Did Floyd make the right decision about Barrett?

Barbu wrote: Dean wrote: but when he resorts to facile and fatuous replies that are nothing but memes, images, gifs and stupid videos I will respond with as much sarcasm as I deem necessary.  *sigh* Décroche un peu, Dean.

Barbu wrote: Dean wrote: Barbu wrote: Dean wrote: but when he resorts to facile and fatuous replies that are nothing but memes, images, gifs and stupid videos I will respond with as much sarcasm as I deem necessary.  *sigh* Décroche un peu, Dean. pourquoi? Pourquoi pas? Give him a break, man.

Rednight wrote: Kind of reminds me of that SNL skit about, I think, "Swetty balls." As for "Svetty"-really? Couldn't you come with a more clever nickname that that. I'll tell you what. Try one out on me for practice.

ExittheLemming wrote: SteveG wrote: SteveG wrote: But to be honest, dumbed down acoustic based (mostly) folk rock with whimsical lyrics doesn't strike me as something that would give a seventies (and this is key) pop fna a WTF reaction. It's not as if Syd's singing about a satanic mass with vitriol, but I could be jaded.   ExittheLemming wrote:  Casting the anticipated reaction of our hypothetical 70's pop fan to one side, do you honestly equate Syd's solo output as 'dumbed down folk rock with whimsical lyrics?' I know it's all a matter of subjective taste when all said and done but for me, there is material on both The Madcap Laughs and Barrett that ranks as high as the psychedelic pop masterpieces of See Emily Play, Arnold Layne, The Scarecrow, Bike, Lucifer Sam and Astronomy Domine etc that Syd created within Floyd. Yes, the solo stuff is a bit sloppy, ragged and disjointed but given his fragile mental health that's hardly surprising. Does an unplugged fender telecaster used for his rhythm guitar parts make this material strictly 'acoustic folk' i.e. ain't you guilty of confusing (misheard) texture with style here? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Absolutely not, as this music falls under the dopey (pun intended) Psychedelic Rock sub genre of Acid Folk, which is not predicated on the type of instrumentation used, but on it's musical style. And frankly, there were those few who have done it better, like Pearls Before Swine,  Alexander "Skip" Spence and Michael Chapman with his 1970 album Fully Qualified Survivor.   As ever, I remain the anarchist.   And just for the record, an electric guitar that has unpowered magnetic pickups when it's played, and has to be recorded with a microphone, is in reality an acoustic guitar. There is no electronic amplification of it's sound, so the recorded sound you hear is not amplified sound but acoustic sound. I just don't hear even a sliver of folk vocabulary or its referential materials in the harmonic progressions or melodies that Syd created. To paraphrase Louis Armstrong, if it's folk music related then it is so by virtue of not being sung by a horse. Is there a hyphen in anal retentive? Your oft trumpeted 'last ever post before you return to the recording industry' (from fading memory) has clearly been subject to revision for the foreseeable future?

Ok, let's set some things to rights. First off, Acid Folk is a combination of Psych Rock and Folk Music which makes it Folk Rock, so we are talking about Folk Rock not folk music, so the sliver of folk vocabulary  that you seek has been altered into other musical structures that now incorporate Rock (and Psychedelia) into said mix of Folk Rock. Instead of me busting my gums explaining what Folk Rock is to you, how about if you try to explain why Donovan is not Folk Rock to me. I'm all ears and eyes.

Edited by SteveG - April 15 2015 at 18:16

SteveG wrote: Dean wrote: ^I'm with the rodent on this one... I don't see how Madcap or Barrett (or Opel) are acid folk (aka psych folk) albums. I can't say more than what I've said to Ian. Obviously, a majority of what was said does not relate to you, and I trust you will only zero in on the points that are relevant to your post.

Hell no. I'm just gonna kick back and watch for a change.

Rednight wrote: The Dark Elf wrote: Rednight wrote: Kind of reminds me of that SNL skit about, I think, "Swetty balls." As for "Svetty"-really? Couldn't you come with a more clever nickname that that. I'll tell you what. Try one out on me for practice.   Seriously, Red? I've been calling him "Svetty" for some time now. Like William is "Billy" or Robert is "Bobby". But if you prefer to think of sweaty balls, there is nothing wrong with that from a current societal norm standpoint. Did anyone ever tell you that YOU'RE COOL! As for "current societal norm standpoint," don't strain yourself. Now come on, give it a go! Use that God-endowed wit of yours to grace me with a nickname.

SteveG wrote: Ok, let's set some things to rights. First off, Acid Folk is a combination of Psych Rock and Folk Music which makes it Folk Rock, so we are talking about Folk Rock not folk music, so the sliver of folk vocabulary  that you seek has been altered into other musical structures that now incorporate Rock (and Psychedelia) into said mix of Folk Rock. Instead of me busting my gums explaining what Folk Rock is to you, how about if you try to explain why Donovan is not Folk Rock to me. I'm all ears and eyes.   Secondly. All recorded music has to be electronically amplified at some point in order to be heard unless you are playing a century old phonograph with a needle type diaphragm with a turntable that is spring wound with a crank in order to played. Playing a recording in this manner is not amplification, which means to make louder, but only sound reproduction.   When is an instrument considered to be electric or acoustic if both are amplified (with electrical power) then? Acoustic pianos are sometimes electronically amplified for concerts, so are they still an acoustic instrument?   That would depend on the artist's intention of the type of sound that he's trying to produce. If an acoustic guitar's (a real acoustic guitar and not an "electro-acoustic"  or one with a piezo pickup which alters it's tone and timbre) chords are picked up by a microphone and amplified though a loud speaker, the guitar is considered acoustic because it was the artist's intention that the entire audience should be able to hear his acoustic guitar. The sound is amplified, yes, but the qualities of the acoustic guitar sound have not been altered by amplification, only made louder.   An electric guitar is no longer intended to sound like an acoustic guitar, so it's amplification is almost academic to it's purpose, in a weird way, but electronically amplified it is, and distorted is it's sound, as it's intrinsic to a electric guitar's magnetic pick up design along with it's solid body design to help stifle feedback. It may have been invented to just sound like a louder acoustic guitar at first, but that's not what occurred.   So it was the artist's intention to sound electronically amplified while playing his electric guitar with all it's built in distortion, buzzing and overloaded sound, and not just louder. Again, the key word is intention.   What Barrett's intention of sound  was when he playing an "unplugged" Telecaster I will leave up to you.   Third, for all your talk of anal retentiveness, I at no time corrected you and informed you that Barrett's Telecaster was only partially amplified on most track's left channel, at a low volume with no distortion, while a stationary microphone was placed near the guitar's pick ups to record the percussive strums of his pick against the guitar strings that was recorded and featured on the album's right channel, along with Syd's vocal's which were cut live during the takes for all of the songs that were not produced by David Gilmour and/or Roger Waters on the album The Madcap Laughs. On those songs produced by Gilmour or Gilmour/Waters, Syd plays a real acoustic guitar as that was probably Gilmour's desire, as I can't envision Gilmour going along with something so half baked.   And what good would that bit of ego tripping have benefitted this conversation? Did you forget my background? I do not and I don't need to remind myself of my abilities to distinguish or identify recorded musical sounds.   And fourth, but not least, on my leaving PA. I still have conversations with PA members that requires me to have a quick look at posted topics in order to understand what the PA member is talking about. So I throw a quick comment in. If you really feel that you can't handle even a brief hit and run conversation with me, then that's no problem. I will be happy to let you off the hook and just keep to myself. Just say the word.   I hope this answered all your inquiries as well as a few that you didn't consider.

Why the breast beating hyperbole of 'setting things to rights?' (as if the views of two sad old men locked in a keystroke battle will even make a crease on posterity's roomy pillow) Why am I being asked to convince anyone what category of music I consider Donovan to be a best fit? The latter is completely irrelevant to my belief that Syd Barrett is not folk rock. I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong (but vice versa sadly doesn't seem to be reciprocated here) I don't care what conventional wisdom dictates should be the box you want to shoe-horn anyone into (how about 'Scotland's token hippy charlatan' if you want me to nail my colours to the mast?)

You are keenly aware that I think your response to the 'unplugged Telecaster/acoustic guitar' issue to be pedantic. Your subsequent response merely reinforces that view.

I don't give a flying f.u.c.k. about your background. I've also got ears (and a tiny brain to boot), have never, do not and never will work in the music industry and am not Welsh: so I'm probably overqualified to listen to music

You've stated on a couple of occasions previously (no, I'm not going to produce the quotes, you're anal enough to dig them out) that 'this was your last post' usually after being routinely annihilated by Dean (whose not even trying) It doesn't put me up or down whether you decide to stay or not but how seriously do you honestly think people will take your utterances if you continue to resort to the last refuge of the outwitted? (threatening to run away in the hope someone gauche enough will persuade you otherwise)

Looks like a real talliker a brewin'!

I don't really like the Barrett-era, and i'm a huge fan of the Waters-era, so I think that it's a good decision