Prog's Most Controversial Lyricist

He'd more or less belong the same place on the spectrum as Frank Zappa, then.

questionsneverknown wrote: Another way to approach the problem with Neil Peart's lyrics is to think about one of the basic "rules" that pop up in creative writing classes: show don't tell (or, as Henry James put it, "Dramatize! Dramatize!").  I don't think the issue is with the content of the lyrics, but with how he expresses the ideas.  Rather than create a dramatic situation in which ideas are brought to life, in the clunkiest moments the lines are presented all too literally, reading like cod philosophy notes.  ("Free Will" is the ultimate example of this; I have a friend who is a professor of philosophy who just cringes and cringes at the thought of those lyrics.)  But he has been far less guilty of this kind of thing on the two most recent albums. At the end of the day, I know though that hearing Neil's words the first time when I was in high school was revelatory.  If most of what you had heard before were the words found in radio ballads or AC/DC, then these lyrics were really something special.  Still, it is still pretty hard to forgive "Trees" (even if I do still sing along).

Hmm, while one may or may not like The Trees it is presented as an allegory. It is a 'show don't tell' (also a Rush song) and as dramatic and pictorial as these lyrics are they do fit this 'show don't tell' criteria.  Of course this still does not mean one would like it.

I alwasy took from Neil's lyrics the recognition of the individual as distinct from imposed social conformity; a statement of one's own identity. Not necessarily a right wing versus left wing but a determination against the oppression of government (and now those who control it). Which is not the electorate (you or me). Maybe he could focus on that rather than this watchmaker thing which I cannot fathom at all...

Oh if you want a good show don't tell number how about Witch hunt. Now there's parallels...

Sheavy wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgAF8Vu8G0w ^ My favorite FZ moment. I agree with him on this, and bet most people here do as well.

Holy crap, thanks for this! Thoroughly enjoyed the watch.

God I love Frank Zappa, probably even more than I love his music.

Sheavy wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgAF8Vu8G0w ^ My favorite FZ moment. I agree with him on this, and bet most people here do as well.

Sheavy wrote: ... There was plenty of very left leaning Prog bands. RPI band Area are notorious for their Communist ideas. Lokomotive Kreuzberg are another good example, and both these bands operated during the 'heyday' of Prog rock.

I dunno, covert or open Fascist sympathies are generally seen as right-wing despite the self-identification of Fascism as the "third position" between market economy and socialism. For the record I consider the left/right/moderate spectrum to be of limited utility, and prefer when people specify actual ideologies.

Back on topic: Correct me if I'm mistaken, but Frank Zappa certainly seems to have popped up in this thread more often than any other person... which I guess does not surprise anyone? And I think he's by far the most deserving candidate as far as classic avant/prog/psych goes, the debate on how to categorize his political views being yet another argument in favour of so.

He's not at all the same kind of "right-wing" as Roman Saenko, David Tibet or the Janus guys though.

I'm pretty sure Zappa's political views didn't fit very easily into the traditional left/right spectrum, or popular ideological categorizations at all for that matter.

I mentioned Current 93 because they are on the archives for some reason. Bizarrely enough there actually was a '70s prog group that espoused far-right ideology, an obscure Italian one named Janus.

WeepingElf wrote: Toaster Mantis wrote: It also pretty much torpedoed Hawkwind's chance at mainstream crossover popularity.Speaking of artists that are on PA despite not being fully prog, what about Current 93's suspected Neo-Nazi loyalties? Their older albums have plenty of lyrical inspiration from the more mystical occult side of Fascist ideology, though with bands like this it's hard to tell where the quest for an ever more transgressive aesthetic ends and actual political agendas begin. Yes, parts of the neofolk and martial industrial scene flirt with fascism.  Some people out there, such as Von Thronstahl's Josef Klumb, are outright fascists beyond denial.  I remember seeing a text calling for boycotting elections in Germany on Von Thronstahl's web site because the mainstream political parties were "controlled by Freemasons" and the (neo-Nazi) NPD was "corrupt".But what do those bands have to do with progressive rock?  Not much at all, if we understand the term "progressive rock" as it has been used for 40-odd years.  It seems that progressive rock is pretty much incompatible with far-right political views, as a progressive mind set is pretty much at the heart of progressive rock.  (Can you imagine a neo-Nazi band that sounds like Yes?  The mere idea seems as silly as a rainbow flag with a swastika on it!)  But there is that second meaning of "progressive rock", the Tool/Keenan stuff, and that kind of music has recently won appeal in the far-right scene.

There was plenty of very left leaning Prog bands. RPI band Area are notorious for their Communist ideas. Lokomotive Kreuzberg are another good example, and both these bands operated during the 'heyday' of Prog rock.