Jazz Music Archives needs some more attention! |
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Saperlipopette!
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 20 2010 Location: Tomorrowland Status: Online Points: 11921 |
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Posted: 6 hours 41 minutes ago at 22:56 |
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Now regardless of Jazz, Prog or whatever human expression, this is a discssuion worth having. In the early 2000's the internet felt like a godsend to me (and many like myself). I suppose I went online searching for some additional music, albums or info about Univers Zero, Samla Mammas Manna or some other band I had just heard for the first time - thanks to a flatmate with eclectic tastes. And man did I fall down one rabbit hole after the other. I stumbled over a whole planet of sounds and "local scenes in every corner of the world" that I had virtually no prior knowledge about. I was part of both the discovery, rediscovery and ressurection of progressive music made in Italy, France, Sweden, Japan, Quebec (I know, Canada), Brazil, Germany etc... And you know what; a huge part of the attraction was that most of the music felt rooted in local musical traditions, but pushing those traditions forward, creating something that was new. New to me, at least. Point being, the internet opened up the world. It really did. We gained something - or rather a lot, but we also lost something. I don't know exactly what. It's like everyone became a professional, a living encyclopedia... and gone was our wide eyed innocense? I'm rambling, I know. And this should probably be a thread on it's own. lastly: Some of my relative disinterest in "modern prog" is that IN GENERAL (and not always), I often feel that there's less distinct (local/regional) identity in the music made post internet era. I even feel there's a recipe for creating "avant-garde". Again, there's always exceptions. Everyone should be free to do what they love, but I can't pretend to be exited about it when I'm not. |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17774 |
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Hi, I have never really thought of it, but at least on the JMA side of things we don't have the number of folks that make a point of posting for the sake of posting and to add to their post count, including their own. Maybe it is that the folks that listen to jazz tend to not be as commercially minded and tend to be quite more independent in their tastes, something that is not exactly an important idea on PA ... with quite a few threads on new this and that ... and no one is interested, which for me is very scary ... on a site that is "progressive" on top of it ... and at least, one of the things in JMA that I see is that the style or type of jazz is not that big a deal, as it seems to be here on PA. This could be just my own perception, and a bit off key ... but it seems that way. I kinda of think of jazz listeners as more serious about their music, than the pop music style on PA ... where everyone posts on the top 5 and almost no one posts on the bottom 5, which I think says it all about the fans and the music itself ... it's not even about the music at all ... it's about the FAN! And I have not seen that on jazz folks as much, and have always had some interesting discussions on a lot of jazz things, although I came into jazz via ECM, and a few lucky listens ... The Koln Concert, and Gismonti's No Caipira. But Brazilian "jazz" was already in my ears based on a couple of famous names, so by the time I heard Gismonti, I was more than ready and got at least 4 or 5 more albums of his and then decided to get more into Garbarek, which I originally bought because of the symphony that was written for him via Keith Jarrett ... and to my ear, Garbarek was much better elsewhere than with Jarrett. The rest of ECM was easy ... picked up Terje Rypdal because of an advertisement on MM for a show in London with AshRaTempel, and the rest is history ... I picked up EOS and then got a bunch of David Darling and continued with Eberhard Weber, and others from ECM ... the main stream "jazz" in America was not forgotten, and while I had not at that time gotten my ears tuned to Miles (for example) hearing some of the things that became the LA jazz scene, all the time, with a show that was before Space Pirate Radio ... which played a lot of "known" things but also had a few nice things occasionally, though I don't think the person that played the stuff has a good ear for new music ... almost all of it was (let's say) heard before by someone else, so to speak. We're talking 1974/5/6 here. I'll probably spend a bit more time on JMA and might add some reviews in there, something that I have not enjoyed doing for PA as the way that the reviews are shown and listed, is somewhat of a "meat market" and at times, really tough on some bands, with folks that obviously do not care for the music ... but if that is the case, what is the point of a review, though many of us will state that we need to be objective and allow the bad reviews ... but the fact is that it hurts the attention and appreciation of a lot of bands, that end up not getting the benefit of being enjoyed by the reviews, although I do not thin that a "good review" can not state that this or that is not the reviewers style or favorite ...
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17774 |
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Hi, I'm guessing that JMA does not have "Admins" or folks that are exclusive to jazz, and is probably using the same folks as PA ... but that's a guess. The process, for JMA, would need to be more centered on the knowledge and understanding of the music, than simply a cookie cutter and idea fitting into something or other, or ... just another growl, so it can be considered "progrock" ... and added to PA. However, this is a guess of mine. I would probably be at JMA a lot more (that would make some folks happy here on PA!!!), if the folks in "charge" were more visible, and less hidden, or possibly non-existent ... but that is not my call ... I would like to see JMA do better, but jazz is not as much about the number one as pop music is, and PA handles it as such, I like to joke as every now and then ... for it to be "music" it needs to be free from its chains and definitions, and that's illegal on PA, so to speak, on top of the fact that it won't get listed on anyone's top this or that. But, I can not say that I am not a "jazz" listener, since I have been there since Miles, and so much of the ECM material ... though I have never exactly been a Blue Note person. Always loved the free form expressions and the additions of more foreign folks to it, as opposed to the factory of the same thing in the prog/progressive top lists. I find it scary that we take an Italian band, and it sounds exactly like 10 others already listed, and they are American or English ... that just shows how local cultures are falling apart, because of the internet that considers one thing great and the rest, just poopoo! You're not likely, I don't think, to find someone trashing music that bad with so many trolls on JMA ... unlike PA.
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17774 |
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Hi, Or the 60,000 comment on Jethro Tull, or Yes. The main difference for me, is that JMA seems to be more interested in the material itself ... here, folks seem more interested in the numbers game and the comments that the fans determine what is art ... whereas in the jazz world, the artists are given a lot more latitude, than the cookie cutter factory on PA proper ... It is possible, that PA has gotten better about this over the years, but seeing the same threads yet again, is a bit weird ... and folks spending more time on 3/4/5 bands than the MUSIC itself ... that in itself is even weirder! Not sure you'll find that on JMA. the hard/harsh side of it, is that PA has a lot of trolls that are commenting on the person and not the music, probably/likely a thought that they do not exactly have listened to the piece. JMA is probably more of something for folks that are more musically attuned, instead of just adding comments for the sake of comments, and to show they are a proven member of the group by the number of postings. I hope, and can not say for sure, that I do not think that JMA would have anything like this around ... at least compared to PA. But, I'm likely to leave here, sooner or later, since the number of folks with serious appreciation for the music itself, has dwindled even more, and after a while, it feels like ... not fun anymore, specially when it's not about the hit, or well known piece, and many folks here do NOT like people that have different opinions and can express them .... to them everyone has to come from the same cookie cutter ... its a very much fan oriented thing, that even disdains the artist for their choices ... something that should not be allowed ... I don't think the artist is beyond criticism, but we have to defend their right to say it ... lest we become like so many of those countries elsewhere where the arts no longer exist, and they spend their time destroying the history of the arts in order to make themselves more visible and important!
Edited by moshkito - December 11 2024 at 09:53 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Matti
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 15 2005 Location: Finland Status: Online Points: 2130 |
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In my most active (and now fading) JMA era from August 2023 to recent times, I reviewed albums there more than here. Probably 90% of them for previously unreviewed artists, which actually was motivating me in the first place. The fact that so much of the JMA artists are still unreviewed is rather sad, isn't it?
Definitely JMA is too inactive. I don't mind about the lack of conversation in the JMA forum, but I've been wondering why the new artists adding process has radically slowed down. That is, new suggestions are piling up. It's frustrating for those making the suggestions (also I am waiting for a few artists to be added, having received jazz CD's to-be-reviewed), and very likely that turns potential reviewers off.
Edited by Matti - December 12 2024 at 23:56 |
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snobb
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 20 2009 Location: Vilnius,LT,EU Status: Offline Points: 3584 |
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I send you the instructions by PM, hope it will help |
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 11 2007 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 10669 |
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Edited by Easy Money - December 10 2024 at 18:38 |
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Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 20958 |
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I go there about once a week to research stuff. Good site, could use more forum chatter
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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Catcher10
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17869 |
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same user name Catcher10
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 11 2007 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 10669 |
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^ I will look into it.
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Catcher10
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17869 |
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So I tried to login to my JMA account and I guess I don't know it anymore, can you or someone reset me so i don't have to re-sign up and lose my profile? Thanks!
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator Prog Folk Joined: April 29 2004 Location: Heart of Europe Status: Offline Points: 20297 |
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I must say that I'm not very active there, anymore. All I've done in recent years is posting my EOY lists. A good forum attendance might've kept fueling my interest. I'm not sure MMA is doing that much better re: forum. I don't even have it in my bookmarks. I still go there to check out discographies, when Discogs has me doubting (as opposed to doing the opposite)
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
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Catcher10
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17869 |
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I need to re-start going there more, I joined it in 2011......need to spend more time there. Prog is boring...
Edited by Catcher10 - December 10 2024 at 17:07 |
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 11 2007 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 10669 |
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https://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=31242&PID=152476&SID=8c39785e7z31z6ae6343e42bcb87b5894907407&title=jazz-albums-for-2024#152476 Edited by Easy Money - December 10 2024 at 14:17 |
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omphaloskepsis
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 19 2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 6444 |
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This again^. I wish there were more reviews and ratings. That's how I narrow down which jazz albums to listen to.
Edited by omphaloskepsis - December 10 2024 at 15:52 |
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siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15267 |
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It's because Rate Your Music has usurped just about every other database as a reliable comprehensive music site with more jazz artists and more ratings than anything even close to JMA. Add to that the PA, MMA and JMA triumvirate are neglected and most of us experience technical glitches just trying to navigate them. If any of these sites survive into the 2030s i'd be shocked. Edited by siLLy puPPy - December 10 2024 at 14:57 |
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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Grumpyprogfan
Forum Senior Member Joined: July 09 2019 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 11808 |
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^It's because there is no interaction of forum members. Great site but a graveyard.
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Steve Wyzard
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 30 2017 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 2662 |
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With all the Holdsworth/McLaughlin/Ponty/ECM fans on this site, it's truly a mystery as to why more of them don't also visit JMA. I've only been able to keep up with the latest releases by visiting on a weekly basis.
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Progishness
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 10 2020 Location: Planet Rhubarb Status: Offline Points: 2565 |
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Ah thank you - I only visit the site from time to time just to keep an eye on some of the quirkier sub-genres, such as Exotica.
Edited by Progishness - December 31 2021 at 12:33 |
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"We're going to need a bigger swear jar."
Chloë Grace Moretz as Mindy McCready aka 'Hit Girl' in Kick-Ass 2 |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17774 |
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Hi, In the past I have posted in there some, in the threads. I'm not sure I have ever done an album review (for example) for that website, although I could easily do 5 Rypdal albums, at least 5 Garbarek albums and at least 10 Gismonti albums, at least 2 Vasconcellos albums, a few Weber albums ... in other words, a lot of ECM stuff, probably the place that I am most comfortable with. Some of the other "famous" jazz labels, are not as strong for me, although it's really hard to not appreciate Coltrane, or so many other folks from the late 50's and then 60's, and of course, Miles. I have a review of the special on Miles Davis and will post it ... as soon as I get it ready (it's on my website). One of the best features in the threads is that there are not many "newbies" that just talk about their favorite band. And it is really nice to actually read from folks that appreciate music, very differently from the pop/rock style of things. I was thinking that no one in there (at least when I was about) ever worried about a top ten, and probably thought it was ridiculous anyway!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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