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Topic ClosedLiberals Vs. Conservatives
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Poll Question: Are liberals more intelligent than conservatives?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
17 [53.13%]
12 [37.50%]
2 [6.25%]
1 [3.13%]
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:06
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Slarti's argument makes no sense. Conservatives are less intelligent because they are rich and lack empathy for the poor. Setting aside the obvious problems with this logic (what does empathy have to do with intelligence?) there's the fact that MOST RICH PEOPLE ARE LIBERAL! Ted Turner, George Soros, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, John Kerry, the Kennedys for crying out loud. Movie Stars, musicians, authors and heiresses all have a huge majority of liberals in their number. How then, does the argument that conservatives are richness leads to lack of empathy make any sense whatsoever? I would appreciate a serious response.

I said the same a few posts above but no answer. It's easy being liberal when you're rich or also when you like to be dependant. It's more difficult when you want to make it on your own.

Oh I forgot, nobody makes it on their own (Barack, 2012.).
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:09
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:


Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Building a road a $1 at a time isn't very cost effective.
And if you believe that they will actually use the money for what they say they will despite there being no provision in the bills that requires this, then I have a bridge to sell you in Florida.
Well that 1$ will take care of about 1/19th of the hourly wage of the bureaucrat necessary to process the payroll for all bureacrats in charge of processing the neessary permits and bureaucrat regulations necessary to start planning to build the road so show me the bridge. I live in FL so no bureaucratic travel expenses needed. .
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Points: 10841 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:24
Originally posted by tszirmay tszirmay wrote:

Chavez is a former military man, hence a juntist , inspired by the "pink revolution" and anti-American. I guess that's what you mean by the camouflage term "populist". So was Lenin! 
China has a state capitalist government which is a communist dictatorship that loves money and profit (Marx and Engels are turning in their grave).
Europe has been a mess since time immemorial , what else is new? Half are still constitutional monarchies, the rest republics and then you have one who is both (Hungary, a republic with a crown!)
BTW, Hungary is not in Eastern Europe , its Central but still a "backyard" for both Russia and Nato.
My comments are based on the fact that only labels change, politics have barely advanced in the last 50 years. 
Please don't be angry with me, I really respect your 'modern' opinions, as they are universally accepted as the norm ! 


I give up.
And you don't know what is anger.
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Points: 10841 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:25
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:


Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Building a road a $1 at a time isn't very cost effective.
And if you believe that they will actually use the money for what they say they will despite there being no provision in the bills that requires this, then I have a bridge to sell you in Florida.
Well that 1$ will take care of about 1/19th of the hourly wage of the bureaucrat necessary to process the payroll for all bureacrats in charge of processing the neessary permits and bureaucrat regulations necessary to start planning to build the road so show me the bridge. I live in FL so no bureaucratic travel expenses needed. .


Are the bureaucrats part of the Freemason conspiracy or of the Illuminati conspiracy?
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Points: 6673 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:27
You should never give up, its the essence of freedom! The defining characteristic of our new age is the unending urge to pigeon-hole, label and categorize everything, so as facilitate individual judgment. This is the modern disease! Everyone has now the right to judge anything, without any research beyond the Internet, without reading all 2000 pages of jurisprudence, without studying the facts and the reasons (Why? has become a cumbersome question, it takes too much effort and time). We have the right to judge, condemn and even execute without any repercussions (hello twitter!)

So “labeling” is the new comfort zone, slicing and dicing until its comfortable to swallow, a sickness that permeates the PA site as well, everything needs to be in a neat and accessible folder and compartmentalized!

I yearn for a world where debate encompasses empathy and research, where labels are torn away and the truth is revealed as it really is, in all its nakedly pure existence, without camouflage and deflection.  


I know what anger is, suppressing it for 56 years now, best expressed by Einstein, who stated something to the effect of " there are 2 infinites, the universe and human stupidity but I am not too sure of the first one" 
I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 14:30
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:


Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:


Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Building a road a $1 at a time isn't very cost effective.
And if you believe that they will actually use the money for what they say they will despite there being no provision in the bills that requires this, then I have a bridge to sell you in Florida.
Well that 1$ will take care of about 1/19th of the hourly wage of the bureaucrat necessary to process the payroll for all bureacrats in charge of processing the neessary permits and bureaucrat regulations necessary to start planning to build the road so show me the bridge. I live in FL so no bureaucratic travel expenses needed. .
Are the bureaucrats part of the Freemason conspiracy or of the Illuminati conspiracy?
No these are very real.
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Points: 5319 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 15:20
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Building a road a $1 at a time isn't very cost effective.


And if you believe that they will actually use the money for what they say they will despite there being no provision in the bills that requires this, then I have a bridge to sell you in Florida.
I don't believe anything, I just state that tax money cannot be spent on what it is earmarked for until you've collected enough to pay for what you intend to use it on. Calling people liars before they commit the offense is not something I'm prone to.
 
We sell useless bridges to you (and I think you'll find it in Arizona)

I would be willing to bet the bridge in Arizona has made a ton of money

Mr. Robert I Plumer (deceased) was a real estate agent and salesperson for Mr. Robert P. McCulloch. Originally, the deserted Lake Havasu Vacant land was given to the State of Arizona by the Federal government. The federal property was an abandoned landing strip for the military. Mr. McCulloch made a deal with the State of Arizona and received the property for free with a promise to develop the land. The problem was that the real estate agents could not bring in prospective buyers because the land was in the middle of nowhere and very arid and hot. Mr. Plumer, who worked for Mr. McCulloch, learned that the 'London Bridge' was for sale. Mr. Plumer convinced Mr. McCulloch to buy the London Bridge and bring it to the area to attract potential land buyers. The initial response from Mr. McCulloch was "That's the craziest idea I have ever heard." Then, after consideration, Mr. McCulloch decided to go ahead with the purchase. Mr. Plumer then arranged with a cargo shipping company that was going to sail a newly built ship from Great Britain to the US without any cargo. Mr. Plumer said they would pay for all operating costs of the sailing, which was far less than the going rate shipping costs. The bridge arrived in pieces at the Port of Houston and then was overland transported to Lake Havasu City. After it was reconstructed as described below, new prospective land buyers were interested in coming to see the 'London Bridge' and take a tour of properties for sale. Land sales improved and Mr. McCulloch recouped all of his expenses for the purchase and shipping of the bridge. Since the cost of the land was nothing, the sale of the properties paid for the bridge and more. Mr. Robert Plumer died in 2007 in Colorado Springs, CO after a long illness."
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Points: 8581 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 16:52
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Slarti's argument makes no sense. Conservatives are less intelligent because they are rich and lack empathy for the poor. Setting aside the obvious problems with this logic (what does empathy have to do with intelligence?) there's the fact that MOST RICH PEOPLE ARE LIBERAL! Ted Turner, George Soros, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, John Kerry, the Kennedys for crying out loud. Movie Stars, musicians, authors and heiresses all have a huge majority of liberals in their number. How then, does the argument that conservatives are richness leads to lack of empathy make any sense whatsoever? I would appreciate a serious response.




http://flowingdata.com/2010/11/01/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

A sample paragraph:
"The billionaires on the Forbes 400 list have given more than $30 million to politicians and political action committees since 2006, along with millions more in soft money to politically active groups. Although Forbes 400 members give about 15% more money to Republicans than Democrats, they fund groups across the political spectrum."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonbruner/2010/10/29/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

http://www.swissfund.4t.com/custom.html

http://blogs-images.forbes.com/jonbruner/files/2011/09/400-donors-graphic-large.png

http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2012/05/21/count-em-30-billionaires-now-backing-romneys-super-pac/2/

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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 17:11
^ only $30million! The exec's at UK bank Barclays have alone donated £1million to Mitt Romney's campaign. Typical billionaires - they never got rich by giving money away, unlike bankers.
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Points: 2549 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 17:15
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Slarti's argument makes no sense. Conservatives are less intelligent because they are rich and lack empathy for the poor. Setting aside the obvious problems with this logic (what does empathy have to do with intelligence?) there's the fact that MOST RICH PEOPLE ARE LIBERAL! Ted Turner, George Soros, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, John Kerry, the Kennedys for crying out loud. Movie Stars, musicians, authors and heiresses all have a huge majority of liberals in their number. How then, does the argument that conservatives are richness leads to lack of empathy make any sense whatsoever? I would appreciate a serious response.




http://flowingdata.com/2010/11/01/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

A sample paragraph:
"The billionaires on the Forbes 400 list have given more than $30 million to politicians and political action committees since 2006, along with millions more in soft money to politically active groups. Although Forbes 400 members give about 15% more money to Republicans than Democrats, they fund groups across the political spectrum."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonbruner/2010/10/29/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

http://www.swissfund.4t.com/custom.html

http://blogs-images.forbes.com/jonbruner/files/2011/09/400-donors-graphic-large.png

http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2012/05/21/count-em-30-billionaires-now-backing-romneys-super-pac/2/




That doesn't prove that there are more rich republicans than democrats; it could be that rich republicans just tend to be more generous in their donations to politicians.  I don't know that anyone has actual proof either way, though; it appears that rich people are more liberal because liberalism is prominent among celebrities, but there are many more wealthy people in the U.S. who most people haven't heard of.
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 17:28
^ the majority of clebs weren't born rich so that's not a comparison you can make.
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Points: 8581 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 18:20
Originally posted by Ambient Hurricanes Ambient Hurricanes wrote:

Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Slarti's argument makes no sense. Conservatives are less intelligent because they are rich and lack empathy for the poor. Setting aside the obvious problems with this logic (what does empathy have to do with intelligence?) there's the fact that MOST RICH PEOPLE ARE LIBERAL! Ted Turner, George Soros, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, John Kerry, the Kennedys for crying out loud. Movie Stars, musicians, authors and heiresses all have a huge majority of liberals in their number. How then, does the argument that conservatives are richness leads to lack of empathy make any sense whatsoever? I would appreciate a serious response.




http://flowingdata.com/2010/11/01/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

A sample paragraph:
"The billionaires on the Forbes 400 list have given more than $30 million to politicians and political action committees since 2006, along with millions more in soft money to politically active groups. Although Forbes 400 members give about 15% more money to Republicans than Democrats, they fund groups across the political spectrum."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonbruner/2010/10/29/billionaires-favorite-politicians/

http://www.swissfund.4t.com/custom.html

http://blogs-images.forbes.com/jonbruner/files/2011/09/400-donors-graphic-large.png

http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2012/05/21/count-em-30-billionaires-now-backing-romneys-super-pac/2/




That doesn't prove that there are more rich republicans than democrats; it could be that rich republicans just tend to be more generous in their donations to politicians.  I don't know that anyone has actual proof either way, though; it appears that rich people are more liberal because liberalism is prominent among celebrities, but there are many more wealthy people in the U.S. who most people haven't heard of.


Why would you assume that the intention was to prove there are more rich republicans than democrats? If you read the data in the articles it simply proves that arguing the motivations of the ultra-rich by grabbing a few high profile names out of the air that is just plain ludicrous. The most telling is the Jon Brunner blog graphic that links contributions. The lines cross over multiple times with both conservatives and liberals amongst the ultra-rich giving to causes on the opposite side.

The only conclusion is that the ultra-rich are the ultra-rich. I would hypothesize, as pointless and untestable as it may be, that the ultra-rich benefit from a political system rife with divisiveness. They have their financial status in common with one another, which is more than they have in common with any of the rest of us, regardless of common political affiliation.

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Points: 7024 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 19:02
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

“If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.” - Winston Churchill

 
I was a Conservative at 20 and then I grew up. I've been a card carrying Liberal Democrat for the last 25 years, so I think Churchill is totally wrong on this (as he frequently was).
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 19:40
Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

“If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.” - Winston Churchill

 
I was a Conservative at 20 and then I grew up. I've been a card carrying Liberal Democrat for the last 25 years, so I think Churchill is totally wrong on this (as he frequently was).
I think any generalisation is totally wrong. I posted the quote because it was funny, not because it was right.
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 19:41
I've been a liberal ever since I took an interest in politics and nothing can change that.  You can insult me all you want.  I'm a grown up and I can take it.

I do get peeved at the spoiled little rich kids on the forums and that ain't gonna change either.


Edited by Slartibartfast - July 31 2012 at 19:43
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 19:42
All generalizations are wrong. Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 20:03
Empathy deals with helping a person in trouble if you can.  The rest is I've got mine and screw you.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 20:20
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

Empathy deals with helping a person in trouble if you can.  The rest is I've got mine and screw you.


Wait, I'm confused. What is that word you keep using. Em-pa-thy? It seems just like a bunch of crazy jumbled up letters to me.
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Points: 15784 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 21:04
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

Empathy deals with helping a person in trouble if you can.  The rest is I've got mine and screw you.


No. That's not what empathy is at all.

empathy |ˈempəθē|
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.
"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2012 at 21:07
^Nice schwa.
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