The Stranglers???

Certif1ed wrote: Dean wrote: The Stranglers were rejected for Prog Related earlier in the year and there isn't another sub in which they could be seriously placed. Although I voted in favour of addition, I can accept and understand the reasons for exclusion.   Which are?

Certif1ed wrote: Dean wrote: Our "hundreds of other Prog bands" fit into non-Classic Prog subs, all be it as octagonal pegs in round holes in some cases, but when looked at in relation to other bands in that sub do make some kind of sense.     We'll have to agree to disagree.   Besides, sub/genrising Prog Rock is a nonsense, IMO. It's simply a way to try to fit all manner of shaped pegs into moving holes. Steely Dan is possibly the worst crowbar attempt I've yet heard.   Dean wrote: Then I ask, where in the pantheon of Prog would they fit? Prog Ears has them as Post Rock (!?!!) - an utter misfitt if I ever saw one.     Here and Now are both rooted in the punk scene and music, so the precedent is already set. I doubt very much that H&N set out to write Progressive Rock. At least one of their albums is mainly a kind of punk reggae.   Never mind the number of chords, that wasn't what I was getting at; The chord progressions swing from rock to blues to jazz-influenced to hints of Classical.   The Doors connection in their early music is easy to hear, the instrumentation is not that of regular New Wave bands, which tended to go for the two-fingered approach to keyboards and single-note bass lines.   The music is related to Prog, ergo Prog-related. Simple.

I concur, it's plain and simple, there's no mystery, no intrigue.

Way too convoluted here, Prog-related, case closed!

Dick Heath wrote: And I guaranteed if you asked the band for their opinion, they would wet themselves laughing. When the Stranglers  formed they were the antithesis of prog. Why not Police who cames out of the UK punk period- at least you has two ex-prog musicians and a bassist/vocalist who played jazzrock and fan of Jack Bruce.

So what? VdGG laughed about the prog sticker too. It is not the intention with which you play that counts, it is the resulting music.
The Police, on the other hand, never made any music that could be recognized as prog, although all three members played with artists that are prog. Copeland played with Curved Air, Summers with Fripp, and Sting with Eberhard Schoener (who is long overdue to be added to the archives). But the resulting music is not prog at all.
But that's not the case with the Stranglers. I concur with Jean who challenged you to make a blind test and play, for example,  "Black and White" to someone who does not know the Stranglers without telling him or her what it is.


Edited by BaldFriede - October 04 2008 at 14:39

BaldFriede wrote: Dick Heath wrote: And I guaranteed if you asked the band for their opinion, they would wet themselves laughing. When the Stranglers  formed they were the antithesis of prog. Why not Police who cames out of the UK punk period- at least you has two ex-prog musicians and a bassist/vocalist who played jazzrock and fan of Jack Bruce. So what? VdGG laughed about the prog sticker too. It is not the intention with which you play that counts, it is the resulting music. The Police, on the other hand, never made any music that could be recognized as prog, although all three members played with artists that are prog. Copeland played with Curved Air, Summers with Fripp, and Sting with Eberhard Schoener (who is long overdue to be added to the archives). But the resulting music is not prog at all. But that's not the case with the Stranglers. I concur with Jean who challenged you to make a blind test and play, for example,  "Black and White" to someone who does not know the Stranglers without telling him or her what it is.

I'm not sure that test would work if you played them Shut Up or TITS (from the expanded version)!

Dick Heath wrote: And I guaranteed if you asked the band for their opinion, they would wet themselves laughing. When the Stranglers  formed they were the antithesis of prog. Why not Police who cames out of the UK punk period- at least you has two ex-prog musicians and a bassist/vocalist who played jazzrock and fan of Jack Bruce.

I hear elements of of Prog, Punk, and New Wave. They take from the past and yet manage to predict the future!

The way they put all the sounds and styles together does sound like interesting modern prog at times, hence, prog related terminology being utilized as the descriptor.

As mentioned by someone earlier I do not believe the bonus tracks in the expanded version should have anything to with this debate but instead stick to the original albums.

Someone had mentioned the "Police" which was very inappropriate since they do not have a shred of the creativity of the Stranglers or the prog for that matter and should never find a home here.

can't understand how or where anyone hears "punk" in the music of the Stranglers. this is not 3-chords music at all

Jon The Impaler wrote: Well  . Its been a time since I've been on here , but I have to say "no " . The Stranglers are my all time favourite band , and they are still going for anyone that interested - on tour in October , released their 16th studio album a couple of years ago , and have just released ANOTHER greatest hits album (4240 its called ). Supposedly the best and definitive greatest hits one , but thats what they've said about the last 8 greatest hits albums , and to be honest the greatest hits haven't changed much since 1990 - just the addition of "Big Thing Coming " in 2004 I think . Someone mentioned that they didn't sound like typical punk - true - they had keyboards which most punk bands didn't . Apparently Dave Greenfield  was quite unaware of Doors sounds in the early days , he was just similar in style to the Doors keyboard player , hence  the comparrisons . I said  no to the band being included as I don't really think they would be sounding anything like the majority of bands on this forum . The eraly years they weer very raw  and doing things that many of the early punk bands copied , they were around 2 years before punk really started - similar to The Vibrators , they got tagged in with a movement ( punk ) which had similar styles , though The Stranglers were far advanced in musicianship. The Clash started out as a punk band but progressed to other styles - I wouldn't call them prog though .I didn't like the direction The Clash took , but thats just personal taste .

there are a lot of very raw bands in the archives. just listen to High Tide - you can hardly get any rawer than that. it is also not important at all to sound like the majority of the bands in here. where the heck do for example bands like VdGG, Magma or Gong sound like the majority of bands ? the Stranglers perfectly fit the bill to be added from an analytical point of view. that they are being rejected by most is only due to their "punk" image. which is one of the reasons I opened my thread about preconceived notions. anyone who listens to the Stranglers without those preconceived notions can only come to one conclusion: that they fully belong into the archives


Edited by BaldJean - October 12 2008 at 04:02

Why don't we include  Hootie And The Blowfish as well. Can't believe this has gone three pages.

BaldFriede wrote: Vibrationbaby wrote: Why don't we include  Hootie And The Blowfish as well. Can't believe this has gone three pages. I can't believe it either, but for different reasons. For me the Stranglers always were clearly prog. There are other bands which are included in the archives that I would NOT have included, by the way. But I won't go into that.

BaldFriede - which Stranglers albums do you think are most 'progressive'. I must admit to have said 'no' to the suggestion that they are Prog, that being largely based on my early experiences of them. For example, Stranglers means to me: Peaches, No More Heroes, Golden Brown (bought the single). Whilst good songs, none of them would strike me as being progressive in nature.

Not really listened to their later albums, thought I went on to a site that had some clips of their songs, and whilst I noticed a slight similarity to the Doors in their keyboard style on some of the songs I heard, they just seemed like short, slightly dark poppy tracks to me.

I guess people hear different things in different bands. At the moment, I'd say no, but am open to persuasion. For example, early Talk Tak was in no way Prog. If I had never heard their later stuff, I'd have dismissed out of hand the suggestion that they be included here. Maybe that's similar to The Stranglers, and that in the albums I've missed, they have changed direction.................