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Poll Question: Is Bjork a prog artist?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
15 [44.12%]
19 [55.88%]
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 19 2010 at 06:07
Originally posted by progkidjoel progkidjoel wrote:

Originally posted by paganinio paganinio wrote:

Bjork is experimental and progressive, but her style is definitely not symphonic prog, krautrock, RIO, or any prog sub-genre that's covered here.

Pretty much my thoughts exactly.
For me she's not prog, but basing on your thoughts shouldn't she fit into Xover?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 19 2010 at 06:09
^ X-over is prog. If you think she isn't, but has some realtion with it, possibly better idea would be prog-related?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 19 2010 at 06:11
Originally posted by snobb snobb wrote:

^ X-over is prog. If you think she isn't, but has some realtion with it, possibly better idea would be prog-related?
My comment was about any artist that's recognized "prog" but doesn't fit in any subgenre, regardless what Bjork is. It took a lot of time to have Quintorigo added because of the same reason. At the end they went into RIO/Avant.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 19 2010 at 06:15
^ Yes,I know, I voted for that addition as well

To be honest, IMO they could fit x-over as well, they are somewhere in between, but it was the time just to make any decision

Situation with Bjork was a bit different: she was on waiting list very long, but the question was if she should be presented on PA at all
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 19 2010 at 16:22

Again, you have joined only two months ago, so most surely you haven't read the multiple times I gave arguments about why she shouldn't be added in past threads.

Ok... But still, the people that I'm talking about are the people who voted for her and that used arguments for her. I don't quite have arguments because, even if listen to a lot of prog, it's been two months since I've been here and I made some errors but to me, Bjork sounds like prog.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2010 at 00:34
Originally posted by The_Jester The_Jester wrote:


Again, you have joined only two months ago, so most surely you haven't read the multiple times I gave arguments about why she shouldn't be added in past threads.

Ok... But still, the people that I'm talking about are the people who voted for her and that used arguments for her. I don't quite have arguments because, even if listen to a lot of prog, it's been two months since I've been here and I made some errors but to me, Bjork sounds like prog.

OK, I posted this three years ago in reply to another member:

Originally posted by Iván Iván wrote:

Originally posted by <span =Apple-style-span style=-webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 2px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 2px; >Passionist Passionist wrote:

I completely understand your point, but then, one thing I disagree with. THe only close to dance song I've ever heard from björk would be "There's more to life than this", which then again isn't dance. Trip Hop I'd allow, but rarely. Dance... no. Pop, yes some songs all right. But that's not a merit that closes her away, or not as I see it. 

 
    • Bjork (1977): Covers and POP
    • Gin Glo (1990): Easy songs with a Jazz edge
    • Debut (1993): Electronic Pop, Dance and Trip Hop all around the album
    • Post (1995): For God's sake even 808 State (Pioneer of the Acid House Dance genre), Howie B and Tricky, all Trip Hop musicians participated in the album.
    • Telegram (1997): Her most Challenging album at that point, but nothing more than Electronic, Dance and Alternative.
    • Homogenic (1997): More of the same, even Howie B was again with her.
    • Vespertine (2001): Her worst album at that point, even her fans qualified it as weak in comparison with the previous, more romantic and bland.
    • Medulla (2004): One of her most experimental albums, it reaches the limits of the word weird, but again no Prog at all.
    • Army of Me: Remixes and Covers (2005): It's described as Synth Pop but I haven't heard it because when I found it consisted of 20 different versions of the same song, it was enough for me.
    • Drawing Restraint 9 (2006): Again weird but in essense oit's more Pop/Alternative and Trip Hop IMO.

    So album by album I see no reason to include her and much more Trip Hop and Dance than you have heard, but I respect your opinion even when I disagree.


     
    Iván
     

This was a reply to a member called Passionist, who apparently got convinced with other replies.

Originally posted by Passionisr Passionisr wrote:

I am satisfied. I won't demand that she's added to the list, I just want to give her the credit from what she has done in this field. And personally I'll still have my opinion of her music, be it what it is.

In that I agree with him, she has merit, but merit, good or great doesn't mean Prog or Prog Related

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2010 at 11:16

Yeah well, in a sense you convinced me not to go on arguing since it's like beating a dead horse. Plus my argumentation would never get her a position here. I'd rather have a poll like this than have a meaningless online debate. So I usually give up

That being said, I do still feel the way I did in the last quote you posted, which is good enough for me. I can listen to her without her being on the forums. It's basically about what people think she deserves as an artist, and that's about it. I think she deserves to be positioned here, and apparently so do 13 more people

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2010 at 11:43
Maybe it's good to expose a hidden treat in Iván's message, despite you already got it - others may benefit from it:

Prog is short for Progressive Rock. None of the albums listed by Iván can be classified as a rock album. Even if Bjork i progressive in pop terms, she can never be considered a progressive rock artist...  based on these albums.


Edited by Angelo - November 20 2010 at 11:44
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2010 at 16:26
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Originally posted by The_Jester The_Jester wrote:


Again, you have joined only two months ago, so most surely you haven't read the multiple times I gave arguments about why she shouldn't be added in past threads.

Ok... But still, the people that I'm talking about are the people who voted for her and that used arguments for her. I don't quite have arguments because, even if listen to a lot of prog, it's been two months since I've been here and I made some errors but to me, Bjork sounds like prog.

OK, I posted this three years ago in reply to another member:

Originally posted by Iván Iván wrote:

Originally posted by <SPAN style=-webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 2px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 2px =Apple-style-span>Passionist Passionist wrote:

I completely understand your point, but then, one thing I disagree with. THe only close to dance song I've ever heard from björk would be "There's more to life than this", which then again isn't dance. Trip Hop I'd allow, but rarely. Dance... no. Pop, yes some songs all right. But that's not a merit that closes her away, or not as I see it. 

 
    • Bjork (1977): Covers and POP
    • Gin Glo (1990): Easy songs with a Jazz edge
    • Debut (1993): Electronic Pop, Dance and Trip Hop all around the album
    • Post (1995): For God's sake even 808 State (Pioneer of the Acid House Dance genre), Howie B and Tricky, all Trip Hop musicians participated in the album.
    • Telegram (1997): Her most Challenging album at that point, but nothing more than Electronic, Dance and Alternative.
    • Homogenic (1997): More of the same, even Howie B was again with her.
    • Vespertine (2001): Her worst album at that point, even her fans qualified it as weak in comparison with the previous, more romantic and bland.
    • Medulla (2004): One of her most experimental albums, it reaches the limits of the word weird, but again no Prog at all.
    • Army of Me: Remixes and Covers (2005): It's described as Synth Pop but I haven't heard it because when I found it consisted of 20 different versions of the same song, it was enough for me.
    • Drawing Restraint 9 (2006): Again weird but in essense oit's more Pop/Alternative and Trip Hop IMO.

    So album by album I see no reason to include her and much more Trip Hop and Dance than you have heard, but I respect your opinion even when I disagree.


     
    Iván
     

This was a reply to a member called Passionist, who apparently got convinced with other replies.

Originally posted by Passionisr Passionisr wrote:

I am satisfied. I won't demand that she's added to the list, I just want to give her the credit from what she has done in this field. And personally I'll still have my opinion of her music, be it what it is.

In that I agree with him, she has merit, but merit, good or great doesn't mean Prog or Prog Related

Iván
 
Whoa, you listened to all of the albums, I'm impressed Shocked 
 
I think the whole discussion focuses on one point: what is prog? Is it innovating music, which is for some people the reason to want to include Björk on the forum, or is it a musical style, where even retrogressive music can be progressive music, because it fits within the style? If you think it's the latter, Björk can't be considered prog, because she takes dance music in different forms as a basis. I do suppose it's the latter, because otherwise the logical step would have to delete whole sections of, for instance, neo prog from the site, because it the innovating factor isn't very high.
 
Bottom line: I wouldn't defend the case for Björk being progressive. I must add, though, that within the framework of dance music in its several forms, Björk really pushed some boundaries, and I wouldn't call an album like Homogenic more of the same, for instance. The move to take simple, raw rhythms and add a string octet is an innovating move to me. On top of that, Björk sounds different on each following album, and even when not all the albums don't work out as well as one would hope, I admire her enormous sense of musical adventure, even though she has her limitations.
 
Björk is no prog, but for me one of the most daring artists of the last twenty-something years nevertheless.
 
 


Edited by Moogtron III - November 20 2010 at 16:28
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2010 at 23:28
Originally posted by Moogtron III Moogtron III wrote:


Whoa, you listened to all of the albums, I'm impressed Shocked 

No not all, as you can read I never listened "Army of Me" I refuse to pay a dime or accept for free an album consisting of  20 different versions (By DJ's) of the same song, as I refused to buy Re-Works by ELP with 15 versions of Fanfare for the Common Man
 
Originally posted by Moogtron III Moogtron III wrote:

I think the whole discussion focuses on one point: what is prog? Is it innovating music, which is for some people the reason to want to include Björk on the forum, or is it a musical style, where even retrogressive music can be progressive music, because it fits within the style? If you think it's the latter, Björk can't be considered prog, because she takes dance music in different forms as a basis. I do suppose it's the latter, because otherwise the logical step would have to delete whole sections of, for instance, neo prog from the site, because it the innovating factor isn't very high.

Face it, many people want to add the ands they like, I read suggestions for Boston, The Bee Gees, Cat Stevens, ABBA, Meat Loaf, etc. I have a theory that some Progheads don't want to say they listen mainstream, and for that reason they want to turn any band they love into Prog by art of magic, as is being Prog was synonym of being good.
 
Originally posted by Moogtron III Moogtron III wrote:

Bottom line: I wouldn't defend the case for Björk being progressive. I must add, though, that within the framework of dance music in its several forms, Björk really pushed some boundaries, and I wouldn't call an album like Homogenic more of the same, for instance. The move to take simple, raw rhythms and add a string octet is an innovating move to me. On top of that, Björk sounds different on each following album, and even when not all the albums don't work out as well as one would hope, I admire her enormous sense of musical adventure, even though she has her limitations.

Yes, she pushed some boundaries, so did REM, U2 (At the beginning), even Eurythimics and of course the duet Meat Loaf & Jim Steinmann, but the weren't doing Prog, as wasn't Bjork
 
Originally posted by Moogtron III Moogtron III wrote:

Björk is no prog, but for me one of the most daring artists of the last twenty-something years nevertheless.

Fully agree.

Iván


Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 20 2010 at 23:30
            
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2010 at 13:17

Bjork is one of those artists that defies categorization from a solo perspective. Her music quickley morphed from the avant art pop style of The Sugarcubes with her solo career initially spearheading her first fully fledged album Debut into a trip hop dance/eclectic mix.” Aeroplane” and “ The Anchor Song” showing hints at her more art/crossover material to come yet this album while setting the tone for future work probably her most commercial and least art/prog sounding as her collective output.


Post another commercial success but here is where the electronic/pop/crossover feel begins to take hold.” Hyper Ballad” and “ Isobel the stand out tracks where one can see her more artistic, experimental direction.


1997's Homogenic easily her first fully fledged crossover/electronic album. Allmusic describing this release as ..”

seamless fusion of chilly strings (courtesy of the Icelandic String Octet), stuttering, abstract beats, and unique touches like accordion and glass harmonica, Homogenic alternates between dark, uncompromising songs such as the icy opener, "Hunter," and more soothing fare like the gently percolating "All Neon Like." by far her most emotionally charged album to date and lyrically mature.

2001's Vespertine helped solidify her progressive pop and art/ambient music even further with more emtionally charged music, even minimalist.. Electronic themes overlayed with harp, orchestral strings and choirs. Definitely her most mature album to date and accomplished. “ Hidden Place” “Pagan Poetry” and “ An Echo A Stain” album highlights but the whole work stands up on it's own merits.

Which brings 2004's Medulla into the mix, progressive dark pop continued..... collaborating with an array of backing vocalists, Robert Wyatt to name but one but overall easily her most abstract work to date. In fact this album makes fellow Icelandics Sigur Ros appear almost prog lite at times, granted they are in post rock/math and another genre but those overlapping genre tagging neat little ' boxes' are impossible to compartmentalize.

I am not familiar with her latest work but in summary Homogenic, Vespertine and Medulla all help qualify this artist as crossover prog. Would Electronic or Eclectic be good fits too? Perhaps but that crossing of genre territory is unavoidable. Especially when assessing prog today as opposed to a “1970 time capsule” definition tool. Someone asked does the artist know about crossover prog and how would she feel being labelled as such? She would not care and it has not stopped us in PA assessing and categorizing nearly 6000 bands to date

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 27 2010 at 11:52
We still have pop prog in here. There is artists on prog archives wich have no rock in their music at all.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 13:21
Looks like she's been added, which is good timing because after reading this thread last weekend I picked up a copy of Medulla from the used bin at CD Warehouse. It's not bad.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 14:10
Wow, after being rejected so many times... hey guys What about another thread for electric Prunes?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 14:24
I don't understand how someone can be accepted after being rejected in the past based on the same albums.
 
We really do need a do not add list on this site.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 15:36
Originally posted by Man With Hat Man With Hat wrote:

I don't understand how someone can be accepted after being rejected in the past based on the same albums.
 
We really do need a do not add list on this site.

I believe a band suggested and rejected, shouldn't be suggested again unless they release a new album.

In the worst  case a three strikes rule!

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 15:56
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

Wow, after being rejected so many times... hey guys What about another thread for electric Prunes?
Well I have only ever been aware of one evaluation for Bjork so go figure. Good news though hey!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 19:00
http://teamaltman.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Muppets-Popcorn.jpg
just add nine "j"s
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 19:35

Good news, good news...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 01 2010 at 20:56
Originally posted by The_Jester The_Jester wrote:

Good news, good news...


Yeah, it's about time we had a Muppet on this site, oh Bjork, never mind. Tongue
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