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Topic ClosedCoheed And Cambria: The real reasons !!!
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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 19 2007 at 12:16
Originally posted by Shwang_Shwinga Shwang_Shwinga wrote:

Tony, it'll take more than a screenshot to convince me that Coheed shouldn't be in the Archives. Why do you think they are not progressive musicians?

The screenshot was because you seemed to suggest we were making arbitary decisions based on misconceptions or negative preconceptions....I was just demonstrating that you were wrong to suggest that.

You are convinced C&C are a Prog band. Fine. Enjoy them whatever they are.
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Points: 141 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 21 2007 at 09:07
I would definitely second "the Crowing."  It's one of my favorite of theirs.  Also, the title track from "IKSoSE."  I think the first 3 tracks in order from IV are a great testiment to their progressive diversity, although you couldn't really include them all.  If you think about it, Pink Floyd's The Wall is really just an album composed of regular music that is progressive only due to it's breadth of moods, theatrics, and storyline--something that is impossible to miss with C&C.
 
I actually think this is bigger than Coheed and Cambria itself.  I think there is more at play than simply analyzing elements of music.  I really agree that PT's Deadwing is less progressive than either of C&C's latter albums.  The main difference seems to be that PT is cool, more obscure, and has no other (embarassing-to-some) genre to easliy attach itself to.  C&C can be superficially categorized by a style/genre which seems to be ire of some (EMO or whatever).
 
While I realize this is sometimes a grey area, I think at least a generic set of standards could be developed as a case against bands.  If not, I find it largely unfair that the Wall, Deadwing, latter Genesis, a lot of latter day Rush, and countless other offerings that have strayed from any strict sense of progressive rock are included here.  The street should run both ways--if we're going to be stringent, then let's be stringent.
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Heptade View Drop Down
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Points: 427 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 10:26
Whoah....just found this thread...you mean they're not here? That's kind of silly, isn't it? I mean, Mars Volta? Tool? Those bands might be LESS proggy than C&C!
The world keeps spinning, people keep sinning
And all the rest is just bullsh*t
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Points: 102 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 13:56

Heptade, please tell me that was sarcasm...Tool & TMV are progger than many bands on here. Coheed are undoubtably prog, but I wouldn't say to the extent they are.

Though I'm glad to hear someone else is surprised that Co&Ca aren't present here Wink
 
-SS
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:07
Well, I've finally heard some music from this band. I have IN KEEPING SECRETS OF PLANET EARTH... I don't know if the rest of their output is like this or proggier, but from this album only, I have to agree with the voices that ask for their exclusion, or better, that oppose their inclusion. They have prog elements here and there for sure, but most 80% of the album is just regular rock, at times very good and at times bordering in annoying (there are moments when it sounds like teenager-MTV-rock)... the moments of progressivenes are few and far between, and the playing is just average, so virtuosism is not the argument to use for their inclusion. In terms of structures, most of the songs are completely normal; in terms of instrumentation, they use the regular line-up, and only from time to time they add keyboards... The singer is a clone from the one in The Mars Volta but without the power and the music without the progressiveness. there are good moments and the music in general isn't bad, but IS NOT PROG. Not every good thing in the world is prog, after all. But please tell me if IV or any other release is proggier than this album, maybe I'm wrong.

Edited by The T - June 23 2007 at 20:08
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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:09
It is definitely Prog-Related....no brainer...Smile
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:10
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

It is definitely Prog-Related....no brainer...Smile
 
Prog-related at THE VERY MOST.....
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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:18


They're as Prog-Related as that bunch of poseurs on your T Shirt, T Wink
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Points: 12288 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:25
With sun-glasses inside the house.... he must be Teo, the T.
Guigo

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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 20:34
AngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngryAngry
 
Not angry because of the sunglasses part but because of the attack on that magnificent shirt!! Angry
 
Tongue
 
Anyway, even in this thread DT cannot be spared.... Guess it's normal... When you're at the zenith, everybody looks you with envy...
 
WinkTongueTongue
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Shwang_Shwinga View Drop Down
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Points: 102 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 23 2007 at 23:35
IV is proggier...but I'm sad you didn't enjoy the music like I did, T. You're right, they're not virtuosos. Spiral Architect are, but Co&Ca certainly are better.
 
I can deal with Prog Related, Coheed aren't really metal and they aren't pretentious enough to be art rock.
 
And that shirt is magnificent Wink
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 24 2007 at 12:17
Originally posted by Shwang_Shwinga Shwang_Shwinga wrote:

IV is proggier...but I'm sad you didn't enjoy the music like I did, T. You're right, they're not virtuosos. Spiral Architect are, but Co&Ca certainly are better.
 
I can deal with Prog Related, Coheed aren't really metal and they aren't pretentious enough to be art rock.
 
And that shirt is magnificent Wink
 
Oh I really agree on the part I highlighted. And I enjoyed the music, not as much as I would like mostly because of a couple of tracks that really reminded me of MTV, but the rest was good.
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Points: 4079 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 09:14
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:



They're as Prog-Related as that bunch of poseurs on your T Shirt, T Wink
 
 
LMFAO!!!!!
 
OK....I'll compose myself now.....no wait!
 
 
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jmcdaniel_ee View Drop Down
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Points: 141 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 11:15
Originally posted by Shwang_Shwinga Shwang_Shwinga wrote:

...Coheed aren't really metal and they aren't pretentious enough to be art rock.
I don't know...I saw them last year play "The Final Cut" and Cladio played an over-indulgent, way too long solo at the end, and even played guitar behind his back or over his head, or while shaving or something.  I was pretty sick that they ended the show like that.Ermm
 
My main point is their thematics, storyline, character perspectives, etc.  I think that stuff's really cheesy in most circumstances, but sometimes that's mainly what separates some music into prog territory (i.e. The Wall).


Edited by jmcdaniel_ee - June 25 2007 at 11:16
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 12:34
Originally posted by StyLaZyn StyLaZyn wrote:

 
 
LMFAO!!!!!
 
OK....I'll compose myself now.....no wait!
 
 
 
Angry
 
I hope it's not about the shirt...
 
Tongue
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StyLaZyn View Drop Down
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Points: 4079 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2007 at 12:43
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by StyLaZyn StyLaZyn wrote:

 
 
LMFAO!!!!!
 
OK....I'll compose myself now.....no wait!
 
 
 
Angry
 
I hope it's not about the shirt...
 
Tongue
 
No, it's about somebody actually wearing it in public.  Would you like me to get you my Warrant t-shirt out of storage for you.  LOL  ("She's my cherry pie!")
 
OK, just having a little fun. Wink
 
I don't know why, but DT has become my favorite band to call cheese rock. Or maybe Cheese Prog.  BTW, C&C could also be called that. Maybe it's time for a new genre. But then again, many popular Prog bands have have big time cheese moments. But some continue to have them. Sleepy
 
Alright, I need to stop. I'm killing myself here.
 
 
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Points: 3491 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2007 at 20:14
To be or not to be (prog) thats the question.. I have read about this band in music magazines and on the internet and everyone say they are ultra prog even the band them self.. then i try look em up here and this topic is what i found, i dont know what to belive now. Shocked
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Dean View Drop Down
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2007 at 20:40
I am a big fan of C & C, (much to my daughter's horror as she dislikes all things even remotely emo), and I can readily see the influence of Prog on their music, but unfortunately, not in their music - hence for me they are only Prog Related. Perhaps one day they will grasp the nettle, and that will be a very fine day indeed.
What?
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Shwang_Shwinga View Drop Down
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Points: 102 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 30 2007 at 20:58
From what I've heard, it's gonna be prog related...I just can't say when. But hey, I'm no authority here. The fact that they're being considered contents me enough, as long as it gets done I am pleased.
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Points: 15585 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2007 at 03:35
Does anyone wish to do the work of adding them if they are approved? If so, I will take this to the Admin team for a final decision.
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