Free Hand - a 1* album - Progressive Rock Music Forum

Author

Message

Topic Search

Topic Options

presdoug

Forum Senior Member

Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8737

Posted: April 02 2013 at 09:27

Freehand is my favorite GG album, i feel it's their very best.

axeman

Forum Senior Member

Joined: March 13 2008
Location: Michigan, US
Status: Offline
Points: 235

Posted: April 02 2013 at 08:47

For me it's not so much about being a maverick or having your own set of tastes or opinions or anything like that. And on my side, it's not about my favorite album being gored (For clarification, it's not my favorite album). It's about understanding what the ratings mean.

If you go on to an album with dozens of 4 and 5 star reviews at mark it "Only for completionists" you invalidate your own post. You demonstrate to everybody else that you cannot understand the scheme of the ratings and would rather play ratings hockey. You just don't understand that this is about other people and not just about you.

If you think that that many people wouldn't like it because you really, really don't, then I can only say that you're really, really not getting the concept.

-John

kenethlevine View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Prog-Folk Team

Joined: December 06 2006
Location: New England
Status: Offline
Points: 9080

Posted: April 02 2013 at 08:28

I would go so far as to say I can't stand GG, but I'd also be hard pressed to give an album of theirs less than (or more than, perhaps) 2 stars

twosteves

Forum Senior Member

Joined: May 01 2007
Location: NYC/Rhinebeck
Status: Offline
Points: 4095

Posted: April 02 2013 at 08:20

Tubes wrote:

@Dayvenkirq I'm supporting your proposition that, "having two-three decent moments on an album.." is not exactly redemption for it's numerous faults. I provided an example in the form of a hypothetical question.

having two or three decent moments---depending on the length of time in those moments---(especially if "we must have waited all our lives for those moments" make it a two star LOL

still want it to be an APril Fools joke, but worst than the over the top hate review of Free Hand which I can accept 100% ---what I can't accept is quoting a Yes West song. LOL

Triceratopsoil View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: April 03 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 18016

Posted: April 02 2013 at 07:48

Dayvenkirq wrote:

^ But why? What use is this spectrum?

Usually they call it "rating manipulation," it works out to "I don't really like this and I think it's rated too high so my review will be accompanied by a 1* rating instead of 2*

Tom Ozric

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926

Posted: April 02 2013 at 05:49

If someone wishes to give a dearly loved album a 1* review, then that is their bad luck - perhaps they don't have the faculties to discern the album's value - or, they just don't like it. Big deal.

BarryGlibb View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: August 28 2010
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Status: Offline
Points: 1781

Posted: April 02 2013 at 05:27

Apparently Tubes is also a friend of Jethro Tull's Warchild...which is great as I too really llke Warchild. See Tubes' post here towards bottom of page.......

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=73958&PN=34

(I couldn't help but giving him an ironic reply to this Warchild post, after just having read his Free Hand review!)

I am looking forward to Tubes' review of Warchild.

Atavachron View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 65606

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:47

Snow Dog wrote:

Tubes wrote:

@Snow Dog, that's fine, but you'll not receive my respect in return for the 'favor'. By the way, you might feel more inclined to restrain your enthusiasm for certain albums, if you would take care of what I'll guess is an unfortunate cocaine problem, SNOW Dog. I can be funny when I want.

Believe me, I do not require or need your respect. Infact with your comment you made here I have nothing but contempt for you and everything you say or write.

Yeah that was a deeply stupid remark; accusing someone of being a drug addict because they say the same things about your opinion you said about an album is puerile; you write a negative review of a loved record and don't be surprised to have your views ridiculed. Par for the course.

BTW, "Snowdog" is a Rush reference. You must know that, yeah?

Bonnek

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 01 2009
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 4521

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:45

It's been a while since I played this but the reviewer made some points I would agree to, as I concluded my own review of this album with "Hardly 2 stars for me.

I have no problem with GG in general, I even like their first 3 albums very much but this one no, not at all.

Edited by Bonnek - April 02 2013 at 04:45

iluvmarillion View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: February 09 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 3247

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:37

Tubes wrote:

@iluvmarillion I've listened to Free Hand in full over two dozen times, and several tracks about four dozen times. At one point I enjoyed some moments, but as I listened again my fondness waned because... this album has no replay value. Free Hand is replete with music that lacks that standard in prog, and all real music, of enduring quality. Whereas I've listened to classic Yes songs like Heart of the Sunrise, Long Distance Runaround, and Yours is No Disgrace thousands of times, with just a handful of periods of having heard them enough for the time being.

Hope that I haven't been misinterpreted because I'm against most forms of censorship and there was nothing in your review that was offensive in any way, or anything that was reportable. I just happen to strongly disagree with you that Free Hand is a one star album. You either like the album, which I view as a piece of art (like a painting, literature, poem, film etc.) or dislike it which is fair enough, as everyone has a different opinion. But to use some objective analysis such as lacking enough time signature changes, to justify criticizing the album, is in my opinion a mistake as you could lay that claim against multiple artists such as Mike Oldfield and Phillip Glass. Maybe just stick to reviewing VGG whom you happen to like and leave the reviews of Gentle Giant to people who love GG (myself included). I just wish you you could see Free Hand as the highly original work I believe it to be, rather than the colourless score you believe it to be.

Aussie-Byrd-Brother View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: October 12 2011
Location: Melb, Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 7951

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:28

Tom, two nights ago I noticed my CD of `Acquring The Taste' and thought `Hmmmm, barely ever listened to that one....', and now several istens later it's like discovering it for the first time!

`Three Friends' is probably the best album for a Giant newbie to get in to....Probably the easiest to get your head around! I think I prefer `Free Hand', `Octopus' and `Acquiring The Taste' to `Friends', but honestly, all damn good! :)

Tom Ozric

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:22

No No No, a little more humanity, please.................

If folks know their Rush, we have By Tor - so why can't we have Snow Dog ??

'Three Friends' is Giant's finest hour for me

Snow Dog

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
Status: Offline
Points: 32995

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:13

Believe me, I do not require or need your respect. Infact with your comment you made here I have nothing but contempt for you and everything you say or write.

kit-kat

Forum Groupie

Joined: March 03 2013
Status: Offline
Points: 58

Posted: April 02 2013 at 04:09

I have not heard Free Hand yet so I can't comment on the album, but I don't think there's anything wrong with the review, there are enough "this is one of the best Gentle Giant albums, absolute masterpiece" type of reviews anyway and he's entitled to share his opinion as long as it's not offensive (and I don't think it is). I've also given low ratings to very popular, acclaimed albums and if I wrote a review on any Mars Volta album, that would probably look much, much worse... LOL

Moogtron III View Drop Down

Prog Reviewer

Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616

Posted: April 02 2013 at 03:51

I think it's refreshing to have a one star review of a record that's very popular among prog fans.

As long as it's written with consideration and after careful examination, that's fine with me.

We don't want group think on the site, do we? And then find out that the emperor has no clothes after all.

Also, we're talking about a non-collaborator/ prog reviewer review here.

Personally I like "Free Hand" BTW.

Aussie-Byrd-Brother View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: October 12 2011
Location: Melb, Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 7951

Posted: April 02 2013 at 03:27

Guys, I expected the worst when I played `Giant For A Day' for the first time, but found it all rather pleasant if totally forgettable and undemanding. There's the odd catchy moment on it here and there!

Then again, I'm always fascinated when a complex prog band experiments with poppy arrangements, sometimes it works well, other times it's a train wreck!

Clearly many feel `Giant For A Day' is the latter!

Tubes

Forum Groupie

Joined: March 28 2013
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 89

Posted: April 02 2013 at 03:18

@Tom Ozric, Giant for a Day deserves negative stars.

Tom Ozric

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926

Posted: April 02 2013 at 03:05

The only 1* album Gentle Giant ever made was 'Giant For A Day'. If some folks here think that GFAD is better than Freehand, then

Dayvenkirq View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: May 25 2011
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 10970

Posted: April 02 2013 at 02:46

^ Well, I think the OP would probably agree with you. This is just a chance to discuss certain details of the review. 1) Offense and impropriety and 2) disagreement are two different stories.

Edited by Dayvenkirq - April 02 2013 at 03:08

octopus-4

Special Collaborator

RIO/Avant/Zeuhl,Neo & Post/Math Teams

Joined: October 31 2006
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 14550

Posted: April 02 2013 at 02:18

Hi all, first of all this is a poll which takes its question from a review appeared on the home page.

This is not a trial versus the review or the reviewer. The qusetion is "Do you agree or not?".

If anybody thinks that the review is improper there's a forum section "report reviews and ratings" which is the place where this kind of thing are discussed.

I disagree with owner of a lonely heart being "poor and related" but I'm sure that there's a lot of people even in this forum who agrees totally with Tubes. I may start a thread asking about that song.

What I think was the big mistake is how the question was put which was presuming the disagreement.

The site rules are clear: if it's a proper review and is not offensive it's ok.

I stand with Roger Waters, I stand with Joan Baez, I stand with Victor Jara, I stand with Woody Guthrie. Music is revolution

Poll Question: Is Free Hand a 1* album?
Poll Choice	Votes	Poll Statistics
Yes	18	[19.15%]
No	76	[80.85%]
This topic is closed, no new votes accepted