![]() |
Disappointing follow-up albums |
Post Reply ![]() |
Page <1234 5> |
Author | ||||
moshkito ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 18061 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
HI, No worries there at all. As you well know, I have ALWAYS been on the side of the artist, regardless. Sure, it could be said that one album or other is not as good, but, for me, that's like saying I wanted more of the same as the previous album, and that is something I do not like, or enjo at all ... and that is my only bug about a lot of prog rock being so formulaic, but that is not a comment on the musicianship involved, even though it might seem that way. I still listen to them all ... regardless. Again, for me, Beethoven's 9 Symphonies are all great ... and there is no such thing as one is better than the other, and I look at a lot of rock music exactly the same ... I can put on those disks of classical music and love them dearly ... heck, I have 3 versions of Turandot ... or a couple of versions of Tosca because Gigli's voice in one is out of this world ... There are a lot of things to find in those "lesser" albums, and in general, I tend not to comment on them much.
|
||||
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
||||
![]() |
||||
Logan ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 37188 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
I think this is a very good topic and have no problem with it, in case my comment directed towards Moshkito's post was taken differently. While I don't like to offend artists, and I think a certain level of tact commonly is advisable when talking about the artists themselves, honesty is important. I wouldn't like it if we were all a bunch of fanboys just drooling over the artists' oeuvres. It's normal to prefer some works by artists than others, the artists themselves commonly do, and some of them actually appreciate honest critiques of their works. When it come to negativity, it's the negativity over the perceived negativity of others that most commonly gets me down.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Steve Wyzard ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2017 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 2831 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
One of the very best things about this site is the BRUTAL honesty of the reviewers/posters when it comes to music that is very well outside of the "mainstream" and is in no sense to be thought of as a status symbol. It shows that people really care about this music, to the point of being emotionally invested.
That being said, as the OP I'm a little bit stunned with the comments that this is a "disrespectful/negative" subject to be discussing. All I was thinking when I came up with the original idea was that sometimes the artists we enjoy record/release an album that doesn't live up to our expectations. Even if we take for granted that every album is going to be new and different from previous albums, is it wrong to expect that we will "once again" be pleasantly surprised, based on what they've given us previously? As with any artistic endeavor, there are, of course, no guarantees, and we take for granted that ALL artists will change/grow with the passage of time. If anything, we have it MUCH easier today, because we can sample/stream albums before purchasing them, which would have been unthinkable back when much of this music was originally released. I just do not see how it is somehow "disrespectful/disparaging" to desire a return on our investment of time/money, even if we acknowledge from the beginning that the artists who have given us something we enjoy in the past will not/cannot always do so. Or is the real issue here the DEIFICATION of the artist? Simply because someone creates a work of art does not make them infallible, or somehow a higher-grade of human being who is beyond error and accountability. It's actually rather refreshing to hear a recording artist say in an interview, "We did the best we could, but that album didn't turn out the way I liked." I'm not convinced that saying, "I didn't like Album B as much as Album A that preceded it" is somehow "hurtful" to the artist. Nor does it bring them "down to earth". It's just an acknowledgement that every album is different, and some we like more than others.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Logan ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 37188 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
^ That sounds like a great idea for a topic.
![]() |
||||
![]() |
||||
Jared ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 06 2005 Location: Hereford, UK Status: Offline Points: 20308 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
I must admit, I had been thinking... wouldn't it be good if, rather than (or as well as) a thread on 'Disappointing follow-ups' we had a thread where we could think of bands who may have been on a slow downward curve of mediocrity, then maybe fresh blood or impetus causes them to make a surprisingly strong album, that no-one was expecting?
Just a thought... after the recent debacle on my 'underrated albums' thread, I certainly won't be starting another any time soon, but it might be an idea for some of the positivity Greg alludes to?
|
||||
Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Logan ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 37188 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
I notice many more generally positive threads about music than negative if such threads sadden/ bother you. Of course you are free to share your negative opinions on such things just as others are free to share their opinions. I might suggest, for some, focusing on those, and making one's own, than giving the negative threads more "legs". While I do like the idea of being sensitive to artists, it is to be expected that as a forum of music fans we do have these kinds of frank conversations about what we like, don't like, unexpected joys, disappointments..... Since you brought up Maddy Prior in this poll, Part 3 Female singers, this time of groups/collabs, I thought you might have some enthusiasm about her inclusion in this poll, Pt. 4: Some Female Singers in PA Not Listed Before, that I made yesterday. When I make polls I hope that people will find something appreciative to say about any of the listed artists, but I am happy to hear about others too. I generally do prefer it when people focus on the positive, are more appreciative of artists, topics, posts and other forum members, than those that are disparaging, but for a fuller forum, I would expected a spectrum of perspectives and approaches.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
moshkito ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 18061 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Hi,
I know this is not a popular view, but in many ways, I find this thread really sad ... if you were one of those bands, I doubt you would not stand up for your talent and creativity, but now, in the Internet Age we think the fan is the rule and screw the artist ... and I don't think that is right, and it smacks of disrespect, which is now centered on the enduser/fan's money for purchasing something ... when they could have gotten something else! You can look at Picasso, and in the end, he had over thousands of paintings, or an insane number like that, and of course, some would seem better than the others ... but in the end, the artist went out in a massive blaze of glory for his work, and specially its quantity. We're working on the process to hurt artists, is what it feel like to me ... so Ian's album is not as "great" in our estimation as some stuff he did before, but he's still the same artist, and he's still good, despite his advancing years. About the only one I dislike, is RW, because of his trashing of YES. I find it hypocritical, that he doesn't know music beyond his likes ... and thinks only his scales and composition matters in this world ... and he obviously has never heard any other music other than the English variety for the last 50 years ...
Edited by moshkito - July 30 2024 at 07:53 |
||||
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
||||
![]() |
||||
richardh ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 29402 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Interesting that according to Steve Hackett in a recent interview said that when they recorded it at the Grange , PG was writing the music in an entirely different room. He had already left the band it seemed. This is not anything new probably but it was interesting to hear it said. Does it make any difference? I tend to think of it as almost as being a solo album much like The Wall was the start of Roger Waters solo career and Floyd had become his backing band. Nowadays I like Lamb more than SEBTP but I can't say that about Animals and The Wall.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Awesoreno ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 07 2019 Location: Culver City, CA Status: Offline Points: 3079 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
I think we finally found a topic on which our tastes do not align. Which is not very often, my grumpy friend.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Logan ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 37188 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway is my favourite Genesis album, but to each their own tastes, of course. I find it satisfying all the way through. There are some albums that I clearly think inferior follow-ups, but generally I was expecting that. I'm trying to think of something where I came in and was hoping for more based on loving past albums. *three seconds later* Oh yes, of course, Yes' Close to the Edge. The time is in the latter half of the 1980s, I'm a teenager in high school. My very good friend Rob introduced me to Fragile, and I adored it. Months later he introduced me to Close to the Edge as an even better album and it feel quite flat. I do actually like the first two tracks and it was "Siberian Khatru" that really made me want to replace the tape with Fragile. More recently, I guess I was a little disappointed with Anna von Hausswolff's All Thoughts Fly at first. I was not expecting to like it as much as the three former albums being an instrumental (pipe organ) as i like the more eclectic approach of her earlier albums. Loved Persefone from the get-go. Now I like it much more for what it is. I've always liked the pipe organ, including solo, and the most beautiful concert I have been too was a viola and pipe organ concert in Osaka (the location makes it more sentimental to me).
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Jared ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 06 2005 Location: Hereford, UK Status: Offline Points: 20308 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
As much as I find that thought truly excruciating Will, I'm sure we're not going to fall out over it...
![]() Edited by Jared - July 26 2024 at 14:10 |
||||
Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Grumpyprogfan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 09 2019 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 12382 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
![]() |
||||
![]() |
||||
Grumpyprogfan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 09 2019 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 12382 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Steve Wyzard ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2017 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 2831 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Thanks for your thoughts on Led Zeppelin. I agree that "Achilles Last Stand" is one of the best things the band ever did. It's the rest of Presence ("Hots on for Nowhere" notwithstanding) that merited its inclusion on my original list. And while Physical Graffiti may be my second favorite Led Zep album, I agree that it's not perfect. I always skip over "In My Time of Dying" and "Sick Again" from that one.
|
||||
![]() |
||||
verslibre ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 01 2004 Location: CA Status: Offline Points: 18555 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
The timing of TOTRTYTD is unfortunate. Minstrel makes a wonderful lead-in to the "folk trilogy," but then this album that sounds a few years late pops up. I mean, I like it, but it sounds like it should've been released before WarChild, if that makes any sense. |
||||
![]() |
||||
Jared ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 06 2005 Location: Hereford, UK Status: Offline Points: 20308 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
I often say about double albums, that they would have made more of an impact if they had been edited to a single disk (think: The Flower Kings)... but I can't agree here; the Lamb material holds up all the way through.
|
||||
Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Easy Money ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 11 2007 Location: Memphis Status: Offline Points: 10678 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Deep Purple "Made in Japan" - "Who do We Think We Are"
|
||||
![]() |
||||
Psychedelic Paul ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September 16 2019 Location: Nottingham, U.K Status: Offline Points: 43361 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Totally agree with those two choices. Ideally, The overlong Lamb should have shorn down to a single album. Baa.
🐑 |
||||
![]() |
||||
Grumpyprogfan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 09 2019 Location: Kansas City Status: Offline Points: 12382 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
Genesis - Selling England... / The Lamb...
Jethro Tull - Minstrel... / Too Old |
||||
![]() |
||||
Saperlipopette! ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 20 2010 Location: Tomorrowland Status: Offline Points: 12407 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
|||
|
||||
![]() |
Post Reply ![]() |
Page <1234 5> |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions ![]() You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |