or been laughably dismissive.  In your close minded world of science, 1's and 0's cannot be wrong.

Edited by Dean - October 15 2012 at 17:14

progbethyname wrote: Dean wrote: Catcher10 wrote: progbethyname wrote: My best listening experience is when I get a hold of CDs that are recorded in the 24BIT 96KHTZ PCM format. What CD are you getting that are recorded at 24/96?? CDs are redbook standard which is 16/44.4.....You can get a digital file at 24/96, for example downloaded from HDTracks.com....So I may not fully understand what you are saying. He is refering to DVD-Audio or DVD-A format - since it is a DVD standard it's not covered by the Philips/Sony rainbow book standards, which are for CD not DVD. SACD format as well which has a pulse modulated code of 24/96. Marillion remasters from 1998 and Depeche mode albums as well. Best quality I've ever heard.

I have the Dark Side of the Moon 25th anniversary remaster in SACD but unfortunatey I've never owned the equipment to play it on.

Edited by Dean - October 15 2012 at 13:20

progbethyname wrote: Also. Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about my current audio set up that I posted on page 5? Be nice to get any idea at all by how I can improve it. Thanks so much and great forum. Definately one of the better ones I've be a part of. Thank you guys.

I never comment on peoples equipment and rarely make suggestions or recommendations (on brands or models). You seem to have worked out the setup needed to match the HD800s - a purpose built HP amp could be the next step because a 250W amp can produce more voltage than the HD800s can handle and that will damage them - while you would never use them at those levels, accidents do happen (young kids playing with the volume control when your back is turned kind of thing). If you do consider that route then obviously listen to what you are buying first and don't just buy on spec or by looking at price tickets. Those headphones can also be used with portable equipment if you invest in a suitable portable HP amp. Again - buyer beware - there are some high-priced rip-offs on the market.

Edited by Dean - October 15 2012 at 14:01

I enjoy an even mix of both CD and Vinyl.