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Joined: December 13 2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2111
Posted: July 18 2012 at 19:25
Horizons wrote:
Porcupine Tree aren't indulgent what-so-ever.
I'm not offended or anything by the way, just having a conversation - sorry if i come off that way. Here are some songs, i personally think are progressive. Plus i don't think anyone here thinks PT are completely prog in the sense of Yes, VdGG, TMV, etc. I think they're progressive in the way Rush are, just rock/alternative with progressive visions that differ in certain eras.
Good to see you aren't offended, because I can't tell you how many Porcupine Tree fans I've gotten into arguments with over what I would deem "trivial". I guess I'm just an "old school" progger. I'm pretty weird when it comes to Rush, I like their early 80s albums better than anything before and after.
“Music is enough for a lifetime but a lifetime is not enough for music.” - Sergei Rachmaninov
I'm not offended or anything by the way, just having a conversation - sorry if i come off that way. Here are some songs, i personally think are progressive. Plus i don't think anyone here thinks PT are completely prog in the sense of Yes, VdGG, TMV, etc. I think they're progressive in the way Rush are, just rock/alternative with progressive visions that differ in certain eras.
Good to see you aren't offended, because I can't tell you how many Porcupine Tree fans I've gotten into arguments with over what I would deem "trivial". I guess I'm just an "old school" progger. I'm pretty weird when it comes to Rush, I like their early 80s albums better than anything before and after.
Joined: April 01 2009
Location: Atlanta
Status: Offline
Points: 26138
Posted: July 18 2012 at 20:07
I wondered myself for a while: what's so great about Porcupine Tree?
I first heard "Sky Moves Sideways" when it came out, and I thought it was pretty good as a Pink Floyd-derivative project. It wasn't even a real band yet at that point, more of a Steven Wilson "look what I can do by myself" project. Not bad at all. Signify came out next, and I heard some metal elements start to creep in, which I wasn't particularly thrilled with (I didn't like metal at all at the time), but I still had to admit it was good music. Then I saw them at Progfest when "Stupid Dream" came out, and that's where I jumped ship. These are pop songs! What the? But again, it wasn't bad, but at that point I stopped following them.
And then about 10 years later, they entered my life again. I started reading people talking about them on message boards. Porcupine Tree? Really? They're still around? And people of all colors and shapes were raving about this band. I just happened to have a copy of their recent Sirius XM broadcast, which I'd had for a year and hadn't even listened to yet. So I listened, and carried it around with me for a while. The songs were accessible, but they had that full, resonant sound that combined drama, heaviness, harmony vocals, impeccable playing, just everything in its right place. I was impressed, and before long I went back and saw what else I'd missed.
To me, Steven Wilson is the consummate prog fan, who knows how to make records that push the emotional buttons that he would want to hear in an album as a prog fan. He's just a brilliant architect, in a way, drawing upon decades of prog tradition into something that's familiar, warm, and reflects his love of music.
Edited by HolyMoly - July 18 2012 at 20:16
My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.
Joined: December 13 2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2111
Posted: July 18 2012 at 20:17
Horizons wrote:
What kind of modern prog do you like?
I like several of Dream Theater's albums, IQ (even though I said I don't like them --- I must confess I'm starting to enjoy them), Marillion (a few of their recordings I enjoy), Big Big Train are pretty cool. TransAtlantic had some good stuff. I really need to get familiar with more modern progressive rock. Any suggestions besides Porcupine Tree or Flower Kings?
“Music is enough for a lifetime but a lifetime is not enough for music.” - Sergei Rachmaninov
Joined: February 08 2008
Location: Location
Status: Offline
Points: 28772
Posted: July 18 2012 at 21:23
Gotta get into modern RIO/Avant.
Honestly though, you might enjoy Aranis, assuming you enjoy classical music as much as Shostakovich is making me think you might. They're very much more chamber music than rock, very very good group though.
Joined: December 13 2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2111
Posted: July 18 2012 at 21:34
SaltyJon wrote:
Gotta get into modern RIO/Avant.
Honestly though, you might enjoy Aranis, assuming you enjoy classical music as much as Shostakovich is making me think you might. They're very much more chamber music than rock, very very good group though.
Thanks for the recommendation, but I can't say I've been impressed with the RIO movement. Henry Cow, Hatfield and the North, National Health, The Art Bears, and more recently Thinking Plague. They're a little far out there for me. I do like some of the Canterbury stuff like Gentle Giant and Caravan.
I'm a huge classical fan with a 7,000 classical CD collection comprising mostly of 20th Century composers. My favorites are Shostakovich (of course), Bartok, Ravel, Prokofiev, Vaughan Williams, Villa-Lobos, Stravinsky, Berg, Janacek, Tippett, Britten, Sibelius, Nielsen, Szymanowski, Respighi, Casella, Arvo Part, William Schuman, Copland, Myaskovsky, Revueltas, Ginastera, Ives, among others. I'm also a fan of jazz and, of course, progressive rock with maybe around 5,000 or 6,000 in addition to my classical collection.
Edited by Mirror Image - July 18 2012 at 21:35
“Music is enough for a lifetime but a lifetime is not enough for music.” - Sergei Rachmaninov
Joined: December 13 2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2111
Posted: July 18 2012 at 21:46
SaltyJon wrote:
I'll stop hijacking the thread after this, I promise, but check this out:
Pretty cool but nothing that sounds like something that I don't already have. This music is approaching John Zorn territory with his Masada recordings. Thanks for sharing.
“Music is enough for a lifetime but a lifetime is not enough for music.” - Sergei Rachmaninov
1. Arriving Somewhere But Not Here 2. Anesthetize 3. Russia on Ice 4. Mellotron Scratch 5. Last Chance to Evacuate Planet Earth Before it is Recycled 6. Collapse the Light Into Earth 7. My Ashes 8. Sleep of No Dreaming 9. Trains 10. Dark Matter
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 29474
Posted: July 19 2012 at 01:06
HolyMoly wrote:
I wondered myself for a while: what's so great about Porcupine Tree?
I first heard "Sky Moves Sideways" when it came out, and I thought it was pretty good as a Pink Floyd-derivative project. It wasn't even a real band yet at that point, more of a Steven Wilson "look what I can do by myself" project. Not bad at all. Signify came out next, and I heard some metal elements start to creep in, which I wasn't particularly thrilled with (I didn't like metal at all at the time), but I still had to admit it was good music. Then I saw them at Progfest when "Stupid Dream" came out, and that's where I jumped ship. These are pop songs! What the? But again, it wasn't bad, but at that point I stopped following them.
And then about 10 years later, they entered my life again. I started reading people talking about them on message boards. Porcupine Tree? Really? They're still around? And people of all colors and shapes were raving about this band. I just happened to have a copy of their recent Sirius XM broadcast, which I'd had for a year and hadn't even listened to yet. So I listened, and carried it around with me for a while. The songs were accessible, but they had that full, resonant sound that combined drama, heaviness, harmony vocals, impeccable playing, just everything in its right place. I was impressed, and before long I went back and saw what else I'd missed.
To me, Steven Wilson is the consummate prog fan, who knows how to make records that push the emotional buttons that he would want to hear in an album as a prog fan. He's just a brilliant architect, in a way, drawing upon decades of prog tradition into something that's familiar, warm, and reflects his love of music.
Joined: November 07 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 1327
Posted: July 20 2012 at 21:58
10. Wedding Nails 9. Blackest Eyes 8. Deadwing 7. Lazarus 6. Arriving Somewhere but Not Here 5. Sentimental 4. Anesthetize 3. Even Less 2. Way Out of Here 1. The Start of Something Beautiful
I never understood the attraction to Porcupine Tree. I have three of their recordings: In Absentia, The Sky Moves Sideways, and Deadwing and they didn't do much for me. I don't get where the progressiveness of this band comes into play. I mean what makes this band progressive? Where are the long improvisations, the continuing development of the songs, etc.? I mean these guys surely can't be ranked alongside of Genesis, Yes, ELP, or King Crimson IMHO. Steve Wilson seems like a good musician, but he's just not a progressive one.
I felt exactly the same when I first heard Stupid Dream. This is supposedly 'progressive rock'??! Can't be! Was another five years before I started to change my mind. Now I own an awfull lot of SW music and wouldn't be without it. Not sure how I made that transition apart from that I was able at some point to enjoy the music without overdosing on too much analysis of what I was listening to. Eventually resistance is futile.
I was the same way.
I bought Deadwing when it came out based on alot of things I'd heard about Porcupine Tree online, and after listening to it I thought "bleh!!!!"
Now, Porcupine Tree is maybe my favorite band, and either Deadwing or In Absentia would make my top-10 favorite albums of all time, depending on which one I like better at the time....
Who is comparing PT with the legendary '70's Prog bands? There are totally different styles. PT are more modern, with many influenses from the '70's (of course), but they are a very good band. Anyway, here is my top-10 list: (Chronological order)
1. Radioactive Toy (1991) 2. Always Never (1993) 3. The Sky Moves Sideways Phase 1 (1995) 4. The Moon Touches Your Shoulder (1995) 5. Even Less (1999) 6. How is your Life Today? (2000) 7. Shesmoved on (2000) 8. Trains (2002) 9. Collapse the Light Into Earth (2002) 10. Arriving Somewhere but not Here (2005)
And here is an incident I lived a few years ago: In an open theater in my hometown (Athens) took place the 1st (and last!) 'Prog- festival'. 3 bands in one night. Blackfield (why these ones were called Prog???), Van Der Graaf Generator, and Porcupine Tree. I went with a friend who is a metalhead, but he adores PT. Me, I went 100% for VDGG. (I had seen PT live many times anyway before). So we were arguing all afternoon about how is possible to put VDGG before PT. IT's a shame! (My opinion) He was saying something about old dinosaurs that they should be home drinkind tea etc etc... Anyway, Blackfield came and gone, and VDGG went on stage. I moved in the first row in front of P.Hammill, and enjoyed an unforgetable performance! Still life, Lemmings, Refugees, and many more masterpieces... After the end of VDGG went back to my seat and my friend was laughing and he was saying things like 'now wait to see the 'real big Prog band'. And I said, 'Look, if VDGG and all those great bands were never had been active back then, probably Mr. Wilson would be doing something very different right now' Maybe own a bar or something! And 'The 'great Prog band' finally came out! With no music as entrance, no effects, nothing! First St.Wilson came on stage, reached the microphone, and said. Good evening athens! I have to say that I really feel awkward putting us to play after VDGG! After all, If these guys were not making music in the '70's, we were probably not be here now... I gave my friend a look, smiled very ironically, and relaxed on my seat for the rest of the show. Justice was given!
(Sorry for my mistakes but I'm not English or American or Canadian etc...)
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Horizons wrote:
They're very much more chamber music than rock, very very good group though. 
I do like some of the Canterbury stuff like Gentle Giant and Caravan.
