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Spiderprog View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: System of a Down
    Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:12
I'm wondering why the new System of a Down albums Hypnotize and Mezmerize were not reviewed in Progarchives.

These albums are very prog in nature with advanced compositions and structures.

Any thoughts?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:22
Originally posted by Spiderprog Spiderprog wrote:

I'm wondering why the new System of a Down albums Hypnotize and Mezmerize were not reviewed in Progarchives.
Because they're not prog?
 
This has been brought up many times, and it has been decided that SOAD are most definately not prog, and they will never be on here.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:29
Originally posted by Ghandi 2 Ghandi 2 wrote:


Because they're not prog?


    
That would be my guess too.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:42

I agree that the rest of their albums are not Prog but Mezmerize and Hypnotize are different.Would they be listed here if they were Cambodian and their albums were hard to find?

Come to think of it, Cambodian Prog could be interesting…

Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:49
Unfortunately the majority of a band's output must be prog for them to be included - 2 albums are not enough if "the rest of their albums are not prog".
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 11:50
Those albums are nearly enough to get SoaD in as Prog Related, but not as prog. Wink


Besides, this topic ought to be in the Non Prog Music section. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 12:10
They're doing the same thing they've been doing. The only reason they're calling it prog now is because nu-metal is out of style and they need anohter name for what they do that is marketable, and prog was the closest they could find.
 
Some bits remind me of Frank Zappa, but they still aren't prog.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 12:50
That does not make sense to me. What if a band has ten albums that are non-prog and then has an amazing album out? I'm a little surprised by the reactions. This site should promote progressive music and not build walls around it. If a band is going out there and is experimenting with something new it should be encouraged and not snubbed out. They should be included in prog-related. They are no less prog than Primus.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 13:34
To strengthen my point here is a quote from the Wikipedia article about Progressive Rock:

Meanwhile, other heavy metal bands not generally considered prog-metal, such as System of a Down have nevertheless incorporated prog-influenced elements like bizarre shifts in time signatures and tempo in their music.

I strongly beleive they should be included here as Prog-related.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 20:59
Originally posted by Spiderprog Spiderprog wrote:

I strongly beleive they should be included here as Prog-related.

I strongly agree with you, on basis of what I have heard by SoaD, but I fear their inclusion isn't going to happen as long as we have old-fashioned progheads in charge. SoaD may not be Prog as in the Progressive Rock movement of the early seventies, but they're definitely progressive and innovative.


Edited by Philéas - July 22 2006 at 21:00
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 21:29
SoaD may be different, but it's not hard to be in the music world of today. I think they're just not different enough to be called Prog. Odd time signatures do not constitute as enough to get the privillige. Primus ARE more progressive than SoaD because their sound is entirely their own, including the format of bass playing, as well as the fact that the lead and rhythym concepts of guitar and bass have been swapped. Yet that doesn't mean Primus is a prog band either. SoaD has less prog cred than Primus do, thus they cannot be prog.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2006 at 22:19
SoaD aren't reviewed here because they AREN'T PROG.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2006 at 00:03

Here is what Piero Scaruffi has to say about Mezmerize:


Mezmerize (Columbia, 2005), the first half of a diptych, is both an extremely complex and an extremely violent experience. Basically, it is progressive-rock played by a hardcore punk band in a way to resemble the frenzy of a million post-industrial monsters. Ultimately, it is a rare example of brainy fury. B.Y.O.B. (for "bring your own bombs"), an angry anthem worthy of classic Dead Kennedys, and Cigaro, a close second, evoke the spirit of the late 1970s; but the acceleration and deceleration of Revenga shows artful presentation behind the sonic attack, and a post-Guns N' Roses power-ballad such as Lost In Hollywood or the sardonic musichall-in-hell skit This Cocaine Makes Me Feel Like I'm On This Song prove a perverted sense of how to destabilize the world of heavy-metal.

The second installment, Hypnotize (2005), is inferior, and can't help sounding like a bunch of leftovers, although even leftovers are worth listening to when they are leftovers from good albums (see Attack and Lonely Day).

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2006 at 05:10
Who is Piero Scaruffi? And what makes their opinion valid enough that they gain a spot on the prog archives?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2006 at 18:55

Yeah they shift tempo alot, but I'd hardly call their songwriting complex. It's really quite simple. System Of A Down sound like a million other rock bands; they have no place here even as related.

"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2006 at 19:20
Piero Scaruffi has been writing about popular, avantgarde and classical music for about 30 years, including six books on Rock Music, one on Avantgarde Music and one on New-Age and Electronic Music. He has published articles on dozens of magazines, both in Europe and in the USA. His most recent book on music is "A History Of Rock Music 1951-2000" (2003). Piero was a pioneer of Internet journalism, creating an online database and an electronic magazine as far back as 1983. These eventually evolved into his website www.scaruffi.com, possibly the first website to be named after a rock critic. This website is now one of the oldest, largest and most visited websites on popular and avantgarde music.
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reality View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 26 2006 at 00:35
 Truly, half the bands on this site are not really prog but who would come to this site if they were not here. It is not if a band is prog anymore its that you like this site and would like to see your favorite band on it. I would like to see this site have some integrety and clear out the bands that have the label slapped on them (though we may love them for the same reasons why they are here now) and focus on the "true prog bands" from the progressive rock movement and those directly related to them. 

Edited by reality - July 26 2006 at 00:37
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 26 2006 at 11:28
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

Unfortunately the majority of a band's output must be prog for them to be included - 2 albums are not enough if "the rest of their albums are not prog".
 
let me be sceptic about this... how many Deep Purple albums are prog?
but I agree that SOAD don't fit here, but that's not the reason for me, they are just not prog
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 26 2006 at 11:30
Dead



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chopper View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 26 2006 at 11:50
Originally posted by aapatsos aapatsos wrote:

Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

Unfortunately the majority of a band's output must be prog for them to be included - 2 albums are not enough if "the rest of their albums are not prog".
 
let me be sceptic about this... how many Deep Purple albums are prog?
but I agree that SOAD don't fit here, but that's not the reason for me, they are just not prog
Very few Deep Purple albums are prog, that's why they're in proto-prog.
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