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Posted: April 26 2005 at 08:05 |
i think its threads like this that make the awareness of you people as snobs a self-perpetuating phenomena....and jeremy im sorry but if you bothered to listen to the love below side of the last outkast album im sure yud be very surprised at how progressive and anti-industry it is...i consider that a prog album ...maybe the best one of the year it came ou tjust because it seems to be soemething both innovative and seminal(introducing an entire genre to experimentation)
Edited by hopelevre
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mirco
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 08:15 |
A big difference between proggers and poppers is that we can listen to music made thirty years ago and still enjoy it, but pop music has expiration date. Every season a new bunch of tunes is release and substitutes at the stores shelves the "old" ones, which are rapidly forgotten. How many classic pop songs are still out there, and cherished by pop fans? Very few. We proggers, on the other hand, believe that older is better...
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Please forgive me for my crappy english!
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Blacksword
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Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
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Points: 16130
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 08:20 |
mirco wrote:
A big difference between proggers and poppers is that we can listen to music made thirty years ago and still enjoy it, but pop music has expiration date. Every season a new bunch of tunes is release and substitutes at the stores shelves the "old" ones, which are rapidly forgotten. How many classic pop songs are still out there, and cherished by pop fans? Very few. We proggers, on the other hand, believe that older is better... |
Not sure about that. Kids still know ABBA songs, 'classic' disco tunes live through re-mixes and re-releases and Elvis 'f***ing' Presley seems to always have some rubbish in the charts. The retro thing is BIG business...just not for prog. Sadly.
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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John Gargo
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 08:38 |
It's because the music that we listen to is almost aggressively anti-single. With pop, the emphasis is on selling the "single," and therefore people that listen to it are contempt to simply listen to the radio or download a song or too... A lot of people often ask me why I bother to buy so many albums, to which I respond back "Well, why don't you buy albums?" Their response is almost always "because there are only one or two good songs on albums." That's simply the way their genre functions... two or three hit singles, and the rest of the album is almost void of entertainment for even those who call themselves rabid fans. It's also no surprise they feel that way, since the radio only plays the hit singles... when was the last time you heard a Britney Spears song on the radio that wasn't commercially released?
Prog, on the other hand, is more album-centered, and that also goes for other album oriented rock (not only that particular genre, but also hard rock, metal, psychedelic, and other uncommercial music like classical, jazz and blues). Because of this, the listener is forced to purchase albums instead of singles, and this in turn eventually leads to the listener being a completionist, because we're not only satsfied with one or two cuts on an album but usually almost all of them, and therefore we have more incentive to seek out other albums from the same artists.
The more that we become experts on our particular bands or subgenres, the more we become somewhat arrogant to our knowledge of the genre... this leads to snobbery.
Those are my thoughts anyway...
Edited by John Gargo
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mirco
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Location: Venezuela
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 08:44 |
Blacksword wrote:
mirco wrote:
A big difference between proggers and poppers is that we can listen to music made thirty years ago and still enjoy it, but pop music has expiration date. Every season a new bunch of tunes is release and substitutes at the stores shelves the "old" ones, which are rapidly forgotten. How many classic pop songs are still out there, and cherished by pop fans? Very few. We proggers, on the other hand, believe that older is better... |
Not sure about that. Kids still know ABBA songs, 'classic' disco tunes live through re-mixes and re-releases and Elvis 'f***ing' Presley seems to always have some rubbish in the charts. The retro thing is BIG business...just not for prog. Sadly. |
You are naming some exceptions to the rule, in general pop music became rotten very quickly. But of course exist an industry of retro, there is some stock to resell... Another characteristic of pop is the ephimeress of the artists: very few of them survives their first records.
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Please forgive me for my crappy english!
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Jim Prog Wizard
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Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 11:19 |
I agree with the assertion that prog is very much an album-orientated type of music. The vast majority of prog albums I own I can listen to all the way through without having to skip anything.
The point is IMO that prog just makes so much more of music, uses all the potential of the musical canvas, if you will. While listening to Neal Morse earlier today, I was struck by just HOW MUCH was going on in his music, not necessarily at the same time, but throughout the course of an album. Popular music is based very much on a simple chord progression and melody. It almost seems a waste to listen to something like that when you could listen to something that pushes music to it's limits, and uses many interesting melodies and chords.
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"Progressive Rock is the ultimate form of music" (Mikael Akerfeldt, 2003)
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King of Loss
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Joined: April 21 2005
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Points: 16474
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 17:17 |
Why are commercial music listeners such obtuse morons?
Exactly! Why would you ever call hip hop and emo music?
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AngelRat
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Location: Netherlands
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Points: 1014
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 17:40 |
I think proggers have a longer attention span than poppers. We can listen to 30 minute epics with lots of solos while poppers like 3 minute songs with the chorus being repeated over and over again. So we pay more attention at things going on within the music and listen closely at every detail. Does that make us superior or are we bored?
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Spanky
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Joined: April 07 2004
Location: United States
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Points: 389
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 17:41 |
This is a bad poll. I was able to vote 40 times on it; therefore, it must be bad.
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Coalinga knows how to party.
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Peter
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 17:43 |
That is sometimes true (some of the otherwise fine folks here seem to be rather narrow in their tastes and views) but it's rather a broad generalization, no? We are typically serious, dedicated music fans, but that does not necessarily mean that we like only "serious" music. I'm sure that serious fans of genres like classical, folk, traditional, (pure) country, jazz, bluegrass, early music, metal, etc., can be quite knowledgable/fanatic about their loves too.
I was a "progsnob" in my teens, but my tastes are quite diverse now.
I like music to have heart, or at least intelligence, and those traits are by no means exclusive to prog.
Edited by Peter
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy.
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James Lee
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 17:59 |
Jeremy Spade wrote:
It is apparent from the articulate and educated posts circulating on this site, that we admirers of progressive rock are in every way more endowed intellectually. Rap and RnB artists alike have atrocious grammar skills, and inspire the same traits in their fans. Just consider some of these embarrassing errors: |
Favorite rythm section
the best porg bands ever
and that's just from "active topics"
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:05 |
James Lee wrote:
Jeremy Spade wrote:
It is apparent from the articulate and educated posts circulating on this site, that we admirers of progressive rock are in every way more endowed intellectually. Rap and RnB artists alike have atrocious grammar skills, and inspire the same traits in their fans. Just consider some of these embarrassing errors: |
Favorite rythm section
the best porg bands ever
and that's just from "active topics"
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James can you change that naughty entry at the bottom of your posts..it's really un-called for & who ever told you that whant's stringing up
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Yams
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 16 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 198
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:07 |
I'm enjoying the responses to this
thread. Keep them coming.
I
don't play an instrument, but I don't think that has impeded my
ability to enjoy Prog. What really sets us apart from the mainstream
is our desire to ask questions; our desire to explore; and our desire
for perfection in music. Progressive Rock offers that. I'm not afraid
to ask questions. I always want to try to understand something that
is foreign to me in music. That's why I've joined these forums.
The
grammar argument doesn't really hold up. Many albums are
grammatically incorrect. The ConstruKction of Light?
I'm
not afraid of showing off my musical tastes to those who would say
that it's overblown and pompous. I actually relish in mentioning the
music I enjoy, and then getting a snide remark by those individuals.
It bestows a sense of uniqueness knowing that I'm part of a handful
of people who listen to music not part of the norm.
I agree
that Prog is album oriented. The way I see, us Proggers get more bang
for our buck. Not only do we have ten plus minute tracks, but we also
have concept and double albums to choose from. Pop gives you no more
than four minute songs with a few (and that's stretching it) hit
singles on each album. Maybe ten minutes of worthwhile music on each
album to those who listen to it.
It's difficult for me to accept the
argument that Pop music is just a much a valid form of music as
Progressive Rock is. Call me close minded, but I cannot go back to
MTV.
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James Lee
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:07 |
But I'm attached to it now. Oh, very well...in the name of bygones being bygones...
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:10 |
James Lee wrote:
But I'm attached to it now. Oh, very well...in the name of bygones being bygones... |
Just replace t**ser with t**t.that'll do
Edited by Karnevil9
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:11 |
Choice #3 all the way!!! Most kids listen to rap. I'll start there. If kids aren't listening to rap, they are probably listening to musicianship-simpletons like punk and pop. Finally, there are the choice-few who dig heavy metal which is not music (art) but STATICKY BUZZING!!)
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Fantômas
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Joined: April 15 2005
Location: Brazil
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Points: 1859
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 18:51 |
Well, prog fans usually thinks their tastes is better than anyone's.
This is simply pathetic. There's nothing in the music that tells me
that Genesis is better than Sex Pistols, you wanna know why? Because
there are no parameters to point who is the best (there are to point
who's more technical, but not who's the best). In fact, just one
exists: Musical preferences. And this is totally subjective, by all
means, you can't say that progressive is musically superior. It's an
arrogant thinking. If the progressive were superior, the fans wouldn't
think this way.
Oh, I was almost forgetting: To say that progressive is music and punk
no is not a question of taste. It's stupid. You really can do better
than this, boys.
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And above all, is punk
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mirco
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2005
Location: Venezuela
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Points: 819
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 19:08 |
Fantômas wrote:
Well, prog fans usually thinks their tastes is better than anyone's. |
It seems to me that any person thinks that his taste is the best.
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Please forgive me for my crappy english!
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Fantômas
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 15 2005
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 1859
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 19:15 |
mirco wrote:
Fantômas wrote:
Well, prog fans usually thinks their tastes is better than anyone's. |
It seems to me that any person thinks that his taste is the best. |
Wrong, I think. I can say "Sex Pistols is better than Genesis", that's
a question of preference. But I can't say "Genesis is better than
Sex Pistols. Dude, you must clean your ears! God, your tastes are
awful!". Of course, everybody thinks that like the best stuff,
otherwise they would not listen to it!
Edited by Fantômas
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And above all, is punk
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mirco
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2005
Location: Venezuela
Status: Offline
Points: 819
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Posted: April 26 2005 at 19:25 |
Fantômas wrote:
Of course, everybody thinks that like the best stuff, otherwise they would not listen to it!
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That's exactily what I mean, my taste is better than yours... for me and only for me!
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Please forgive me for my crappy english!
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