Nearfest cancelled

micky wrote: Good prog IMO is a melting pot of various musical styles, not a style itself.

sherrynoland wrote: Good music doesn't happen when the artist is thinking "prog rock", or anything else that says "I'm THIS".  When Yes and Flash and all the others were making music in the 70's, they were just doing what came naturally to them as individual artists and musicians.  They were influenced by, and used, everything they'd ever heard, which was VERY diverse - classical, rock, big band, pop, BEALTLES - ( and that's key for an artist).  Maybe some of today's musicians haven't had enough of that, and have listened to too much 'prog'.

very true, perhaps some bands haven't. Or some just play music that they are 'expected' to play by the audience??  Good prog IMO is a melting pot of various musical styles, not a style itself.  That leads back to one of my favorite soap boxes that I loved to shout from when I was active member here.  The 'genrefication' (© Micky 2006) of prog.  Again Jacob hit the nail on the head. There are two distinct grouping at play here. Fans of the genre and fans of progressive rock (music). Nearfest 2011 illustrated that divide. Good news however there are a lot of groups that made their own diverse sound, a progressive sound not tied to the worn out maxims of 'prog rock'.   A performer that caught our ears last year at Nearfest was Dennis Rhea (Morraine, Iron Kim Style, solo)  whose love and passion for Chinese folk music comes through his music. Great stuff, and funnily enough .. criticized by some as not being prog enough hahaha. 

sherrynoland wrote: A REALLY good band ought to be able to play anywhere - prog, rock, jazz festivals.  When Flash toured, they were paired with all kinds of bands from "Three Dog Night" to Jeff Beck to "Earth, Wind & Fire".  Some pairings worked better than others, but it was healthy to think about going to hear good MUSIC, not a particular sound. Having never played a prog festival before, Flash was curious about Prog Day, and very gratified by their reception.  It was a small crowd, but I was especially happy to see the response of one of the youngest in the crowd (20-something) sitting next to me.  He was on his feet and digging it!!  Let's have more of that... So, I'm all for diversity and thinking in terms of MUSIC festivals rather than a genre.  I maintain that if festivals are to succeed and grow, the artists have to be FIRST-RATE, (no proficient noodlers, please!) and promotion has to be excellent.  Flash was prepared to do a lot more to promote Prog Day, but weren't called upon.  They did one phone interview for a local university station.  With major colleges surrounding the festival, nothing else was done to bring in the college students.  Youth is always part of a vital scene!  They need to hear - and be influenced by - GOOD music.

amen to that Sherry!  My advice (if it was worth taking) would be for bands to not want to play retro fests, but tie themselves to newer groups outside the bounds of prog who are progressive.  Perhaps I'm being too harsh, but I believe that fans of many of today's groups are themselves more open-minded than supporters of the old guard prog rock.  These bands can play together but perhaps not at prog festvals. The evidence is out there for all to see that prog fans won't accept bands outside their views of prog.  Package a good prog/progressive NOT as progressive/prog but simply as good music and let them get their music out to those who simply want to hear good music and have a good time and could care less about some internet jockeys think the group is tagged or labeled.




Edited by micky - April 03 2011 at 08:03

S'actly!

Good music doesn't happen when the artist is thinking "prog rock", or anything else that says "I'm THIS". 

When Yes and Flash and all the others were making music in the 70's, they were just doing what came naturally to them as individual artists and musicians.  They were influenced by, and used, everything they'd ever heard, which was VERY diverse - classical, rock, big band, pop, BEALTLES - ( and that's key for an artist).  Maybe some of today's musicians haven't had enough of that, and have listened to too much 'prog'. 

A REALLY good band ought to be able to play anywhere - prog, rock, jazz festivals.  When Flash toured, they were paired with all kinds of bands from "Three Dog Night" to Jeff Beck to "Earth, Wind & Fire".  Some pairings worked better than others, but it was healthy to think about going to hear good MUSIC, not a particular sound.

Having never played a prog festival before, Flash was curious about Prog Day, and very gratified by their reception.  It was a small crowd, but I was especially happy to see the response of one of the youngest in the crowd (20-something) sitting next to me.  He was on his feet and digging it!!  Let's have more of that...

So, I'm all for diversity and thinking in terms of MUSIC festivals rather than a genre.  I maintain that if festivals are to succeed and grow, the artists have to be FIRST-RATE, (no proficient noodlers, please!) and promotion has to be excellent.  Flash was prepared to do a lot more to promote Prog Day, but weren't called upon.  They did one phone interview for a local university station.  With major colleges surrounding the festival, nothing else was done to bring in the college students.  Youth is always part of a vital scene!  They need to hear - and be influenced by - GOOD music.

Garion81 wrote: Harry Hood wrote: Wait Umphrey's were playing this? They usually draw a huge crowd and have a ton of followers. Ticket sales from their followers alone should have been more then enough. Or was this festival not advertised to the jam band scene? The jam band scene has a ton of people who love prog and don't even know it yet. I'm honestly surprised more artists aren't reaching out to that community. I know a lot of jam band fans who love prog and don't even know it yet. Well they play all over the United States and I am not sure their fans wanted to shell out the money Nearfest charges when they could see them much closer and cheaper.  On top of that there is that prog thing about sitting down in your seats and listening instead of standing up dancing as well as that really stupid rule of no smoking in the theater.

micky wrote: sherrynoland wrote: I appreciate your comments, Micky.  As Tony said, common sense tells you the winning combo is to have a mix of 'old' (name bands) and new.  They blew it. ooohhh.  That is obviously one way to look at it Sherry.  The festival didn't give the core audience what it wanted.  At what point though should the organizers start to ask.  What happens when those classic bands that draw so many aren't around to headline these shows.  (hint.. we got a preview this year) Remembering that these organizers work year round not to simply get their nostalgia freak on but using venues like the NJ Proghouse promoting and nuturing today's prog bands. Umm  possibly TOMORROW's headliners that some seem to thing are a dime a dozen in todays fractured and often un-traditional prog scene.  I met some guy on PE's who thought they should be chosen using 'maximal consensus'.  Huh.. I nearly fell outta my chair when I read that.  Has he spent ANY time on prog sites.  Find me 3 people that agree to a definition of prog rock and I'll wager money that you can find hundreds of people that agree enough on a modern band that they are a) headlining material and b) errr.. prog in the first place   As some have said, there is blame enough to be shared by organizers and the audience.  The audience was under no obligation to support the festival, the artists, or the music that we all claim to love.  I get that but they shouldn't have whined and cried about the cancellation like spoiled kids sent from the table without getting dessert,  To be fair though who says the organizers have any obligation to the audience.  As I said.. it was a complete disconnect between the two.  One is working to promote the music,  and do so with the understanding that these classic headliners are disappearing, the other voted with it's wallet that it has little real interest.  Lip service if you will in the music itself other than as a appetizer to the moldy oldies.  Is either side to blame, is either side without blame.  Who knows.  I for one will be mighty curious to see what Nearfest does if it does try again next year.  Resign itself to what people want, or try to refocus people to what drew them into those groups in the first place. sherrynoland wrote: By the way, when the new Flash CD is released, I think it'll be clear to everyone they're not only a "modern group" -  I expect them to give a much needed boost to the "current prog scene".    In the meantime, you should check out Ray Bennett's solo CD "Whatever Falls" (Voiceprint 2001) - excellent reviews and shows an artist as vital and innovative as his early days with Flash. P.S.  Were you at ProgDay, Micky? Oh we most certainly were at ProgDay.  It was a first for Raff and the 2nd for me.  I love it there and as nice as Nearfest was, there is no better location for a prog festival.  We did really dig Flash's set btw!  I look forward to hearing both of those albums Sherry.  If I can plug my wife.......  she is quite an active prog reviewer and don't think I am being too biased to say her reviews are quite well respected in the community.  If you want some promotional help, talk to her and let her take a crack at those albums.  She is tough, but you won't find you fairer reviewer.

 

gr8dane wrote:   Can't see the NEAR fest lineup anymore. Anyone has a good memory and post it please.

The internet never forgets.

sherrynoland wrote: micky wrote: We did really dig Flash's set btw! That's very cool!  I'm glad.  I did too.  It was a gorgeous day, and a lot of fun.  Ironically, Flash is the only band I got to hear since we arrived just before their set which ended the day, and we had to fly out the next day.  If you'll give me contact info for your wife, I'll pass it along to the band.  We'll let you know when the new CD is ready. I have to say, I knew nothing about prog rock when I met Ray in 1980, and I still don't listen to much.  But I'm a music lover through and through - all kinds of music from classical to jazz to pop and rock - if it's GOOD.  Good, of course, is personal and means so many things, but I know it when I hear it - original, adventurous, touching, skillful.  I haven't heard much new music lately that I like.  The snippets of recent prog that I've encountered, though there are lots of great players, don't go much beyond skillful for me.  I get bored listening.  It hasn't moved me or drawn me in.  Often just seems like 'noodling'.  When I first heard Flash, I liked it right away.  It's got that quality that says something - goes somewhere - and stays with me.  Maybe I'm not alone - maybe that's why prog is fading?  There's not enough of that quality, and too much meaningless razzle-dazzle. I think Flash could have helped NEARfest, and will help prog rock.

You and I seem a lot alike in our tastes. I get bored pretty easy myself hahah.  I just love music, and 'good' prog (ie stuff that connects with me personally) is one of many types of music I love. There are some types of prog that really do nothing for me but it takes all kinds to make a village and for every band that I turn my nose up at, you can bet there are 3 people who love it.   There are some great bands out there today, I hope you find them. They are worth the exposure and the support.  It is sort of why I came out of my self-imposed prog forum exile when this whole Nearfest dealio broke.  I've gotten to meet and know some of the musicians impacted by all this and it is hard to sit on the sidelines I guess.

Check out Raff's reviewing blog at http://progmistress.wordpress.com/  if you like what you see and the band is interested in having her check those albums out let her know!


Edited by micky - April 01 2011 at 06:17

Tony R wrote: If my opinion was in a minority then Nearfest wouldn't have been cancelled!

 

sherrynoland wrote: I appreciate your comments, Micky.  As Tony said, common sense tells you the winning combo is to have a mix of 'old' (name bands) and new.  They blew it.

ooohhh.  That is obviously one way to look at it Sherry.  The festival didn't give the core audience what it wanted.  At what point though should the organizers start to ask.  What happens when those classic bands that draw so many aren't around to headline these shows.  (hint.. we got a preview this year) Remembering that these organizers work year round not to simply get their nostalgia freak on but using venues like the NJ Proghouse promoting and nuturing today's prog bands. Umm  possibly TOMORROW's headliners that some seem to thing are a dime a dozen in todays fractured and often un-traditional prog scene.  I met some guy on PE's who thought they should be chosen using 'maximal consensus'.  Huh.. I nearly fell outta my chair when I read that.  Has he spent ANY time on prog sites.  Find me 3 people that agree to a definition of prog rock and I'll wager money that you can find hundreds of people that agree enough on a modern band that they are a) headlining material and b) errr.. prog in the first place
 
As some have said, there is blame enough to be shared by organizers and the audience.  The audience was under no obligation to support the festival, the artists, or the music that we all claim to love.  I get that but they shouldn't have whined and cried about the cancellation like spoiled kids sent from the table without getting dessert,  To be fair though who says the organizers have any obligation to the audience.  As I said.. it was a complete disconnect between the two.  One is working to promote the music,  and do so with the understanding that these classic headliners are disappearing, the other voted with it's wallet that it has little real interest.  Lip service if you will in the music itself other than as a appetizer to the moldy oldies.  Is either side to blame, is either side without blame.  Who knows.  I for one will be mighty curious to see what Nearfest does if it does try again next year.  Resign itself to what people want, or try to refocus people to what drew them into those groups in the first place.

sherrynoland wrote: By the way, when the new Flash CD is released, I think it'll be clear to everyone they're not only a "modern group" -  I expect them to give a much needed boost to the "current prog scene".    In the meantime, you should check out Ray Bennett's solo CD "Whatever Falls" (Voiceprint 2001) - excellent reviews and shows an artist as vital and innovative as his early days with Flash. P.S.  Were you at ProgDay, Micky?

Oh we most certainly were at ProgDay.  It was a first for Raff and the 2nd for me.  I love it there and as nice as Nearfest was, there is no better location for a prog festival.  We did really dig Flash's set btw!  I look forward to hearing both of those albums Sherry.  If I can plug my wife.......  she is quite an active prog reviewer and don't think I am being too biased to say her reviews are quite well respected in the community.  If you want some promotional help, talk to her and let her take a crack at those albums.  She is tough, but you won't find you fairer reviewer.




Edited by micky - March 31 2011 at 18:23