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The Doctor 
Special Collaborator
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Joined: June 23 2005
Location: The Tardis
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Points: 8543
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 Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:26 |
I am having a religious experience right now I think. It's a vision, a powerful vision of an admin swooping down on his flaming chariot and smiting this thread. 
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I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Padraic
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Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:25 |
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Guys, I hate to interject and I know you're going full blast about religion here, but this thread is called the "Political Discussion" thread - might want to wrap it up and move on to a political topic. I do want to give a "well done" to all because it seems that this thread has remained fairly civil in its tone.
Edit: Topic creator beat me to it.
Edited by NaturalScience - August 07 2007 at 15:25
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:24 |
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Religion =/= Politics
Choose your words carefully.
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Proletariat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 30 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1882
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:22 |
 Equality 7-2521 wrote:
The T wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
^
A means to what end? |
To live better, to live more happily, to make the world a better place....go ask Christ...go read His words....
Money is a means to achieve certain goals... but we've turned it into a religion... and now, mixed with RELIGION, (as the right is doing), well, there's a double-fanatism going on that only gets further and further away from what Christ told us.... |
If you're doing nothing to make the world a better place you're not Catholic no matter what you say to yourself. Making the world a better place is included in being Catholic.
I'm sorry I disagree. Religion is the ultimate end. To say it is a means is to cheapen it. |
just wondering, would you say that any religion is an ultamate end or that just yours is?
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who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob
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Proletariat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 30 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1882
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:20 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Proletariat wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Proletariat:
I never said you.
And I don't like those who see Christian as a sort of group of hypocrits and exploiters. I don't like those who will make a blanket statement like that and ignore the sacrifices of countless Catholics and Christians throughout history. Also, just because only Mother Theresa captured the world's attention as she did does not mean she is the only 'Mother Theresa' out there. |
So now as a christian you need to prove ghandi wrong, go out and be more like christ, dont argue that there are some who are like christ, be like him yourself |
Don't judge as if you know what I do. I'm not a Mother Theresa nor do I ever think I will have the abilities to be, but I do what I can. There's actions behind what I preach; they may not be monumentous but as Mother Theresa herself said "It is not the magnitude of our actions but the amount of love that is put into them that matters" |
I'm not attacking you, I'm speaking to christians in general
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who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:20 |
The T wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
^
A means to what end? |
To live better, to live more happily, to make the world a better place....go ask Christ...go read His words....
Money is a means to achieve certain goals... but we've turned it into a religion... and now, mixed with RELIGION, (as the right is doing), well, there's a double-fanatism going on that only gets further and further away from what Christ told us.... |
If you're doing nothing to make the world a better place you're not Catholic no matter what you say to yourself. Making the world a better place is included in being Catholic.
I'm sorry I disagree. Religion is the ultimate end. To say it is a means is to cheapen it.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:17 |
StyLaZyn wrote:
EQ,
Just so you know, I am very much an anti-Catholic due to an abused brother who is essentially crazy now because his own parents wouldn't believe he was abused "because their church and priests would never do that to their son especially after all their praying to God and sacrifices they made". Oh, it's ugly. I have built up much anti-organized religion sentiment. And in this stepping away from my faith, I have really opened my eyes to how things really are. I have seen that religion does in fact move people to do things they wouldn't normally do. But their methods are questionable. |
There are no doubt charlatans of the faith that do unspeakable evils. But don't forget there are atheists who do the same. Don't let the actions of some individuals rot the whole group to you.
Many prayers to your brother though.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The T
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:14 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
^
A means to what end? |
To live better, to live more happily, to make the world a better place....go ask Christ...go read His words....
Money is a means to achieve certain goals... but we've turned it into a religion... and now, mixed with RELIGION, (as the right is doing), well, there's a double-fanatism going on that only gets further and further away from what Christ told us....
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:14 |
Proletariat wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Proletariat:
I never said you.
And I don't like those who see Christian as a sort of group of hypocrits and exploiters. I don't like those who will make a blanket statement like that and ignore the sacrifices of countless Catholics and Christians throughout history. Also, just because only Mother Theresa captured the world's attention as she did does not mean she is the only 'Mother Theresa' out there. |
So now as a christian you need to prove ghandi wrong, go out and be more like christ, dont argue that there are some who are like christ, be like him yourself |
Don't judge as if you know what I do. I'm not a Mother Theresa nor do I ever think I will have the abilities to be, but I do what I can. There's actions behind what I preach; they may not be monumentous but as Mother Theresa herself said "It is not the magnitude of our actions but the amount of love that is put into them that matters"
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Proletariat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 30 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1882
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:10 |
Religion is cheaper than opium
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who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 22 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4079
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:10 |
Proletariat wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Proletariat:
I never said you.
And I don't like those who see Christian as a sort of group of hypocrits and exploiters. I don't like those who will make a blanket statement like that and ignore the sacrifices of countless Catholics and Christians throughout history. Also, just because only Mother Theresa captured the world's attention as she did does not mean she is the only 'Mother Theresa' out there. |
So now as a christian you need to prove ghandi wrong, go out and be more like christ, dont argue that there are some who are like christ, be like him yourself |
Theocentricity at it's finest. Most faiths are guilty of it.
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 22 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4079
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:08 |
EQ,
Just so you know, I am very much an anti-Catholic due to an abused brother who is essentially crazy now because his own parents wouldn't believe he was abused "because their church and priests would never do that to their son especially after all their praying to God and sacrifices they made". Oh, it's ugly. I have built up much anti-organized religion sentiment. And in this stepping away from my faith, I have really opened my eyes to how things really are. I have seen that religion does in fact move people to do things they wouldn't normally do. But their methods are questionable.
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Proletariat
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 30 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1882
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:07 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Proletariat:
I never said you.
And I don't like those who see Christian as a sort of group of hypocrits and exploiters. I don't like those who will make a blanket statement like that and ignore the sacrifices of countless Catholics and Christians throughout history. Also, just because only Mother Theresa captured the world's attention as she did does not mean she is the only 'Mother Theresa' out there. |
So now as a christian you need to prove ghandi wrong, go out and be more like christ, dont argue that there are some who are like christ, be like him yourself
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who hiccuped endlessly trying to giggle but wound up with a sob
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:07 |
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The T
Special Collaborator
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Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:03 |
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Just like money, religion should be a MEANS, not an END in itself...
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:02 |
StyLaZyn wrote:
The T wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
To say that is to spit on the graves of people like Mother Theresa who did as near to the work of Christ that any human could do. |
That's true... but you insist on seeing rare-great-exceptions as rules... that's the hole in the logic.... there was only ONE Mother Teresa... |
Getting off politics with this thread. But anyway I often wonder if without religion she would do the same. It takes a strong person to have such devotion, but guilt can move a person to do things too. Growing up Catholic, I know the power of needing to "sacrifice". |
She no doubt would have done the same to some degree. An amount of compassion and sympathy like that does not come from faith alone. However, would she have even be as aware of the plight or had the conviction to stick through till the end in the degree she did without religion, I don't know.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The T
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 15:01 |
StyLaZyn wrote:
The T wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
To say that is to spit on the graves of people like Mother Theresa who did as near to the work of Christ that any human could do. |
That's true... but you insist on seeing rare-great-exceptions as rules... that's the hole in the logic.... there was only ONE Mother Teresa... |
Getting off politics with this thread. But anyway I often wonder if without religion she would do the same. It takes a strong person to have such devotion, but guilt can move a person to do things too. Growing up Catholic, I know the power of needing to "sacrifice". |
this is a case where I would say: it doesn't matter. It may have been that without religion she wouldn't had done so much for the poor, but if that's the case, thank God there was such a stronng religion in her heart.... Religion can work wonders in some people.... others just let their religion do the work....
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 14:59 |
Proletariat:
I never said you.
And I don't like those who see Christian as a sort of group of hypocrits and exploiters. I don't like those who will make a blanket statement like that and ignore the sacrifices of countless Catholics and Christians throughout history. Also, just because only Mother Theresa captured the world's attention as she did does not mean she is the only 'Mother Theresa' out there.
Edited by Equality 7-2521 - August 07 2007 at 15:00
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The Doctor
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: June 23 2005
Location: The Tardis
Status: Offline
Points: 8543
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 14:58 |
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To quote Homer Simpson, I would just like to say "Praise Jebus".
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I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 22 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4079
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Posted: August 07 2007 at 14:56 |
The T wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
To say that is to spit on the graves of people like Mother Theresa who did as near to the work of Christ that any human could do. |
That's true... but you insist on seeing rare-great-exceptions as rules... that's the hole in the logic.... there was only ONE Mother Teresa... |
Getting off politics with this thread. But anyway I often wonder if without religion she would do the same. It takes a strong person to have such devotion, but guilt can move a person to do things too. Growing up Catholic, I know the power of needing to "sacrifice".
Edited by StyLaZyn - August 07 2007 at 14:57
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