Forum Home Forum Home > Progressive Music Lounges > Prog Recommendations/Featured albums
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - What double albums should be a single and why?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

What double albums should be a single and why?
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 7>
Author
Message Reverse Sort Order
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
cstack3 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar
VIP Member

Joined: July 20 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ USA
Status: Offline
Points: 7264 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: What double albums should be a single and why?
    Posted: April 07 2021 at 00:02
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway. A load of needless noodling about on that double album. One album of solid stuff.

Well said!  I'm also one of the folks who believes that Tales could have been two, rather than four, sides.  

Back in my college days, I used to play all of TFTO sides one and two consecutively, and then move on to another band like ELP or Genesis.   I never really warmed to "The Ancient," and didn't discover "Ritual" until quite a bit later. 
I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!!
Back to Top
iluvmarillion View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: February 09 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 3242 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iluvmarillion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 06 2021 at 23:06
The truth is the vast majority of double albums should be reduced to a single album. The most obvious to me are Snow and Paradox Hotel. All Spock's Beard and The Flower Kings do is repeat themselves on the second CD. At least Genesis don't repeat themselves on Lamb. They just run out of ideas. I'm one who likes The White Album being a double album. I must be one of the few who likes the experimentations of John Lennon on the second disc. And while I'm likely to change my mind on a weekly basis I'm yet to lose interest in The Astonishing. Fans of Dream Theater would have disliked the album as a single album anyway. It's different. 
Back to Top
AlanB View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member


Joined: January 19 2013
Status: Offline
Points: 1158 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlanB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 12:51
I've not read the whole thread so I don't know if it's been mentioned, but for me The White Album should have been a single album, get rid of the weaker tracks (especially Revolution 9) and any decent songs they didn't have room for could have replaced the filler tracks on Let It Be.
Back to Top
A Crimson Mellotron View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: September 10 2020
Location: Bulgaria
Status: Offline
Points: 4102 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A Crimson Mellotron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 10:47
I thought for a long time that 'The Lamb' should have been a single album because of a strong dislike for many tracks, but I am not sure about this now. I always want to re-listen to it, but I never actually do it! LOL
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Online
Points: 17490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 10:37
Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

...
As pointed on page 2 or 3 of this thread, Johnny Winter's Second Winter  is a three sides album.
...

Hi, 

Didn't see that and am not familiar with that album ... but I think the MP's album is the only "true" three sided album, on 2 sides ... not anything else!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
omphaloskepsis View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 19 2011
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 6339 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote omphaloskepsis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 07:07
Phideaux- Infernal
Yes- Keys to Ascension 2 
Back to Top
Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 16 2019
Location: Nottingham, U.K
Status: Online
Points: 39912 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 04:40
I'm a big fan of Rick Wakeman, but his Rhapsodies double album rhapsodized on a bit too long for my liking. Rick describes the album as "probably the most confusing I have ever made." 
Back to Top
Sean Trane View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Prog Folk

Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20239 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 04:21
Obviously double albums that feature studio and live discs (like Ummagumma, Present or Wheels Of Fire)  should not be brougth up in this conversation, because the OP meant (I think) purely studio or previously unreleased music.

Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

Next topic: what triple albums should be double albums?
 
How many triple albums are there? But even before you wrote this, I was going to mention Godley & Creme - Consequences, a triple album consisting of three sides of music, and three sides of what is largely a comedy by Peter Cook. The problem with comedies is once you've listened to them a few times, they are no longer worth listening to. So, one might consider an album without the comedy part to be better. But in fact for me, it was actually the comedy part that was why I got the album in the first place. So, without the comedy part, I would've missed out on the other three sides of music.


TBH, you could reduce All Things Must Pass, Sandinista and Consequences to a single album (that's hak$
lf a double TongueWink) and you still wouldn't get a very good album >> there is simply too much stuff that seems un-necessary.

Still waiting on Friede and Jean to let us discover their music, whether as BA or MG. I can't even find traces of them in Rate Your Music or Discogs.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
Back to Top
Sean Trane View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Prog Folk

Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20239 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2021 at 04:08
Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

My nomination goes to Van der Graaf Generator's Present album, where Disc 2 consists of a collection of  godawful improvisations. Thumbs Down
 
I actually prefer Disc 2 to Disc 1 because I liked the change in direction. However, ALT was not a success to me.
 
I very much like the track "Manuelle":
 


Yessssss,ClapClap I like VDGG going instrumental (and I like Alt as well). Present's second disc provides me with something The Long Hello albums failed to do: instrumental VDGG, though TLH was without Hammill, while that second disc is with him.

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

We forget the technology of record making.  You couldn't make a three sided album.  
...

Hi,

Absolutely, totally, irretrievably INCORRECT.

Monty Python did it ... and no one else to my knowledge and it was fun to watch the folks at our local station try to play the bit they wanted and they got something else ... it drove them nuts until they figured it out ... at which point, NONE OF THEM ever touched the album again!

It was quite funny, and a wonderful finger up in the sky!


Absolutely, totally, irretrievably INCORRECT.

As pointed on page 2 or 3 of this thread, Johnny Winter's Second Winter  is a three sides album.

Thetre were also plenty of 78 RPM albums with the unused faces finely decorated


Bye Tongue
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
Back to Top
Awesoreno View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 07 2019
Location: Culver City, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3036 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 21:36
Originally posted by Crane Crane wrote:

Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

But the Central Scrutinizer is like the narrator. He's essential to the concept of the album, whispered megaphone and all.

The plot is so thin, the album wouldn’t lose anything by dispensing with any pretense of being a concept album or rock opera.

Maybe in the music department. But I think the way he scrounged out a plot is hilarious. 
Back to Top
Crane View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 08 2011
Location: Rhode Island
Status: Offline
Points: 411 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 20:08
Originally posted by Awesoreno Awesoreno wrote:

But the Central Scrutinizer is like the narrator. He's essential to the concept of the album, whispered megaphone and all.

The plot is so thin, the album wouldn’t lose anything by dispensing with any pretense of being a concept album or rock opera.
“Art is the recognition of the universal presence of God.” —Ernest Hello
Back to Top
Awesoreno View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 07 2019
Location: Culver City, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3036 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 13:24
Originally posted by Crane Crane wrote:

I knew I’d see Sandanista! here and there it was in the very first post. That album for me is perfect the way it is. Part of what makes it so enjoyable is its sprawling adventurousness. Ah, the sheer indulgence of including a song immediately followed by the dub remix of that song. If you want a short Sandanista! you’ve got Combat Rock.

I could reluctantly allow for a few tracks cut from London Calling. Again I’d miss the adventure, but somewhere around the 3rd side it starts to get to be a bit much.

Joe’s Garage is too long, but mainly because of the Central Scrutinizer. All the music is great. If you just removed the CS, what you’re left with would still be, what, 5 sides? I don’t think it’s worth losing any of the music.

But the Central Scrutinizer is like the narrator. He's essential to the concept of the album, whispered megaphone and all.
Back to Top
Gentle and Giant View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 24 2019
Location: Blackpool
Status: Offline
Points: 4365 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gentle and Giant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 12:52
I see mention of a 3-sided album. I've wondered why Steven Wilson's Transience is only pressed on 3 sides, the 4th being etchings of some words. That may look cool on a black album, but on the clear version it looks a bit of a mess. As a compilation album I can't see why he couldn't have used all 4 sides. 

And speaking of Steven Wilson, I wonder too why To the Bone is a 45 rpm album. I didn't know when I first played it - sounded good actually lol.


Edited by Gentle and Giant - March 31 2021 at 12:54
Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen
Back to Top
Crane View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 08 2011
Location: Rhode Island
Status: Offline
Points: 411 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 11:39
As a brief aside, how brilliant is IQ’s ability to write such long albums that don’t feel overlong? I don’t know any other band that works so well with long-format albums.
“Art is the recognition of the universal presence of God.” —Ernest Hello
Back to Top
Crane View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 08 2011
Location: Rhode Island
Status: Offline
Points: 411 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 11:36
I knew I’d see Sandanista! here and there it was in the very first post. That album for me is perfect the way it is. Part of what makes it so enjoyable is its sprawling adventurousness. Ah, the sheer indulgence of including a song immediately followed by the dub remix of that song. If you want a short Sandanista! you’ve got Combat Rock.

I could reluctantly allow for a few tracks cut from London Calling. Again I’d miss the adventure, but somewhere around the 3rd side it starts to get to be a bit much.

Joe’s Garage is too long, but mainly because of the Central Scrutinizer. All the music is great. If you just removed the CS, what you’re left with would still be, what, 5 sides? I don’t think it’s worth losing any of the music.
“Art is the recognition of the universal presence of God.” —Ernest Hello
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Online
Points: 17490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 11:33
Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Thank you ... I'm just totally aghast as to how someone can stand here and tell an artist how, when, they should go to the bathroom, or write anything.
 
Why should the artist have all the say? Why shouldn't the listener have some of the say? After all, the listener is also devoting resources to the music.
 ...
 
Hi,

The listener DID NOT create the music, or the novel, or the painting.

So, you're going to tell Picasso what to do? Some folks tried and he told them to take a hike. Or you can look like a total idiot, like the guy interviewing Gary Green and TELLING HIM what Progressive Music was that GG was not folloing. GG just said ... we never wrote anything ... we just played!

And many folks still don't get it! It is about what the artist sees and feels ... and the listener, or the buyer, has no say on it ... specially when their time comes months and months after the fact that crated it all ... at which point any comment is even more ridiculous, wouldn't you say?


Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

About half of Godley & Creme's Consequences has a strange comedy piece that, well, doesn't really cut the mustard for me, but there's surely one album of great music on it, maybe one album plus a bit (the whole thing originally was 3 LPs).
 
I was going to mention this album. Side 1 and Side 6 together would make an awesome album even though the concept of the album would be ruined. But it was actually the comedy section that attracted me to the album in the first place. However, unlike music, comedy can only be listened to a few times before it gets stale, so it is only the first and last side that maintains interest for me.
 

Hi, I am not sure what G&C felt about all this, and how they allowed it to fly so far ... but PC was known to be a good writer, and his ability to talk, was well known, and his solo albums show a sort of ... let go ... that both you and I would imagine could use a little trimming ... but the strength of a scholar (both him and DM), from one of the world's best, is that not many people can say a whole lot ... and PC would bury you in one small sentence. He did it all the time, and it is all over the comedy albums going back to Beyong the Fringe, when several members of that group became really valuable and important folks in the theater and opera areas in England.

I do think that PC's material should have had an album on its own ... not be a part of G&C, but if you watch Godley's special talking about a lot of the music and the improvisations they did and how so many things came about, he even says that most times many things work, and sometimes they don't ... but I think that G&C could not make up their minds on how to give PC a haircut, and then have him tell them to take it all away!


Edited by moshkito - March 31 2021 at 21:08
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Online
Points: 17490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 11:20
Originally posted by Jaketejas Jaketejas wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Anyway, the two albums imo that should have been a single are TFTO and Lamb. I actually like the wall the way as it is. There might be some padding but not as much as the other two.


Agreed! Editing is a painful process. I realize that one characteristic of Prog, and especially early Prog, can be lengthy songs. Oftentimes, it is justified, especially when there are changing themes or when time is needed to build up to something. But, other times I feel that lengthy songs are due to a lack of good editing. In jazz, extensive pieces are often due to improvisation. However, in Prog, I prefer that there be a real direction.

Hi,

With one hard thought to remember ... almost always ... the "editing" is done by someone else, and it CHANGES the basic/magic pulse of the whole thing, and we end up believing that it was the original ... guess what ... it probably wasn't.

Prog, like Jazz and any other music, does not need a "direction" ... which to me is like saying that Beethoven's Symphonies have a direction, or Tchaikovsky's music has a direction, and one of the main things in the history of music in the 20th Century is how Stravinsky gave the idea of "direction" such a huge flip that it left folks wondering for a long time.

The main issue with "direction" in rock music, FOR ME, is that almost everyone of us THINKS that the lyrics tell a story, and thus, the story can be slightly condensed ... but that is like saying that each of Beethoven's Symphonies does NOT tell a story ... ALBEIT ONE THAT YOU AND I CAN NOT IMAGINE!

One example, was Mahler, who wrote a Symphony for his wife ... and she still left! The perfect PA fan, it could be said ... and in the end, I wonder why all the criticism ... which some folks think it is good ... and for the most part, how can it be "good" when it is so far and away from the point and center of the work, as to distort the reality ... and here we are.

Krautrock, showed really well, in rock music, how a "direction" was not exactly necessary ... never mind that these came out of the "drum/music orgies" and what not ... where a direction is not the point ... THE EXPERIENCE IS. And, really, to feel this, one should be punished with spending time in one of those drum/fun/music things in a few fairs that I have seen ... you learn quickly that it's OK if you can't dance, and it is also OK, if you just flow all over ... but us "progressive" folks are so damn stoic and boring, that we can't do something as "hippy" as that! We have to have lyrics tell us what it is all about, even if the music has absolutely nothing to do with it!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Online
Points: 17490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 11:01
Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

...
But that's totally different, isn't it? The record company is a business that runs by the rules of business. They have to make a living, too. They don't make an artistic assessment, they ask themselves, will we more likely earn or lose money if we sell this as quadruple album. Their assessment that they have an all too good chance of losing money with the quadruple and their chances of earning money are better if they release them one by one may well be correct, even if they admitted that from an artistic point of view you are right. But that's not the game they play. And the game we play here is different still, at least as far as I'm concerned. Even if you got your quadruple released and some people loved it to pieces as it is, what's wrong with somebody else writing "I could well do without half of it" if they just think so? If you as an artist put out your work in public, you've got to live with people saying what they think, even if it doesn't flatter you.

Hi,

Just watched the Muscle Shoals special and what a great treat it was ... and the most disappointing fact? They had Lynard Skynard and the song was over 10 minutes ... and when he tried to peddle it the record company wanted a 3 and a half minute song. The producer balked and told them to go see the band perform live ... and on that day, no one showed up from the record company ... and the producer says, he lost the band.

It doesn't matter if you are a TV network, or a Movie studio, but in America these have owned most of the copyrights and the sales information on a lot of history (the movie companies were the ones that setup the controls for the music, and they went after music later ... with their own film stars! (Tom Dowd).

In the end, this is no different than a novel or a very large painting ... so you gonna tell Goya his painting is worthless because it is huge? You gonna tell a Dostoyevsky that he is full of crap? Or you gonna say to a film maker that The Stalker is a total waste of time and money, not to mention film stock?

There is a moment, when you have to allow for some things ... the interpretation of it is important and has been the "definition" of many of the novels in the history of literature. So, Moby Dick could have been written in 10 pages by some PA person, right?

Be it personal, or not, what any artist does is his/her business and for those that complaint that they don't want to buy the over sized material ... I like to say ... go get something else ... this artist is not for you ... but no ... that "buyer" gets upset ... how ridiculous is that? If it were your own child, would you be upset or proud that he/she finished it and created something rather interesting, if different from your tastes!

Accept that ... it's OK not to like it, but trashing the artist is out of line ... go buy something else ... heck, nowadays you can preview the album at the tube ... so WTF are some folks complaining about?

If your opinion is that strong, go do your own band and work ... and then see if you like the comments ... I bet one wouldn't!


Edited by moshkito - March 31 2021 at 11:02
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Online
Points: 17490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 10:45
Originally posted by Rick1 Rick1 wrote:

We forget the technology of record making.  You couldn't make a three sided album.  
...

Hi,

Absolutely, totally, irretrievably INCORRECT.

Monty Python did it ... and no one else to my knowledge and it was fun to watch the folks at our local station try to play the bit they wanted and they got something else ... it drove them nuts until they figured it out ... at which point, NONE OF THEM ever touched the album again!

It was quite funny, and a wonderful finger up in the sky!

One side of the album had alternating grooves all the way to the end!

Now, just for the thought of the technology involved, that album deserves to be on PA ... as "progressive". Although not in music!

Smile
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
chopper View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20029 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chopper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 31 2021 at 09:05
Originally posted by PhideauxFan PhideauxFan wrote:

All the double albums of The Flower Kings ! in 80 mn, 50 mn of interesting tracks and 30 mn of boring sounds. I think that Roine Stolt should record EPs, but I guess he doesn't know that format exists. Big smile

I'd have to second that. Some of their albums could do with a bit of trimming. Just because you can fit 80 minutes of music onto a CD doesn't mean you should.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 7>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.182 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.