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Anthony H. 
Prog Reviewer
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 Topic: The Most Challenging Prog You've Ever Heard
Posted: June 13 2010 at 16:25 |
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By "challenging", I'm talking about progressive music that's so strange, inaccessible, experimental, complex, and/or "out there" that even an experienced proghead would need to get used to it. What are some bands/artists that could fit into this category?
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CyberDiablo
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 16:28 |
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The Early Progressive Age of Pink Floyd (1969-1972)
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Music is some kind of art.
-- Anonymous
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DisgruntledPorcupine
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 16:30 |
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That was the case with me and Gentle Giant.
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A Person
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 16:30 |
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Henry Cow's Concerts maybe, if you are not a fan of improvisation it would be hard to sit through.
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VanVanVan
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 16:31 |
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Any Avant stuff takes a long time. Fantomas, for example.
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"The meaning of life is to give life meaning."-Arjen Lucassen
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Triceratopsoil
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:00 |
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Satan Alfa Beel Atem
TD's Zeit
Art Zoyd and Univers Zero take some work to appreciate too
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beebs
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:05 |
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In the 70's, I'd have said some of the early (Lizard, Islands) King Crimson.
In this era, I'd have to go with Mars Volta. Definitely an acquired taste.
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"Nothing is at last sacred but the integrity of one's own mind" * Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Triceratopsoil
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:09 |
 beebs wrote:
In this era, I'd have to go with Mars Volta. Definitely an acquired taste.
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That's just because the singer has a horrible voice 
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UndercoverBoy
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:12 |
Early Pink Floyd? Early King Crimson? The Mars Volta? They are not exactly a walk in the park, don't get me wrong, but they are definitely not up there when it comes to the most challenging Prog. For me, the most challenging Prog listening experience in recent months was a Ruins album. It didn't make me cringe, but it is definitely a tough nut to crack. I need to get more adjusted to Koenjihyakkei before I try them again. Henry Cow's improvisations can be pretty brutal as Matt stated, as well as some of Fred Frith's and John Zorn's freak-outs.
Neal Morse's voice can also be an incredibly challening experience for me, but that's a different story. 
Edited by UndercoverBoy - June 13 2010 at 17:13
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KingCrimson250
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:40 |
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For me it depends, not only on how out there it is but also on style. I found Heresie to be a pretty enjoyable album from the first listen, but hearing samples from Sleepytime Gorilla Museum of Natural History, it seems a fair bit more challenging. Still a good one to pick up though
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Queen By-Tor
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 17:44 |
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I think there's a difference between challenging and just plain boredom. I can't get into the majority of avant music, but I love Leg End by Henry Cow. To me Gentle Giant was always a "challenging" band, because despite their melodies there was always something about their music throwing you off of being able to simply listen to the music.
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Hercules
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:26 |
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For "challenging", read complete crap in most cases.
Gentle Giant is an honorable exception.
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A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.
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Henry Plainview
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:27 |
My first impulse was to say that the free improvisation sections of Henry Cow, John Zorn, and whoever else listed here that secretly would prefer playing free jazz, are probably the most difficult, but now that I think about it I think Otomo Yoshide probably has the most challenging discography on here. Consume Red is 5 second sample looped for 45 minutes, and Cathode is high pitched droning sine waves. I can't even take the repetition of the Ground Zero stuff or the drone of Sachiko M, and I love avant-garde music.
Hercules wrote:
For "challenging", read complete crap in most cases.
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Are we going to start this nonsense again?
Captain Clutch wrote:
Satan Alfa Beel Atem
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I think the intention was to talk about albums that are on here. If we want to talk about any challenging music at all, we could talk forever about music that's more avant-garde than the albums rocky enough to be here, but that wouldn't really be relevant, would it?
I will agree, though, that Satan is possibly the most unbearable album I've ever heard.
Edited by Henry Plainview - June 13 2010 at 18:32
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:27 |
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Someone not even on PA, Chicago Underground Duo. Their album Boca Negra had me really reaching.
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presdoug
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Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:28 |
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Electric Silence by Dzyan
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Triceratopsoil
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Joined: April 03 2010
Location: Canada
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:36 |
Henry Plainview wrote:
Captain Clutch wrote:
Satan Alfa Beel Atem
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I think the intention was to talk about albums that are on here. If we want to talk about any challenging music at all, we could talk forever about music that's more avant-garde than the albums rocky enough to be here, but that wouldn't really be relevant, would it?
I will agree, though, that Satan is possibly the most unbearable album I've ever heard. |
Anthony H. wrote:
progressive music that's so strange, inaccessible,
experimental, complex, and/or "out there" that even an experienced
proghead would need to get used to it. What are some bands/artists that
could fit into this category?
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Doesn't say anything about "on PA"
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Synchestra
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:47 |
I liked bands like King Crimson and Gentle Giant pretty early on, even some weirder ones like Kayo Dot. The most challenging music, I found to get into was The Flower Kings. Though that might have more to do with their music being overly cheesy than anything (Church of Your Heart, though a good song, had me turning the CD off the first few times  )
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'Yeah, thats.. Whatever you're talking about for ya' - Zapp brannigan
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Camel666
Forum Senior Member
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 18:57 |
I don't think "inaccessible" should be seen as a synonym of "terrible", or "so bad it took me a lifetime to begin to like it". It should be about complex stuff but GREAT. I mean, from how I see it, a very "inaccessible" but VERY good band is Tool. You have complex themes, complex lyrics, complex artwork, very complex music but in the end it all falls into place and what comes out is a masterpiece. I've been listening to progressive for most of my life but it took me a full year to really get into Lateralus, and I mean to get into it DEEP. How can they have such a wide success when they write some of the most complex sh*t I've ever seen/heard, on so many levels, remains a mystery to me.
I could make an album with only farts in it and that wouldn't make it "challenging" and "inaccessible", it would just be bad. So I don't see the point in naming weird sh*t that makes no sense. Again, it's not inaccessible, it's meaningless. |
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Henry Plainview
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 19:11 |
Captain Clutch wrote:
Doesn't say anything about "on PA"
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The topic title says prog, which is progressive rock. I wasn't intending to bitch at you, I was just saying I don't think he meant for us to veer off into a discussion about Keith Rowe and Merzbow.
Camel666 wrote:
I could make an album with only farts in it and that wouldn't make it "challenging" and "inaccessible", it would just be bad. So I don't see the point in naming weird sh*t that makes no sense. Again, it's not inaccessible, it's meaningless. |
Here we go again, all the way to the examples of things that nobody does to complain about music you don't like. No, music that is too avant-garde for you is not meaningless! And by what method do you assign meaning?
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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NecronCommander
Special Collaborator
Prog Metal Team
Joined: September 17 2009
Location: Madison, WI
Status: Offline
Points: 16122
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Posted: June 13 2010 at 19:20 |
The hardest thing for me to get into are the free-form avant-jazz stuff like John Zorn, Henry Cow, and newer Kayo Dot.
Otherwise, I find it really hard to get into some of the really mellotron-drenched symphonic stuff. Just a personal taste.
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The Most Challenging Prog You've Ever Heard