lack of metal knowledge in some reviews

speaking of Petrucci, I heard from a reliable source that he is sort of an idiot savant.....great at guitar but practically retarded otherwise....

I would like to hear more from Myung myself...

avalanchemaster wrote: speaking of Petrucci, I heard from a reliable source that he is sort of an idiot savant.....great at guitar but practically retarded otherwise....

Certif1ed wrote: Pnoom! wrote: It would be worthwhile to clarify that distinction then (as you have just done), since Supper's Ready is still a song in the general sense.   Why would I state "songs" and "compositions" unless I was making some kind of distinction?   I really didn't expect to have to spell it out - I think the problem is not with the lack of metal knowledge, as this thread tries to assert - but the lack of prog knowledge from the other side.   BTW, Supper's Ready is actually a collection of songs, that go together to make movements in a composition. This isn't simply idea following idea, or independently written standard songs tacked together, but a conscious composition with an overarching plan - woven together with spontaneity and thematic play.

Nice ... you have very concisely defined an *epic*.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: Certif1ed wrote: Pnoom! wrote: It would be worthwhile to clarify that distinction then (as you have just done), since Supper's Ready is still a song in the general sense.   Why would I state "songs" and "compositions" unless I was making some kind of distinction?   I really didn't expect to have to spell it out - I think the problem is not with the lack of metal knowledge, as this thread tries to assert - but the lack of prog knowledge from the other side.   BTW, Supper's Ready is actually a collection of songs, that go together to make movements in a composition. This isn't simply idea following idea, or independently written standard songs tacked together, but a conscious composition with an overarching plan - woven together with spontaneity and thematic play. Nice ... you have very concisely defined an *epic*.

avalanchemaster wrote: so far, all fair and good responses.  I see the logic in not eliminating one star reviews...not everyone can have the same opinion, and yes all music deemed good is on Subjective terms, but still at times it seems like people are mudslinging just because they can.....or just because they have not given something a chance???????  Yeah Protest the Hero is not the end all be all of metal, and in fact I have my reservations about them, but they are leagues better what they are getting compared to.  (but there are more examples of this type of one star mudslinging in other bands as well- not just Protest The Hero)..... I am just trying to point out the incongruencies in terms of reviewers, reviewing material they have sampled only slightly from.  Once something becomes "old hat" or one grows used to the style, it is easier to separate the dross from the pinnacle artists, but again that is all subjective.  Like I said, this may be merely neurotic quibbling....

"They are leagues better" is your personal opinion, and you are free to utter it. But other people are just as free to utter their opinion that they are not. Quality is not measurable. If you feel they are getting an unjust deal, write a eulogy on them or give one of their albums a glorious review. There are a lot of prog metal fans in here, and they are quite capable of writing reviews. It is definitely not my favorite genre though, though there are a few exceptions. I usually don't like the way the bass sounds, and I dislike double bass drumming. Again there may be exceptions, but I have heard one only so far. In most of the cases I find the use of double bass drumming artistically not justified. Bass drums are there to stress certain beats; if you stress all you might as well stress none. Double-bass drumming is in my opinion a gimmick, just like the humorous duck quack on keyboards. Overuse a gimmick, and it becomes ridiculous. That's my opinion, and I am a drummer myself. Feel free to differ.

^^^ agreed.

moodyxadi wrote: CCVP wrote:   Besides [prog metal] its the only sub-genre to attract attention to prog since neo prog on the 80's. In fact, i was drawn back to prog because of prog metal. Since my father thinks that prog REALLY died on the 80's (he don't like Marilion, etc) i also thought that for some time, until i discovered it was not dead by prog metal. your father is right. Names and labels can't recreate a whole scenario of space and time. Prog metal is a subgenre of prog rock or from heavy metal? To these ears it is an offspring from the heavy metal nursery. And a not-so-heavy one. My true problem with prog metal is: it doesn't sound metal enough to me. I'm not talking about growling or distortion as automatically putting a song in the metal box. The only prog metal album I appreciate (from time to time, and that's the only one I cared to buy) is Savatage's "The wake of Magellan". Listening to PoS and DT didn't click any light on me. i understand why the young ones can make so obviously immature complaints like questioning DT's position in the "scene" (sic) and PA's popularity system (the ranking). Very few people think in early baroque masters when listening to Bach. but there's a big distinction here: while Bach was a God walking among us, creating music to be listened, studied and admired for any number of generations you could think, I don't know any prog metal album that can beat in any criterium any band from the "second league" of the seventies (I know the memebership on this "league" can float as long as you like the band or not, but let me quote some I have seen mentioned to this group in my years in PA: Gentle Giant, Camel, Caravan, Hatfield & the North, Le Orme, Renaissance, to say the most famous. PS: I believe I'm not an "old" one. Born in the 70's (1974) but grown in the f##king 80's, when only NWOBHM and thrash bands helped me to survive.

Well, i like traditional rock and prog, prog metal, metal and extreme metal. I can find a band that fills what i want to listen or what i want to listen in some moment and just because i don't like some genre or stile i don't go trashing it around.

For example, i find new metal, emocore, punk, etc horrible, but i don't go to specific sites and trash every band there. Besides, your preference for traditional prog exists because of your beliefs; for example, there is a site of a russian guy who writes reviews of many albums, from classic rock to prog. He thinks that the best bands ever where beatles, the who, rolling stones and Bob Dylan (class A artists) and, because of that, he shrinks the importance of prog rock icons to class B, C, or D artists. I am not saying that beatles rolling stones, the who and Dylan suck, i actually like beattles and the who very, VERY much, but i don't think that Yes, Genesis, Renaissance, Jethro Tull, Eloy, among others, deserve being called class B or C artists.

After all, its all a matter of respect: if you don't have enough for yourself, you will not have for others and, because of that, you will need to trash other people to feel good with yourself. I think in this category falls the punks that trash anything, from ratings to public monuments, just to feel a little better about themselves.

crimson87 wrote:  You should win the nobel prize     Please do not mislead me I like "true" metal like Maiden , Priest , Manowar Sabbath Stratovarius Warlock Dragonforce , Sonata Artica Megadeth Saxon or Diamond head. and more.But I cant accept that progmetal is in the same league as clasic prog in terms of innovation.Petrucci solos , I find them quite annoying , self indulgent i mean , give more space to the other mucisians .He should give more space to bass and keyboards improvisations , and use more jazz influences.Probably my main problem is that when I find a truly nice song , comes John "look At me " Petrucci with a riff that is totally out of context.I think the guy should be more humble. and shut up for a while.   My main problem is that these bands are too serious , ELP and Crimson have supreme mucisianship but they also have their fun side.

And here comes the ad hominem bullsh*t that we were talking about all thread long. Good job proving that some people cannot stand differences.


Edited by CCVP - May 09 2008 at 16:17

His reviews are generally a good read, though 

And there is a slight lack of metal knowledge, too.