The Stranglers???

Windhawk wrote: If you read carefully Ivan, I did state that I guessed they saw the band as a part of post rock PREHISTORY...

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 12 2008 at 18:32

BaldJean wrote: it is a well-known fact that the Stranglers only jumped on the punk wagon for commercial reasons. their music has nothing in common with punk at all though; you have to deliberately close your ears to believe that for one moment only.

Well... I'm afraid I'll have to disagree again. "Their music has nothing in common with punk at all" seems a pretty bold statement to me. Just listening to that "Toiler on the Sea" clip again reminded me why I've always found it difficult to get into them; precisely because of the punk element. The vocals in particular, if those aren't punk vocals (in the slightly broader sense of the word), then I really don't know... again though, this is not to argue they don't belong here; I think I'd be quite comfortable describing them as prog punk, which is by all means "good enough" for me.

splyu wrote: BaldJean wrote: it is a well-known fact that the Stranglers only jumped on the punk wagon for commercial reasons. their music has nothing in common with punk at all though; you have to deliberately close your ears to believe that for one moment only. Well... I'm afraid I'll have to disagree again. "Their music has nothing in common with punk at all" seems a pretty bold statement to me. Just listening to that "Toiler on the Sea" clip again reminded me why I've always found it difficult to get into them; precisely because of the punk element. The vocals in particular, if those aren't punk vocals (in the slightly broader sense of the word), then I really don't know... again though, this is not to argue they don't belong here; I think I'd be quite comfortable describing them as prog punk, which is by all means "good enough" for me.

huh? where is the punk element in "Toiler on the Sea"?

splyu wrote: I can only assume that your view of punk might be just as narrow as some people's view of prog (the ones who are against including them on this site, for instance).

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 12 2008 at 19:32

I opened a threat about how much preconceived notions influence our listening, and I am absolutely sure that the preconceived notion that the Stranglers are punk is influencing the listening of those people who categorize them as punk. but try this experiment:
listen to this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R11x32WoxrM
this is punk.
and now listen to "Toiler on the sea":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVgxFcARXI4
still convinced that the Stranglers are punk?




Edited by BaldJean - October 12 2008 at 19:45

BaldJean wrote: I opened a threat about how much preconceived notions influence our listening, and I am absolutely sure that the preconceived notion that the Stranglers are punk ins influencing the listening of those people who categorize them as punk. but try this experiment: listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R11x32WoxrM this is punk. and now listen to "Toiler on the sea": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVgxFcARXI4 still convinced that the Stranglers are Punk?

Jean; I can empathically say that I have no preconceived notions about The Stranglers whatsoever. I had never even heard of them before I met this guy whom I mentioned. He was a close friend for a while. (We drifted apart but that's another story.) The Stranglers were his favourite band. He shared my love for Rush, Genesis, and King Crimson. He also liked Marillion, and I got him into a bit of Mike Oldfield as well. Also, just like me, he liked a wide variety of music outside of prog, too. But he was a punk at heart, and it made a ton of sense to me that The Stranglers would be the one band for him. The punks that were also prog. That was him. Hope this explains my point of view a bit. Maybe I'm biased by how I view this guy, but I'm certainly not biased by how the general public views The Stranglers, because I'm completely ignorant of that.

splyu wrote: Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Narrow....Narrow Minded....Close Minded?   It always starts like this.   Iván Pardon me, but you made that association chain.

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: BaldJean wrote: I opened a threat about how much preconceived notions influence our listening, and I am absolutely sure that the preconceived notion that the Stranglers are punk is influencing the listening of those people who categorize them as punk. but try this experiment: listen to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R11x32WoxrM this is punk. and now listen to "Toiler on the sea": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVgxFcARXI4 still convinced that the Stranglers are punk?   It has reinforced my opinion, not all Punk has to sound like the Dead Kennedys or The Sex Pistols, this song sounds clearly New Wave like OMD or Mecano in Spain.   And New Wave is a Punk related genre.   Iván   BTW Spylu and Dean, don't worry aboouthe Narrow..... it's just preventive, probably not the original author, but we know how this ends always

you are a helpless case in my opinion, Ivan. there are hardly any punk elements at all in the Stranglers video but lots of prog elements. it is honestly beyond me how you can stick to your opinion
what surprises me most though is that you actually say that punks say the Stranglers are punks. I always thought we don't give much about the opinion of punks in the archives...


Edited by BaldJean - October 12 2008 at 20:08

BaldJean wrote:   you are a helpless case in my opinion, Ivan. there are hardly any punk elements at all in the Stranglers video but lots of prog elements. it is honestly beyond me how you can stick to your opinion

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 12 2008 at 20:10

BaldJean wrote: repetitive keyboards? Ivan, he plays a completely separate voice on his keyboards! what have you been listening to?

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 12 2008 at 20:19